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Post by 02beav on Sept 1, 2023 22:33:09 GMT -8
What happens if the Beavs and Cougs just stay as the PAC 2 for a couple of years while the MWC TV deal expires and then they take what they want and rebuild the PAC with the best mwc and AAC or whoever else they can get? What's the downside besides having to schedule essentially as an independent?
Keep all of the PAC's resources and money supposedly available.
To me, that seems like a better long term plan than joining the MWC.
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Sept 1, 2023 22:35:31 GMT -8
I'm not sure but I think there is a limit to the minimum number of teams to be a conference.
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Post by 02beav on Sept 1, 2023 22:37:43 GMT -8
Yeah, they need 8 teams at least but there is a two year grace period I believe.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Sept 1, 2023 23:07:57 GMT -8
Biggest issue is we would need 9 games each year on short notice.
Most decent teams are scheduled out with OOC games the next 2 years or longer. We would have to probably buy out a lot of contracts and figure out a way to get an actual 9 games during the weeks most teams are generally playing conference games. We'd literally have to find 9 teams willing to take their bye weeks in the first weeks of the season to play us later in the season.
Not to mention we'd probably have to play a lot of away games. Most teams are home heavy on their OOC schedules and I doubt they'll want to give that up.
I don't see it happening.
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Post by Dave86 on Sept 1, 2023 23:20:05 GMT -8
What happens if the Beavs and Cougs just stay as the PAC 2 for a couple of years while the MWC TV deal expires and then they take what they want and rebuild the PAC with the best mwc and AAC or whoever else they can get? What's the downside besides having to schedule essentially as an independent? Keep all of the PAC's resources and money supposedly available. To me, that seems like a better long term plan than joining the MWC. 02beav - Well done. What you wrote is exactly what I spent this entire evening thinking about. The timeline is like this: 2023-2024 school year - last season for PAC-12 Summer of 2024 - 10 teams leave the PAC-12, so the 2 year clock for rebuilding the PAC-2 begins. Beavers and Cougars have 2 years to get the number of schools back up to the NCAA minimum (6 or 8) 2024-2025 school year - Beavers & Cougars are the PAC-2, eating into PAC-2 funds if necessary to stay alive 2025-2026 school year - Beavers & Cougars are the PAC-2, eating into PAC-2 funds if necessary to stay alive Summer of 2026 - The big summer!!! Two things happen here: * The 2 year clock for rebuilding the PAC-2 conference into the minimum number of required teams is due to expire * Mountain West schools' TV contract expires. So, does that mean Mountain West schools are free to leave that conference without paying an exit fee? In this morning's presser, Beaver Athletic Director Scott Barnes said there were discussions taking place that he can't tell us about at this time. Think maybe this is it? I, too, am opposed to joining the MWC (or AAC), a subject for another post. |
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Post by Dave86 on Sept 1, 2023 23:48:52 GMT -8
Biggest issue is we would need 9 games each year on short notice. Most decent teams are scheduled out with OOC games the next 2 years or longer. We would have to probably buy out a lot of contracts and figure out a way to get an actual 9 games during the weeks most teams are generally playing conference games. We'd literally have to find 9 teams willing to take their bye weeks in the first weeks of the season to play us later in the season. Not to mention we'd probably have to play a lot of away games. Most teams are home heavy on their OOC schedules and I doubt they'll want to give that up. I don't see it happening. Drunkandstoopidbeav - I've been snooping this board for some time and generally I agree with your posts. However, this one I don't agree with. I'm not ready to concede that we can't find football opponents for the 2024 & 2025 seasons until we actually try to do that and fail. Here's where I think we can find some games: * Work with the very Mountain West schools we plan to invite into the PAC-X to see if we can't get them to adjust their schedules to add us. Suppose Boise State drops North Texas (non-MWC) to play us, maybe we can play North Texas for Boise State, giving us 2 games (BSU & NT)? * Keep the Civil War game with the Ducks * Play more than one 1AA team at Reser (1AA = Portland State, UC Davis, Sac State, Eastern WA, etc.) per season. I know we can count only one 1 win over a 1AA school for bowl eligibility, but we're in a mess right now, so we'll play more than one 1AA team per season in 2024 & 2025 to get to a 12 game schedule. Let's get creative and try to find a way to get by for a couple of years. I really appreciate Oregon State's leadership for trying to somehow rebuild the PAC-12. |
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Post by jayvinson on Sept 2, 2023 6:44:43 GMT -8
Beavers and Cougars could play each other twice for a couple years. It's been done before.
