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Post by srfan1 on Mar 15, 2020 13:50:57 GMT -8
Never let common sense get in the way of a good story!! Please excuse my stupidity. Why would this be against common sense? on your side with this one!!! what you said was common sense
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Post by beavershoopsfan on Mar 15, 2020 13:54:32 GMT -8
Logistically, if approved by the NCAA, it would not be feasible to bring any "5th year seniors" back for only the NCAA tournament because their team might not make it back and/or it would be prohibitively impractical to have the players practice only with the team all season and then only play in the NCAA tournament.
So, the issue is really centered on restoring all of one season to similarly impacted seniors or none of it. There have been compelling reasons cited in this thread on both sides of the issue.
I didn't originate this thread, but I certainty support the idea to provide opportunity to the few who would want to bring appropriate closure to the journey that they have dreamed about and worked towards for years.
At OSU, we have become accustomed to our WBB team making the Big Dance for the past six seasons. It may not feel as special as it does to fans of programs like the University of Portland that earned its berth last week following some very lean seasons. Achieving an important goal is a wonderful thing. Not being able to finish that journey is disheartening, but can be remedied with NCAA action that is very pro-student-athlete.
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Post by baseba1111 on Mar 15, 2020 14:35:54 GMT -8
Again, the difficulty of giving senior winter-sport athletes another year of eligibility is the inability to fairly implement the process universally. Player A played at Washington State. She played 32 games, completed her postseason conference tournament, but her team was sub-.500 so she had no chance of postseason play. No more eligibility. Player B played at Oregon State. She played 32 games, completed her postseason conference tournament, but her team would have made postseason and thus she was guaranteed one more game. A complete year of eligibility. That's patently unfair. Either every women's player gets another year of eligibility (even those who DID play an entire schedule), or none do. I vote none. They all played at least 85-90 percent (many played 100%) of their senior seasons. I am glad that you don't have a vote. The NCAA tourney cancellation didn't impact you like it did a senior OSU student-athlete who trained years for the opportunity to play before family and friends at Gill Coliseum an attempt to bring a national title to a university and community that he/she embraced like a second home. We all are aware of individuals who would make the most of being given another chance to finish their careers without a cancellation to the national tournament that they worked so hard to qualify for. Why does it seem to bother you that a student-athlete might get that opportunity back? If the NCAA approves doing so, the parameters and logistics will be made clear by the NCAA with respect to how it impacts everyone with a dog in the fight. But... they're not getting "the opportunity" back. It was the postseason. Are you saying you guarantee each Sr the postseason that made it this year? So, you guarantee them one game? And, those who played an entire season, but teams that did not gain a postseason berth what opportunity did they miss? There isn't logical or legal reasoning to grant Sr Winter athletes another season. It is purely an emotional one. The postseason is not a guaranteed opportunity. Just as with injury or playing time, athletes are not guaranteed a certain number of opportunities. Athletes train to play a sport they enjoy, in this case many get a free education... that is the guarantee. Do all the kids that work as hard or harder than some OSU athletes get even that? Does anyone guarantee them special circumstance? As far your entire 2nd paragraph... it's called life. Many, many , multitudes of people have worked extremely hard for many things and life happened, things didn't go their way. You mature, grow up, and don't play the "victim card". Did you, your kids, anyone get EVERYTHING that thought they had worked and strove to achieve? You truly think 99.99% of people really care? Where exactly does some NCAA tournament rank in what is going on in the world? Hell... if it wasn't a billion $ industry would it even be played for the sake of such hard working athletes?
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Mar 15, 2020 15:41:46 GMT -8
The guaranteed season was over, time to move on with life. Every team will be different next year due to freshmen and transfers in and out. If you let seniors play again next year and their team would have made one of the post season tournament this year then do they get a free pass to the dance next year?
You can't play could of, should of, would of.
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Post by beavershoopsfan on Mar 15, 2020 15:57:46 GMT -8
The opportunity to represent your college through athletics includes the NCAA tournament if your team earns that opportunity. Yes. There are no guarantees in life. However, there are often opportunities that are earned through performance. Unfortunate events befall everyone in life. Very true. Often, nothing can be done after the fact to make things better. Life goes on.
There is a solution that would give those student-athletes impacted the most one more opportunity to compete. That is what is being discussed by NCAA administrators and in this thread.
I agree that it must be an emotional issue for those impacted the most by the missed opportunity. There is logic that supports giving back the opportunity to compete to those who earned the opportunity and won't get another shot to exercise that opportunity based upon unprecedented circumstances that will linger for an indefinite period of time.
The NCAA usually takes action to avoid the potential liability of litigation. There appears to be little liability exposure in this issue. However, the NCAA can act to remedy issues in favor of its student-athletes. It really comes down to allowing a small subset of student-athletes to have that final opportunity to chase their dreams and goals.
