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Post by irimi on Aug 11, 2023 9:44:00 GMT -8
This is why I think it is in the best interest of the 4 Survivors to keep the Pac alive. There are too many ways this new alignment can fall apart. However, I certainly expect the conferences to start getting rid of their weaker members soon. Hopefully by now Stanford and Cal may have an inkling, that maybe just maybe (especially if the other leagues aren't clamoring to get them) setting expectations too high is what collapsed the conference. If the 4 stick together, and there's apparently potentially up to roughly 400 million reasons to do so, they could potentially almost readily form a 16/18 team conference that's still a Power 5 league. Their 100 million buck share each, on top of a lower but not as bad as it seems TV deal, might be worth giving it a shot for 5-6 years. I don't follow the money very closely, which admittedly is a stupid decision on my part because this whole thing has been about money, but I see a lot of advantages to keeping the Pac alive in some form. The main reason is that we keep traditions alive and the name of the conference--which is no insignificant matter. We will save tons in travel expenses and keep the region relevant for those who care about such things. I think there's also a strong case to be made for elevating teams to the Pac that deserve that sort of recognition and opportunity. Of course, I could be wrong on all of these points because I am looking at the picture emotionally rather than with a business mind. |
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Post by rgeorge on Aug 11, 2023 10:25:23 GMT -8
Hopefully by now Stanford and Cal may have an inkling, that maybe just maybe (especially if the other leagues aren't clamoring to get them) setting expectations too high is what collapsed the conference. If the 4 stick together, and there's apparently potentially up to roughly 400 million reasons to do so, they could potentially almost readily form a 16/18 team conference that's still a Power 5 league. Their 100 million buck share each, on top of a lower but not as bad as it seems TV deal, might be worth giving it a shot for 5-6 years. I don't follow the money very closely, which admittedly is a stupid decision on my part because this whole thing has been about money, but I see a lot of advantages to keeping the Pac alive in some form. The main reason is that we keep traditions alive and the name of the conference--which is no insignificant matter. We will save tons in travel expenses and keep the region relevant for those who care about such things. I think there's also a strong case to be made for elevating teams to the Pac that deserve that sort of recognition and opportunity. Of course, I could be wrong on all of these points because I am looking at the picture emotionally rather than with a business mind. I may state this in a way that can be misinterpreted or just not well... I'm a huge OSU fan... school and athletics... but, the thinking of OSU needs to head to the B12 is ironic to me. I do not see OSU ever being truly relevant there, hence it would be strictly a money move which other schools are being chided for. I know the public stances will be far different, but do the insiders at UW and Oregon (ok, maybe at "Arrogant U's" they do) think they will be more relevant in the B10... in any sport? The same goes for the B12 additions. Zona hoops is the most relevant program and now could be facing years with 4, 5, 6 conferences losses. It's money... and I'd rather OSU not abandon the West for just dollars if a decent conference and media deal can be hashed out. I don't know the future of all this. I do know I'll support OSU no matter what, but I also will be "less" of a fan if OSU is a B12 member. I travel to many roadies in multiple sports. That will not be the case if OSU is a B12 member. I know it doesn't mean squat to OSU's bottom line, nor most OSU fans. But, it does matter to many who do a lot of away games. It may be a very miniscule thing to consider, but I can see OSU being VERY relevant in the West with the MWC type merger. I can see OSU's fan base grow among younger fans throughout the conference when the Beavers show up in those MWC states/arenas. I can also see fans that have a "split" allegiance gravitate toward OSU as half of the uck games are 1800+ miles away. |
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 11, 2023 10:43:54 GMT -8
I'm a huge fan of the traditions......would love to keep it all regional.....I hate all this s%#t as much as anyone!
That said, we are beyond all that. If we want to survive, we have to think bigger. If the B12 wants us, we'd be foolish to not accept and hope that MW can become something bigger than it is right now. The money from the B12 might allow us to keep the momentum going in football, which is what needs to happen. If things fall apart, and Smith gets poached we could easily fall back into college football purgatory......we always have to fight and scratch for everything we get......we need to fight for what we have RIGHT NOW!! We merge with MW we won't get the same recruits.....we have much less money......we lose momentum.....I dunno, maybe I'm wrong, but that's what seems likely to me in that scenario.
