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Post by rgeorge on Jun 25, 2024 13:41:27 GMT -8
Depends. If we have to whore ourselves out to the devil, selling our soul to get into one of the other P4 conferences - I like the plan of being in a lower tiered conference, two tiered system, and let the SEC and B1G prostrate themselves to the TV executives. But, other's mileage may vary. Explain exactly how OSU would be selling its soul to get into a P4 conference? Money isn't inherently bad. As far as a two-tiered system, we already have a gap between the SEC and Big Ten and the Big 12 and ACC. The G5 is now the third tier. I think OSU has proven it fits just fine in the second tier. No matter how you'd like to "paint the #s" to insure the false narrative there is (3) tiers... P4... all the conferences you mention G5 FCS No matter the $ involved the ACC & B12 are P4. Your "artistry" doesn't change that.
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Post by grayman on Jun 25, 2024 14:11:55 GMT -8
Explain exactly how OSU would be selling its soul to get into a P4 conference? Money isn't inherently bad. As far as a two-tiered system, we already have a gap between the SEC and Big Ten and the Big 12 and ACC. The G5 is now the third tier. I think OSU has proven it fits just fine in the second tier. No matter how you'd like to "paint the #s" to insure the false narrative there is (3) tiers... P4... all the conferences you mention G5 FCS No matter the $ involved the ACC & B12 are P4. Your "artistry" doesn't change that. You must be totally unaware of what is happening with the Big Ten and SEC in separating themselves from the rest. Sure, there are still four power conferences. Two have made distinct separation. You can pretend otherwise all you want.
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Post by NativeBeav on Jun 25, 2024 15:22:05 GMT -8
Depends. If we have to whore ourselves out to the devil, selling our soul to get into one of the other P4 conferences - I like the plan of being in a lower tiered conference, two tiered system, and let the SEC and B1G prostrate themselves to the TV executives. But, other's mileage may vary. Explain exactly how OSU would be selling its soul to get into a P4 conference? Money isn't inherently bad. As far as a two-tiered system, we already have a gap between the SEC and Big Ten and the Big 12 and ACC. The G5 is now the third tier. I think OSU has proven it fits just fine in the second tier. 10:00 PST games (just kidding - mostly). Traveling clear across the country to play conference games. Having to take less than a full share of the conference money, just to have the privilege of being in the Big12 or the ACC. The networks dicking around with scheduling, to manipulate situations where either our bye week, or time of games, is less than ideal for us, but good for the headliners in the conference - to name a few.
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Post by grayman on Jun 25, 2024 16:20:09 GMT -8
Explain exactly how OSU would be selling its soul to get into a P4 conference? Money isn't inherently bad. As far as a two-tiered system, we already have a gap between the SEC and Big Ten and the Big 12 and ACC. The G5 is now the third tier. I think OSU has proven it fits just fine in the second tier. 10:00 PST games (just kidding - mostly). Traveling clear across the country to play conference games. Having to take less than a full share of the conference money, just to have the privilege of being in the Big12 or the ACC. The networks dicking around with scheduling, to manipulate situations where either our bye week, or time of games, is less than ideal for us, but good for the headliners in the conference - to name a few. No guarantee that any of this (excessive travel, giving up a full share) would be necessary. And some of it is more of an irritant to fans than anywhere near selling souls. You're going to have to have a media deal in place no matter what the conference situation becomes, so networks dicking around with scheduling isn't going away anytime soon.
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Post by NativeBeav on Jun 25, 2024 16:36:37 GMT -8
10:00 PST games (just kidding - mostly). Traveling clear across the country to play conference games. Having to take less than a full share of the conference money, just to have the privilege of being in the Big12 or the ACC. The networks dicking around with scheduling, to manipulate situations where either our bye week, or time of games, is less than ideal for us, but good for the headliners in the conference - to name a few. No guarantee that any of this (excessive travel, giving up a full share) would be necessary. And some of it is more of an irritant to fans than anywhere near selling souls. You're going to have to have a media deal in place no matter what the conference situation becomes, so networks dicking around with scheduling isn't going away anytime soon. Unless the conference can indeed build a "western division" yes, extensive travel will be necessary. And several of the "traitorous ten" did have to take a partial share to join their respective conferences. I see no reason why if Cal, Stanford and SMU had to take partial shares to join the ACC, we would not be asked/ required to take partial shares in the Big12, since we both agree the ACC and the Big12 will be "tier two" conferences below the SEC and the B1G going forward.
