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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Dec 26, 2022 15:19:16 GMT -8
Kelvin Sampson, WSU to Oklahoma
Mike Montgomery, Stanford to the NBA
Jerry Green, Oregon to Tennessee
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 26, 2022 15:39:03 GMT -8
Ernie Kent was fired from Oregon and subsequently got a bigger salary at Wazzu.
Jeff Bzdelik quit Colorado to coach at Wake Forest.
Jim Boylen was fired from Utah and subsequently coached the Chicago Bulls and Team USA.
Ben Howland coached at UCLA and was fired for playing "boring" basketball. He subsequently got a bigger contract to coach at Mississippi State.
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Post by speakthetruth on Dec 26, 2022 15:48:17 GMT -8
I wasn't looking for fired coaches. I also don't think Xavier and Mississippi state are a step up from Arizona or ucla. Most people wouldn't think so either.
And Ernie Kent got paid more? So what it was 4 years later from oregon to wazoo. I'd expect the salary would go up.
And Sampson to Oklahoma was 28 years ago. I asked for the last 20. But whatever.
My point is and seems responses prove it not much move upward from a pac12 head coaching position.
Lots of careers have been killed in the pac12 not just osu.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Dec 26, 2022 16:53:06 GMT -8
Ernie Kent did significantly worse at WSU than at Oregon, in fact significantly worse at WSU than Tinkle has done here.
I remember people freaking out when WSU hired Kent because he was "going to turn their program around" and leave us in the dust.
That in itself is at least some evidence that a reasonably decent coach at a school that supports its basketball program can become a "bad" coach at a school that doesn't support its basketball program. Our level of support is quite similar to, maybe even a bit less, than WSU's the last few decades.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 26, 2022 20:42:48 GMT -8
I wasn't looking for fired coaches. I also don't think Xavier and Mississippi state are a step up from Arizona or ucla. Most people wouldn't think so either. And Ernie Kent got paid more? So what it was 4 years later from oregon to wazoo. I'd expect the salary would go up. And Sampson to Oklahoma was 28 years ago. I asked for the last 20. But whatever. My point is and seems responses prove it not much move upward from a pac12 head coaching position. Lots of careers have been killed in the pac12 not just osu. I believe that the only coach not mentioned so far was Trent Johnson, who went from Stanford to LSU. Your final point is a good one. The Pac-12 has historically had a ton of RPI-based disadvantages. As the NET is used more and more, hopefully, those disadvantages disappear. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 26, 2022 21:35:46 GMT -8
Numbers are all pulled from the excel file listed before. These were covid year numbers so they may be low depending on how many games a team played. 1) Creighton - Cool you binned the results of a single season and you got it wrong, they are 8-6. Since 2014 when Tinkle started they have 14, 20, 25, 21, 20, 24, 22 and 23 wins. Per the posted excel sheet in this chat their budget is $7 million so 2 million more than us. 2) I noted that Butler has had some bad spans. Considering they are right above us in funding their wins since WT are 14,10,22,16,21,25,22,23. If you go back to 2012 they were ending a 8 season span of 20 win seasons including a 28, 33,30 and 29. Considering they are essential equal in funding per that sheet I think any beaver fan would prefer their losing seasons. Specially since they are 10 and 14 in down years not 3 and 5... $5 million funding, 60k above us. 3) So you are saying Corvallis sucks so we can't win. Same dumb argument people make in football. Corvallis is a good place to go to school and if you build the program you attract talent. San Diego spends 4.25 million on basketball and we spend just under 5 million. So they spend way less yet have better recruiting, coaching and their worse season since 2005 is 19-14. It took Fisher 6 seasons to break through and he retired after 2017 19 win season. Brian Dutcher took over and has kept it rolling including a 30-2 year when covid struck. 4) Is this another one of your flawless argument traps for someone else to debunk? Genius. Xavier is 19, 19, 13 (only played 21), 23 since Chris Mack retired and is 10-3 this year under their new coach. Before that they went 5 straight seasons with 20+ wins and 5 straight trips to the dance. Their last losing season was 1995 at 13*-15...then their next one was 1988. Xavier like Crieghton has a budget of 7 million. In fact on that list they are 57 and 56. That is 2 million more than us. Again you are pulling numbers from all over the place. Use the list that was posted before if you want to be consistent. 5) UConn has a budget of 7.5 million. Thats 2.5 million more than ours not oil baron money at all. They are 13-0 so far on this season and have gone 23, 15 (23 games played), 19, 16, 14, 16, 25, 20 since WT took over. Thats 3 losing seasons of 16, 14, and 16 games. Think I would take those over 3 and 5...Id also take the national championship in 2013 and 2010 that they have. They do have the biggest budget of the teams I listed. 6) Ah good, classic they are better than us so its impossible. Well jeezers its impossible for us to get a good coach in Corvallis. They were crap until 1993 and then alright until Bo Ryan took them to the next level. Before that its about 60 seasons of crap, 20 seasons of alright and 5 really nice years. with a 6.2 million budget and a 1.2 million difference the level of success they have has is massive in comparison. 7) whatever 8) Thats just lazy as hell. Make good arguments in the first place and stop wasting everyones time reading impressively worded dribble. 1. Creighton lost six straight and started 6-6. The Blue Jays then won to go to 7-6 and then won again to go to 8-6. They were both 6-6, same as Oregon State, and 7-6, same as Oregon State. They are now 8-6 with an extra conference game. Creighton and Oregon State have the same non-conference record, however. After Oregon State beats Oregon, they will still be tied with Creighton. My apologies, if this is too hard to follow.