I understand and respect the opposition to my preference with respect to this issue. Much of what has been offered in the posts in this thread on each side are what the NCAA must be considering.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Mar 15, 2020 16:02:18 GMT -8
I am glad that you don't have a vote. The NCAA tourney cancellation didn't impact you like it did a senior OSU student-athlete who trained years for the opportunity to play before family and friends at Gill Coliseum an attempt to bring a national title to a university and community that he/she embraced like a second home. We all are aware of individuals who would make the most of being given another chance to finish their careers without a cancellation to the national tournament that they worked so hard to qualify for. Why does it seem to bother you that a student-athlete might get that opportunity back? If the NCAA approves doing so, the parameters and logistics will be made clear by the NCAA with respect to how it impacts everyone with a dog in the fight. But... they're not getting "the opportunity" back. It was the postseason. Are you saying you guarantee each Sr the postseason that made it this year? So, you guarantee them one game? And, those who played an entire season, but teams that did not gain a postseason berth what opportunity did they miss? There isn't logical or legal reasoning to grant Sr Winter athletes another season. It is purely an emotional one. The postseason is not a guaranteed opportunity. Just as with injury or playing time, athletes are not guaranteed a certain number of opportunities. Athletes train to play a sport they enjoy, in this case many get a free education... that is the guarantee. Do all the kids that work as hard or harder than some OSU athletes get even that? Does anyone guarantee them special circumstance? As far your entire 2nd paragraph... it's called life. Many, many , multitudes of people have worked extremely hard for many things and life happened, things didn't go their way. You mature, grow up, and don't play the "victim card". Did you, your kids, anyone get EVERYTHING that thought they had worked and strove to achieve? You truly think 99.99% of people really care? Where exactly does some NCAA tournament rank in what is going on in the world? Hell... if it wasn't a billion $ industry would it even be played for the sake of such hard working athletes? I can't believe it. We agree.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Mar 15, 2020 16:08:53 GMT -8
So, the issue is really centered on restoring all of one season to similarly impacted seniors or none of it.
And again, there's the problem. The entire class of DI seniors was not impacted equally, thus you would have teams competing for the same prize competing under two different sets of rules. Teams that did not make the NCAA or WNIT could use 2019-20 seniors all season; those that didn't could not, since none of their players were impacted.
Often the simplest solution is the best. Winter-sport athletes completed their year of eligibility.
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Post by beavershoopsfan on Mar 15, 2020 17:00:09 GMT -8
So, the issue is really centered on restoring all of one season to similarly impacted seniors or none of it.
And again, there's the problem. The entire class of DI seniors was not impacted equally, thus you would have teams competing for the same prize competing under two different sets of rules. Teams that did not make the NCAA or WNIT could use 2019-20 seniors all season; those that didn't could not, since none of their players were impacted. Often the simplest solution is the best. Winter-sport athletes completed their year of eligibility. I agree that it is the simplest solution. I simply believe that we (and most importantly the NCAA) can do better than the simplest solution in this unfortunate circumstance. The NCAA has the power to provide hope and future opportunity during very uncertain times to those who want that opportunity.
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Post by sparty on Mar 15, 2020 17:18:13 GMT -8
If the WNBA draft and season is cancelled what would those seniors eligible for the WNBA this year do?
Take a whole year off and wait until April of 2021 to play in the WNBA or play in college ball in November 2020? Some would take the route that gets them back on the court the soonest if given the opportunity. But not all would though.
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Post by baseba1111 on Mar 15, 2020 17:41:34 GMT -8
But... they're not getting "the opportunity" back. It was the postseason. Are you saying you guarantee each Sr the postseason that made it this year? So, you guarantee them one game? And, those who played an entire season, but teams that did not gain a postseason berth what opportunity did they miss? There isn't logical or legal reasoning to grant Sr Winter athletes another season. It is purely an emotional one. The postseason is not a guaranteed opportunity. Just as with injury or playing time, athletes are not guaranteed a certain number of opportunities. Athletes train to play a sport they enjoy, in this case many get a free education... that is the guarantee. Do all the kids that work as hard or harder than some OSU athletes get even that? Does anyone guarantee them special circumstance? As far your entire 2nd paragraph... it's called life. Many, many , multitudes of people have worked extremely hard for many things and life happened, things didn't go their way. You mature, grow up, and don't play the "victim card". Did you, your kids, anyone get EVERYTHING that thought they had worked and strove to achieve? You truly think 99.99% of people really care? Where exactly does some NCAA tournament rank in what is going on in the world? Hell... if it wasn't a billion $ industry would it even be played for the sake of such hard working athletes? I can't believe it. We agree. We agree more than we might think... hence, why we so vehemently disagree at times!