The real question is, when comparing a partial share in the ACC or the Big12, being a small fish in a big pond, how would that compare to a media deal with a rebuilt PAC, where we are the big fish in the pond? And, we maintain a more regional footprint. I think a lot of it has to do with media markets with each team, being willing to consider a streaming deal, and whether or not we are allowed to continue being a power conference, after the rebuild. Even if we have some compelling teams in the conference, we could still get frozen out.
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Post by grayman on Jun 25, 2024 17:09:10 GMT -8
No guarantee that any of this (excessive travel, giving up a full share) would be necessary. And some of it is more of an irritant to fans than anywhere near selling souls. You're going to have to have a media deal in place no matter what the conference situation becomes, so networks dicking around with scheduling isn't going away anytime soon. Unless the conference can indeed build a "western division" yes, extensive travel will be necessary. And several of the "traitorous ten" did have to take a partial share to join their respective conferences. I see no reason why if Cal, Stanford and SMU had to take partial shares to join the ACC, we would not be asked/ required to take partial shares in the Big12, since we both agree the ACC and the Big12 will be "tier two" conferences below the SEC and the B1G going forward.
The real question is, when comparing a partial share in the ACC or the Big12, being a small fish in a big pond, how would that compare to a media deal with a rebuilt PAC, where we are the big fish in the pond? And, we maintain a more regional footprint. I think a lot of it has to do with media markets with each team, being willing to consider a streaming deal, and whether or not we are allowed to continue being a power conference, after the rebuild. Even if we have some compelling teams in the conference, we could still get frozen out.
I don't believe there is a realistic scenario in which OSU would land in a conference situation without some form of a West Coast/Western division. That would either be the Big 12 along with the four ex-Pac schools, BYU and WSU or in either a western expansion of the ACC or a Pac-ACC merge, both probably involving most of the same schools, or the ACC implodes and the Pac rebuilds with WSU, OSU, Cal, Stanford and maybe SMU with a few others. I think at this point the Big 12 would only offer if it thought there was enough threat of a coast to coast Pac-ACC conference to do so. In which case I don't think it would be a low ball offer, but I also think this is pretty unlikely compared to the other options. I believe a merged Pac-ACC could command a media deal that rivals the Big 12. It also has the potential of OSU and WSU retaining the Pac-12 name and war chest. A rebuilt Pac not quite so much but it still allows for a financial advantage for OSU and WSU as long as the war chest holds out
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Post by rgeorge on Jun 25, 2024 17:35:34 GMT -8
No guarantee that any of this (excessive travel, giving up a full share) would be necessary. And some of it is more of an irritant to fans than anywhere near selling souls. You're going to have to have a media deal in place no matter what the conference situation becomes, so networks dicking around with scheduling isn't going away anytime soon. Unless the conference can indeed build a "western division" yes, extensive travel will be necessary. And several of the "traitorous ten" did have to take a partial share to join their respective conferences. I see no reason why if Cal, Stanford and SMU had to take partial shares to join the ACC, we would not be asked/ required to take partial shares in the Big12, since we both agree the ACC and the Big12 will be "tier two" conferences below the SEC and the B1G going forward.
The real question is, when comparing a partial share in the ACC or the Big12, being a small fish in a big pond, how would that compare to a media deal with a rebuilt PAC, where we are the big fish in the pond? And, we maintain a more regional footprint. I think a lot of it has to do with media markets with each team, being willing to consider a streaming deal, and whether or not we are allowed to continue being a power conference, after the rebuild. Even if we have some compelling teams in the conference, we could still get frozen out.
Funny how all the negative crap about joining the other conferences... selling their soul for $, travel, effects on the kids, etc. is now a good thing for OSU! LOL I'm not talking breaking up the Pac12 traitor crap, but the "other 10" were roasted by the same posters for the stupidity of the move. Now it's the only way for OSU to survive! Plus, said "experts" not only know it's the way to go, but now seem to also have faith OSU will get treated respectfully, fairly regarding $ and media relations. Crazy how one viewpoint of said unknown is in fact so known! Lol FYI... the SEC/B10 bullying other P4 members doesn't create a new tier. Yeah... it's P4 or not. The $ difference may create financial tiers, but they're all NCAA P4 teams with the same NCAA rules and policies. Of course, oh boy... please let us join the "2nd tier" table so we too can get bullied and be tossed some leftovers. Cool 🤣🤣
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Post by sparty on Jun 25, 2024 18:20:36 GMT -8
Unless the conference can indeed build a "western division" yes, extensive travel will be necessary. And several of the "traitorous ten" did have to take a partial share to join their respective conferences. I see no reason why if Cal, Stanford and SMU had to take partial shares to join the ACC, we would not be asked/ required to take partial shares in the Big12, since we both agree the ACC and the Big12 will be "tier two" conferences below the SEC and the B1G going forward.