2. Butler just moved up two classes of conference in the past decade. Butler just committed to making a huge infusion of cash to try and stay relevant in the Big East, because they can quite clearly see that the trend is not their friend. Talking about what they have been doing against inferior competition years ago is irrelevant to the point. Butler has acknowledged that they cannot win in the Big East even with the more money that they have been spending than Oregon State.
3. Lol! Yes, I know a bunch of 17- and 18-year-olds are clamoring to move to Corvallis over San Diego. I wonder how the Aztecs do it. It's a complete and utter mystery.
Also, I love the guy, but please remind me the last time that Smitty or GAG or Riley led Oregon State to a top eight finish. Top eight finishes in the past 50 years in football? One. Tied with Tinkle. Ralph Miller's all-time top eight finishes? One, which was subsequently vacated. Tied with Tinkle.
Also also, Tinkle did not have a 20+ win season until year 10. And we hung strong with Miller and were better for it.
4. Xavier's announced budget from 2020-21 (the COVID-19 year without crowds) does not match the current budget. You are using data from at least two seasons ago. Xavier has greatly increased their budget since then, but the numbers will not be out until at least 2024.
5.
This applies to your other points, but I will put it here. 80% of the people in the United States live East of the line, and 20% live West. So, you're telling me that it is much cheaper to recruit better talent to Connecticut? Unreal! Looking at Connecticut's win over Georgetown, 9 of 10 players (all five starters and four subs) who played for Connecticut went to school within 509 miles of Storrs. In Oregon State's win over Denver, 3 of 10 players (one starter and two subs) who played for Oregon State went to school within 509 miles of Corvallis. It is much easier and cheaper to recruit East of the line than West. You continue to try and compare apples to oranges.
6. Wisconsin is surviving on a legacy budget, because of years of sustained success. If Wisconsin's coach leaves, and they have to hire from outside of the program, they will have to increase their budget to match the same level of success.
8. Respectfully, I feel like you don't know what you're talking about. Oregon State has a 2021 Pac-12 Championship banner up, because they won a Pac-12 Championship. They were the #1 team in the Pac-12. They went to the Tournament and finished in the top eight. You can argue that they did not win the Pac-12 Championship and that the Elite Eight run was bubkis as well, but it is an inferior argument IMO. Oregon State was the #1 team in the Pac-12 and proved it in the NCAA Tournament. You can then make other arguments and create all the asterisks in the world. It's a valid argument. I just disagree. |
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Post by nuclearbeaver on Dec 26, 2022 21:48:42 GMT -8
Okay Wilky. By ignoring everything you have proven that Oregon State sucks at basketball and always will. I'll send you some slow claps in the mail.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 26, 2022 21:59:06 GMT -8
Okay Wilky. By ignoring everything you have proven that Oregon State sucks at basketball and always will. I'll send you some slow claps in the mail. Over the past 30 years, Oregon State has sucked at basketball. But the Beavers can be great again, if we are patient. If we go all Johnny half-cocked and start firing away, when it is unnecessary, the trend line will reassert itself, and Oregon State will suck again year-after-year-after-year, instead of having 3-4 good years mixed in with a stinker or two. |
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Post by beaver55to7 on Dec 27, 2022 7:22:01 GMT -8
I read the first couple pages then skipped ahead, can someone tell me who won? TIA
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Post by nuclearbeaver on Dec 27, 2022 7:33:18 GMT -8
I read the first couple pages then skipped ahead, can someone tell me who won? TIA No one wins once the lawyers get involved. The reality is Wayne costs too much to replace with an 11+ million buyout that drops by about 3 million a year for 3 more seasons after this year. So since we're stuck increase the budget and see what he can do or atleast recruit talent for the next guy. |
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Post by beaverology on Dec 27, 2022 7:42:34 GMT -8
"The Next Guy"
I'm guessing that's gonna be somebody like UP coach Shantay Legans? Sure, the next Ritchie McKay. Why not? It fits the script.
There's a good chance he wouldn't take the job for reasons outlined previously.
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Post by nuclearbeaver on Dec 27, 2022 7:45:51 GMT -8
"The Next Guy" I'm guessing that's gonna be somebody like UP coach Shantay Legans? Sure, the next Ritchie McKay. Why not? It fits the script. There's a good chance he wouldn't take the job for reasons outlined previously. Gonna be atleast 4 seasons unless WT steps away. No point compiling a list. |
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Post by beaverology on Dec 27, 2022 7:50:28 GMT -8
You think WT should do the honorable thing and pull a Gary Andersen 2.0?
Quit midseason and leave the $12M for the next coach? ha ha
That's not happening with the team of youngsters he has. Be patient.
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Post by nuclearbeaver on Dec 27, 2022 7:56:57 GMT -8
You think WT should do the honorable thing and pull a Gary Andersen 2.0? Quit midseason and leave the $12M for the next coach? ha ha That's not happening with the team of youngsters he has. Be patient. If he was going to leave it would have been last year. Wayne train keeps clunking down the tracks. |
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Post by babeav on Dec 27, 2022 8:31:53 GMT -8
However this year plays out OSU needs this group to stay together. Friends of mine accompanied the team to Italy and they have said that this group really likes each other (unlike last years crew), important to continuity. Tough week ahead with 3 road games, let’s get some wins outside of Gill.
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