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Post by bvrbred on Sept 2, 2023 7:00:05 GMT -8
A couple questions:
Its my understanding MWC's departure penalty is waived if two year's notice is given, correct? That means, if we are going the two year stall route, that they need to give notice right away--they can't wait two years to see how things go with the Pac2 to make up their minds.
The MWC TV conract is also two years to run. But the TV contract and the departure penalty are separate and unrelated, correct? So the importance of the TV contract beng up in two years would only come into play if the Pac2 were to try to work some kind of merger with the MWC, correct? So if there is no merger between the leagues then whatever happens with the renewed MWC TV conract is important only insofar as it becomes competition for whatever TV deal we try to do?
I also have a thought. If joining the MWC on its standard terms were acceptable to Barnes he could have done it as soon as the Pac12 TV deal fell apart. It wouldn't be necessary for him to work the phones day and night for two weeks.
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Post by p8nted on Sept 2, 2023 7:07:39 GMT -8
A couple questions: Its my understanding MWC's departure penalty is waived if two year's notice is given, correct? That means, if we are going the two year stall route, that they need to give notice right away--they can't wait two years to see how things go with the Pac2 to make up their minds. The MWC TV conract is also two years to run. But the TV contract and the departure penalty are separate and unrelated, correct? So the importance of the TV contract beng up in two years would only come into play if the Pac2 were to try to work some kind of merger with the MWC, correct? So if there is no merger between the leagues then whatever happens with the renewed MWC TV conract is important only insofar as it becomes competition for whatever TV deal we try to do? I also have a thought. If joining the MWC on its standard terms were acceptable to Barnes he could have done it as soon as the Pac12 TV deal fell apart. It wouldn't be necessary for him to work the phones day and night for two weeks. Incorrect on the exit fees. The MWC has an exit fee in its bylaws. It is not gone ever. With one years notice it is $17million. With less than one years notice it is $34 million. The amount is tied to the conference revenue so it is adjusted up or down a bit based on that number. There is a ton of legal work to do if two conferences merge an AD will be in the middle of that contract. OSU has to try and keep the PAC 12 assets in any deal with the MWC in whatever form it takes. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Sept 2, 2023 7:10:26 GMT -8
Biggest issue is we would need 9 games each year on short notice. Most decent teams are scheduled out with OOC games the next 2 years or longer. We would have to probably buy out a lot of contracts and figure out a way to get an actual 9 games during the weeks most teams are generally playing conference games. We'd literally have to find 9 teams willing to take their bye weeks in the first weeks of the season to play us later in the season. Not to mention we'd probably have to play a lot of away games. Most teams are home heavy on their OOC schedules and I doubt they'll want to give that up. I don't see it happening. Drunkandstoopidbeav - I've been snooping this board for some time and generally I agree with your posts. However, this one I don't agree with. I'm not ready to concede that we can't find football opponents for the 2024 & 2025 seasons until we actually try to do that and fail. Here's where I think we can find some games: * Work with the very Mountain West schools we plan to invite into the PAC-X to see if we can't get them to adjust their schedules to add us. Suppose Boise State drops North Texas (non-MWC) to play us, maybe we can play North Texas for Boise State, giving us 2 games (BSU & NT)? * Keep the Civil War game with the Ducks * Play more than one 1AA team at Reser (1AA = Portland State, UC Davis, Sac State, Eastern WA, etc.) per season. I know we can count only one 1 win over a 1AA school for bowl eligibility, but we're in a mess right now, so we'll play more than one 1AA team per season in 2024 & 2025 to get to a 12 game schedule. Let's get creative and try to find a way to get by for a couple of years. I really appreciate Oregon State's leadership for trying to somehow rebuild the PAC-12. That just got us 3 or 4 out of 9. WSU would be an opponent , so there’s another. I’m just saying it’s going to be progressively harder to get games scheduled that aren’t FCS games (I mentioned that a few days back). How many FCS games are acceptable, I could see needing 3-4 just to get a full schedule. To make the uo game happen we’d have to buy out one of their OOC opponents or get the Big 10 to give them permission to be the only team in the conference that plays an 8 game league schedule - just for us. We may even have to pay a premium to get them to come to Reser if they have to drop a home game, that’d be ugly. I’m all for being creative. I don’t see being all that welcomed by any MWC team that isn’t basically guaranteed a spot in the future conference, and the ones that are may be put at some risk of GOR violations or at least be in the position of alienating some relationships. We’d also need to cobble together 9 games during weeks 4-12, each new game being progressively more difficult to schedule. Best case scenario I think Barnes would still basically need to pull 3-4 games out of his hat, it won’t be easy, especially in 2024. We would like to think we’re in the driver’s seat to our own future if going independent, but that road would have a LOT of hazards to navigate. It ain’t likely to be easy. |
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Post by osbrawler on Sept 2, 2023 7:21:30 GMT -8
Setting up your schedule, not just FB, but all sports would be a challenge with this scenario.