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Post by beavershoopsfan on Mar 15, 2020 17:48:40 GMT -8
If the WNBA draft and season is cancelled what would those seniors eligible for the WNBA this year do? Take a whole year off and wait until April of 2021 to play in the WNBA or play in college ball in November 2020? Some would take the route that gets them back on the court the soonest if given the opportunity. But not all would though. Great question. There is great uncertainty for WNBA prospects as well. The WNBA Draft is scheduled for April 17 or so. Draft-eligible players (including Slocum as a potential early entry) have until April 10 to declare for the draft. It is possible that the draft could be postponed if virus issues persist. Very likely that the WNBA won't play in May as currently scheduled. The women's pro leagues are shut down throughout the world due to pandemic. Seniors who aspire to play professionally will be working out (perhaps on their own) anywhere they can find appropriate (and open) facilities. Many people believe that Ionescu has a shoe deal with Nike ready to be launched, but the pandemic has put a hold on that happening soon. Ionescu, Hebard, and Sabally likely have access to whatever they need with respect to training facilities either through Nike or in Eugene. UConn junior Megan Walker declared for the WNBA Draft yesterday. A bit of a surprise that she did so in March given the uncertainty of where the WNBA will be in late April and May.
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Post by sparty on Mar 15, 2020 18:01:37 GMT -8
If the WNBA draft and season is cancelled what would those seniors eligible for the WNBA this year do? Take a whole year off and wait until April of 2021 to play in the WNBA or play in college ball in November 2020? Some would take the route that gets them back on the court the soonest if given the opportunity. But not all would though. Great question. There is great uncertainty for WNBA prospects as well. The WNBA Draft is scheduled for April 17 or so. Draft-eligible players (including Slocum as a potential early entry) have until April 10 to declare for the draft. It is possible that the draft could be postponed if virus issues persist. Very likely that the WNBA won't play in May as currently scheduled. The women's pro leagues are shut down throughout the world due to pandemic. Seniors who aspire to playing professionally anywhere will be working out (perhaps on their own) anywhere they can find appropriate (and open) facilities. Many people believe that Ionescu has a shoe deal with Nike ready to be launched, but the pandemic has put a hold on that happening soon. Ionescu, Hebard, and Sabally likely have access to whatever they need with respect to training facilities either through Nike or in Eugene. Many players have been playing competitive since grade school. It is in their DNA and to stop for a year cold turkey would be hard for them to do. Now if some of them could be part of the team as well paid extra coaches for a just year that would be cool.
Keeps them tied to the game if WNBA is delayed.
Imagine Mik on the sidelines for a year coaching incoming freshman or Ionescu for that matter for Oregon.
Of course not every senior would have that opportunity but it would be cool to see Mik as a one year coach with Scott until things got rolling again. NCAA would have to approve that extra coach. But it would not be fair to everyone.
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Post by beavershoopsfan on Mar 15, 2020 19:27:51 GMT -8
If Pivec isn't allowed to return as a collegiate player, I am not sure that she is ready to serve as a graduate coach. I have heard that she wants to play professionally, but options there will be nonexistent until the virus crisis is over. If basketball is being played anywhere, she has stated that she wants to be playing collegiately or professionally. Medical school may be beckoning if basketball is put on hold. I'm sure that medical professionals and students will be doing a great deal of triage and learning over the next year.
I have heard from a close source that Tudor wants to play professionally, so another season competing in college would be ideal for her recovery and further development. With the cancellation of the NCAA tourney, her case for a redshirt year would appear to be stronger now. Remember that the NCAA does not like to have to litigate, so it will be interesting to see if Kat's situation changes at all based upon the new situation with the cancellation to the NCAA Tournament.
I think that both Washington and Thropay will have earned their degrees by the end of the spring term. I haven't heard whether either would have an interest in playing another season. I'm sure it would be preferable to have that option when the job market may be very challenging.
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Post by baseba1111 on Mar 15, 2020 21:09:07 GMT -8
If Pivec isn't allowed to return as a collegiate player, I am not sure that she is ready to serve as a graduate coach. I have heard that she wants to play professionally, but options there will be nonexistent until the virus crisis is over. If basketball is being played anywhere, she has stated that she wants to be playing collegiately or professionally. Medical school may be beckoning if basketball is put on hold. I'm sure that medical professionals and students will be doing a great deal of triage and learning over the next year. I have heard from a close source that Tudor wants to play professionally, so another season competing in college would be ideal for her recovery and further development. With the cancellation of the NCAA tourney, her case for a redshirt year would appear to be stronger now. Remember that the NCAA does not like to have to litigate, so it will be interesting to see if Kat's situation changes at all based upon the new situation with the cancellation to the NCAA Tournament. I think that both Washington and Thropay will have earned their degrees by the end of the spring term. I haven't heard whether either would have an interest in playing another season. I'm sure it would be preferable to have that option when the job market may be very challenging. What litigation? There is no NCAA standards for missing a postseason, hence nothing to litigate. If a player plays 30 games, is injured and misses the postseason it's terrible luck, not something they can appeal or sue over. Anyone suing over a world health crisis when players played a full season is wasting someone's $$. Kat was already denied and then played in 30 games and finished the season healthy. Kat's situation hasn't changed.
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Post by beaveragain on Mar 15, 2020 21:21:39 GMT -8
I believe Kat missed her redshirt by one game. Missing postseason again might give her another chance. Not going to open a floodgate of others in the same situation.
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