The real question is, when comparing a partial share in the ACC or the Big12, being a small fish in a big pond, how would that compare to a media deal with a rebuilt PAC, where we are the big fish in the pond? And, we maintain a more regional footprint. I think a lot of it has to do with media markets with each team, being willing to consider a streaming deal, and whether or not we are allowed to continue being a power conference, after the rebuild. Even if we have some compelling teams in the conference, we could still get frozen out.
Funny how all the negative crap about joining the other conferences... selling their soul for $, travel, effects on the kids, etc. is now a good thing for OSU! LOL I'm not talking breaking up the Pac12 traitor crap, but the "other 10" were roasted by the same posters for the stupidity of the move. Now it's the only way for OSU to survive! Plus, said "experts" not only know it's the way to go, but now seem to also have faith OSU will get treated respectfully, fairly regarding $ and median relations. Crazy how one viewpoint of said unknown is in fact so known! Lol FYI... the SEC/B10 bullying other P4 members doesn't create a new tier. Yeah... it's P4 or not. The $ difference may create financial tiers, but they're all NCAA P4 teams with the same NCAA rules and policies. Of course, oh boy... please let us join the "2nd tier" table so we too can get bullied and be tossed some leftovers. Cool 🤣🤣 Very well said. Some just don't stop and think about what they are saying.
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Post by Werebeaver on Jun 25, 2024 18:56:29 GMT -8
Unless the conference can indeed build a "western division" yes, extensive travel will be necessary. And several of the "traitorous ten" did have to take a partial share to join their respective conferences. I see no reason why if Cal, Stanford and SMU had to take partial shares to join the ACC, we would not be asked/ required to take partial shares in the Big12, since we both agree the ACC and the Big12 will be "tier two" conferences below the SEC and the B1G going forward.
The real question is, when comparing a partial share in the ACC or the Big12, being a small fish in a big pond, how would that compare to a media deal with a rebuilt PAC, where we are the big fish in the pond? And, we maintain a more regional footprint. I think a lot of it has to do with media markets with each team, being willing to consider a streaming deal, and whether or not we are allowed to continue being a power conference, after the rebuild. Even if we have some compelling teams in the conference, we could still get frozen out.
Funny how all the negative crap about joining the other conferences... selling their soul for $, travel, effects on the kids, etc. is now a good thing for OSU! LOL I'm not talking breaking up the Pac12 traitor crap, but the "other 10" were roasted by the same posters for the stupidity of the move. Now it's the only way for OSU to survive! Plus, said "experts" not only know it's the way to go, but now seem to also have faith OSU will get treated respectfully, fairly regarding $ and median relations. Crazy how one viewpoint of said unknown is in fact so known! Lol FYI... the SEC/B10 bullying other P4 members doesn't create a new tier. Yeah... it's P4 or not. The $ difference may create financial tiers, but they're all NCAA P4 teams with the same NCAA rules and policies. Of course, oh boy... please let us join the "2nd tier" table so we too can get bullied and be tossed some leftovers. Cool 🤣🤣 Glad to see you're not bitter over the recent events.
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Post by grayman on Jun 25, 2024 21:29:05 GMT -8
I wasn't really part of the selling their soul for money, travel, effects on the kids crowd on this board complaining mostly about the four schools going to the Big Ten. I never said the move to other conferences by the 10 was stupid or wrong. Maybe it was not a great move by Stanford and Cal but better than sticking with the Pac-4. I never wanted the Pac-12 to break up. Nor did most people on this board. Maybe everyone on this board. Many on this board are angry with the 10 for leaving the Pac-12. That has nothing to do with believing that OSU should join a power conference. It's a logical fallacy.
"FYI... the SEC/B10 bullying other P4 members doesn't create a new tier. Yeah... it's P4 or not. The $ difference may create financial tiers, but they're all NCAA P4 teams with the same NCAA rules and policies."
Yep. The money difference is creating a financial top tier and second tier among the four power conferences. How else do you think the tiers are created? Yes, there are four NCAA P4 teams. Those rules and policies are already headed in a direction favoring the Big Ten and SEC. And the NCAA gets weaker and weaker...
"Of course, oh boy... please let us join the "2nd tier" table so we too can get bullied and be tossed some leftovers."