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Post by ostate on Sept 2, 2023 7:24:24 GMT -8
Us and wazzu will not be joining the MWC, here is what has been floating around regarding the MWC joining the P2 and the media situation;
1) any P12 media rights negotiations cannot start without knowing what schools are involved
2) MWC has discussed options of joining P12 (the MWC commish was with the P12 prior to her MWC gig) which may or may not include a complete dissolution of the MWC in order to get out of their current media deal and $0 exit fees (it will take 9 votes to dissolve the MWC)
3) a new P12 would take the top teams from the MWC and not invite the lower tier schools and/or schools that don't meet the ncaa football requirements (stadium size, athletic budgets, etc...); the ncaa min size is 8 total schools
4) a new media deal will most likely be unequal in school distribution with us and wazzu taking a high portion
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Post by p8nted on Sept 2, 2023 7:26:18 GMT -8
Setting up your schedule, not just FB, but all sports would be a challenge with this scenario. Can you imagine trying to do this for all sports? with 10 months to go for some. The costs you are asking future opponents to pay to buy out contracts and cancel games would be high. That does not even count the damaged relationships they would have with those already on their schedules. |
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Post by p8nted on Sept 2, 2023 7:31:39 GMT -8
Us and wazzu will not be joining the MWC, here is what has been floating around regarding the MWC joining the P2 and the media situation; 1) any P12 media rights negotiations cannot start without knowing what schools are involved 2) MWC has discussed options of joining P12 (the MWC commish was with the P12 prior to her MWC gig) which may or may not include a complete dissolution of the MWC in order to get out of their current media deal and $0 exit fees (it will take 9 votes to dissolve the MWC) 3) a new P12 would take the top teams from the MWC and not invite the lower tier schools and/or schools that don't meet the ncaa football requirements (stadium size, athletic budgets, etc...); the ncaa min size is 8 total schools 4) a new media deal will most likely be unequal in school distribution with us and wazzu taking a high portion So they will pay $34 million to join and be happy with reduced media shares? All schools in the MWC meet all NCAA football requirements in terms of stadiums and budgets. If those still even exist or ever did. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Sept 2, 2023 7:42:44 GMT -8
Us and wazzu will not be joining the MWC, here is what has been floating around regarding the MWC joining the P2 and the media situation; 1) any P12 media rights negotiations cannot start without knowing what schools are involved 2) MWC has discussed options of joining P12 (the MWC commish was with the P12 prior to her MWC gig) which may or may not include a complete dissolution of the MWC in order to get out of their current media deal and $0 exit fees (it will take 9 votes to dissolve the MWC) 3) a new P12 would take the top teams from the MWC and not invite the lower tier schools and/or schools that don't meet the ncaa football requirements (stadium size, athletic budgets, etc...); the ncaa min size is 8 total schools 4) a new media deal will most likely be unequal in school distribution with us and wazzu taking a high portion So they will pay $34 million to join and be happy with reduced media shares? All schools in the MWC meet all NCAA football requirements in terms of stadiums and budgets. If those still even exist or ever did. $0 conference buyout if 9 schools vote to dissolve. It largely hinges on that to do this fast I’d think. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’d be a media buyout of some type that would need to be accounted for, I’ve no clue on their obligations to CBS . As far as reduced media shares go, what happens if OSU and WSU get guaranteed 15-16 mil a year MINIMUM and they get guaranteed 8 million MINIMUM (twice of what they’re getting now), with subscription escalators in place and a plan to equalize distributions as subscription goals are met or after a specified timeframe. Could be a win win for everyone. |
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