So you want OSU to join the G5 third tier. Got it.
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Post by darthbeavs on Jun 26, 2024 7:00:22 GMT -8
More realignment is coming. When the dust settles, there will be one group of teams playing football in a couple of conferences that will take all the $. Those conferences will not include Kansas, Illinois, Rutgers, Indiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Northwestern, Purdue, Vanderbilt, and whatever other SEC teams they decide to kick out (looking at you Kentucky and South Carolina). Every other school is going to being playing second tier (aka Group of 5 and below status) and that will be a shocker to a lot of people (looking at you Big12 and ACC fans). The days of power 4/5 are over, there is just a couple of seasons needed to shake things out.
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Post by beaver55to7 on Jun 26, 2024 7:08:08 GMT -8
More realignment is coming. When the dust settles, there will be one group of teams playing football in a couple of conferences that will take all the $. Those conferences will not include Kansas, Illinois, Rutgers, Indiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Northwestern, Purdue, Vanderbilt, and whatever other SEC teams they decide to kick out (looking at you Kentucky and South Carolina). Every other school is going to being playing second tier (aka Group of 5 and below status) and that will be a shocker to a lot of people (looking at you Big12 and ACC fans). The days of power 4/5 are over, there is just a couple of seasons needed to shake things out. I know that is the hot take, that Conferences will throw members out, but I don't see it. Teams may leave their conferences, maybe even leave to start a new conference, but I don't ever see schools voting in mass to evict teams from the 2 major conferences.
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Post by darthbeavs on Jun 26, 2024 7:26:41 GMT -8
More realignment is coming. When the dust settles, there will be one group of teams playing football in a couple of conferences that will take all the $. Those conferences will not include Kansas, Illinois, Rutgers, Indiana, Maryland, Minnesota, Northwestern, Purdue, Vanderbilt, and whatever other SEC teams they decide to kick out (looking at you Kentucky and South Carolina). Every other school is going to being playing second tier (aka Group of 5 and below status) and that will be a shocker to a lot of people (looking at you Big12 and ACC fans). The days of power 4/5 are over, there is just a couple of seasons needed to shake things out. I know that is the hot take, that Conferences will throw members out, but I don't see it. Teams may leave their conferences, maybe even leave to start a new conference, but I don't ever see schools voting in mass to evict teams from the 2 major conferences. However it happens, it will happen. If a top-tier super league with 2 conferences is being built (as is being widely posited), why would you include any of those teams? I'd prefer a relegation system. Want to build a best of the best super league? Fine. I'd say include 20-30 teams divided however you want. Each year, the bottom 5 or 6 teams get relegated out of the super league and back to the "pack" of other teams, while the top 5-6 teams from the "pack" get promoted. Similar to professional footy with the Euro's. Want to create a money machine at the top and screw all other schools over, fine, but end the monopoly and allow all schools to earn their way into the super league with their investments and results. Obviously, I've oversimplified it, but the concept is sound ... at least to me.
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Post by beaver55to7 on Jun 26, 2024 11:36:30 GMT -8
I know that is the hot take, that Conferences will throw members out, but I don't see it. Teams may leave their conferences, maybe even leave to start a new conference, but I don't ever see schools voting in mass to evict teams from the 2 major conferences. However it happens, it will happen. If a top-tier super league with 2 conferences is being built (as is being widely posited), why would you include any of those teams? I'd prefer a relegation system. Want to build a best of the best super league? Fine. I'd say include 20-30 teams divided however you want. Each year, the bottom 5 or 6 teams get relegated out of the super league and back to the "pack" of other teams, while the top 5-6 teams from the "pack" get promoted. Similar to professional footy with the Euro's. Want to create a money machine at the top and screw all other schools over, fine, but end the monopoly and allow all schools to earn their way into the super league with their investments and results. Obviously, I've oversimplified it, but the concept is sound ... at least to me. Well, I doubt it. For instance, Northwestern is basically in Chicago. If Northwestern has a great year they deliver the Chicago market. That would be like throwing the Chicago Bears out of the NFL because they normally suck. You don't throw out the Chicago market because the Bears suck. Most if not all of those teams you listed are in or near important markets, they are what makes the B1G so valuable. If it happens you can come back and tell me to eat crow, but I will be shocked if it does.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Jun 26, 2024 12:14:24 GMT -8
European soccer clubs don't also have baseball, softball, golf, volleyball, gymnastics, wrestling, etc. clubs. What happens to them when football gets relegated to a different conference?
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