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Post by Judge Smails on Aug 11, 2023 12:31:57 GMT -8
I'm a huge fan of the traditions......would love to keep it all regional.....I hate all this s%#t as much as anyone! That said, we are beyond all that. If we want to survive, we have to think bigger. If the B12 wants us, we'd be foolish to not accept and hope that MW can become something bigger than it is right now. The money from the B12 might allow us to keep the momentum going in football, which is what needs to happen. If things fall apart, and Smith gets poached we could easily fall back into college football purgatory......we always have to fight and scratch for everything we get......we need to fight for what we have RIGHT NOW!! We merge with MW we won't get the same recruits.....we have much less money......we lose momentum.....I dunno, maybe I'm wrong, but that's what seems likely to me in that scenario. As noted over and over again, if the Big 12 wanted us, we would already be in there. They do not.....and we won't. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Aug 11, 2023 12:54:37 GMT -8
I'm a huge fan of the traditions......would love to keep it all regional.....I hate all this s%#t as much as anyone! That said, we are beyond all that. If we want to survive, we have to think bigger. If the B12 wants us, we'd be foolish to not accept and hope that MW can become something bigger than it is right now. The money from the B12 might allow us to keep the momentum going in football, which is what needs to happen. If things fall apart, and Smith gets poached we could easily fall back into college football purgatory......we always have to fight and scratch for everything we get......we need to fight for what we have RIGHT NOW!! We merge with MW we won't get the same recruits.....we have much less money......we lose momentum.....I dunno, maybe I'm wrong, but that's what seems likely to me in that scenario. I guess thinking bigger is all a matter of opinion/perspective/definition. Is wanting to be one of the smaller fish in a big pond over a thousand miles away thinking bigger than wanting to bring a pond to you and become one of the biggest fish in it? Lots of people worry about losing Power 5 status and the repercussions of it. Well, if the Pac dissolves there will only be a power 4, if that, and it'll basically be based east of the Mississippi. I've been looking for G-5 conference rankings and really can't readily find them, but most I saw addressing something close to that had the MWC as one of the top 2 or 3 G-5 conferences. I think if Cal and Stanford stayed home and we all merged with the MWC could be quite possibly regarded as the best G-5 conference and potentially keep that Power 5 designation if only because of geography. As far as recruiting goes, as someone mentioned in earlier threads, there's only so many player positions at these schools, not that much changes. OSU hasn't been making a living off of 4 and 5 star recruits, not yet anyways and certainly not in the past, so little will change there. If we stay put and rebuild the Pac, I'd think that for every west coast recruit that wants to look at the Pac schools that went east, there could be nearly as many that will be looking to stay in the region. The recruits we have coming in from the east or the south by recruiting or transfer is kind of proof at least some kids might want to come out here for the school or the coach. I doubt they came specifically because they wanted to be in the Pac 12.. There is some potential for more wins if we're the big fish in the little pond. I think rgeorge mentioned something along the lines of building the fan base on winning, it could be somewhat easier for a bit initially in a regional league out west, if momentum is maintained and the fan base grows, money may not be a huge issue after all. I'd wonder how many of the Portland area duck fans who never went to uo will still be rabid about the ducks when they're mostly a mid-level Big10 school if OSU is regularly fighting for the conference crown? That scenario could very well happen. Anyways, there's a lot of possibilities, good and bad, ahead. I'm not sure there is any right answer. |
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 11, 2023 13:36:22 GMT -8
I'm a huge fan of the traditions......would love to keep it all regional.....I hate all this s%#t as much as anyone! That said, we are beyond all that. If we want to survive, we have to think bigger. If the B12 wants us, we'd be foolish to not accept and hope that MW can become something bigger than it is right now. The money from the B12 might allow us to keep the momentum going in football, which is what needs to happen. If things fall apart, and Smith gets poached we could easily fall back into college football purgatory......we always have to fight and scratch for everything we get......we need to fight for what we have RIGHT NOW!! We merge with MW we won't get the same recruits.....we have much less money......we lose momentum.....I dunno, maybe I'm wrong, but that's what seems likely to me in that scenario. I guess thinking bigger is all a matter of opinion/perspective/definition. Is wanting to be one of the smaller fish in a big pond over a thousand miles away thinking bigger than wanting to bring a pond to you and become one of the biggest fish in it? Lots of people worry about losing Power 5 status and the repercussions of it. Well, if the Pac dissolves there will only be a power 4, if that, and it'll basically be based east of the Mississippi. I've been looking for G-5 conference rankings and really can't readily find them, but most I saw addressing something close to that had the MWC as one of the top 2 or 3 G-5 conferences. I think if Cal and Stanford stayed home and we all merged with the MWC could be quite possibly regarded as the best G-5 conference and potentially keep that Power 5 designation if only because of geography. As far as recruiting goes, as someone mentioned in earlier threads, there's only so many player positions at these schools, not that much changes. OSU hasn't been making a living off of 4 and 5 star recruits, not yet anyways and certainly not in the past, so little will change there. If we stay put and rebuild the Pac, I'd think that for every west coast recruit that wants to look at the Pac schools that went east, there could be nearly as many that will be looking to stay in the region. The recruits we have coming in from the east or the south by recruiting or transfer is kind of proof at least some kids might want to come out here for the school or the coach. I doubt they came specifically because they wanted to be in the Pac 12.. There is some potential for more wins if we're the big fish in the little pond. I think rgeorge mentioned something along the lines of building the fan base on winning, it could be somewhat easier for a bit initially in a regional league out west, if momentum is maintained and the fan base grows, money may not be a huge issue after all. I'd wonder how many of the Portland area duck fans who never went to uo will still be rabid about the ducks when they're mostly a mid-level Big10 school if OSU is regularly fighting for the conference crown? That scenario could very well happen. Anyways, there's a lot of possibilities, good and bad, ahead. I'm not sure there is any right answer. Our recruiting is better than it's ever been. Weve been winning battles against other P5 schools.....that pretty much goes away unless we get into the Big 12.....just sucks to lose that momentum |
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Post by Judge Smails on Aug 11, 2023 13:59:23 GMT -8
Wilner article on proposed value of restructured Pac. Pac rebuild |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Aug 11, 2023 14:16:08 GMT -8
I guess thinking bigger is all a matter of opinion/perspective/definition. Is wanting to be one of the smaller fish in a big pond over a thousand miles away thinking bigger than wanting to bring a pond to you and become one of the biggest fish in it? Lots of people worry about losing Power 5 status and the repercussions of it. Well, if the Pac dissolves there will only be a power 4, if that, and it'll basically be based east of the Mississippi. I've been looking for G-5 conference rankings and really can't readily find them, but most I saw addressing something close to that had the MWC as one of the top 2 or 3 G-5 conferences. I think if Cal and Stanford stayed home and we all merged with the MWC could be quite possibly regarded as the best G-5 conference and potentially keep that Power 5 designation if only because of geography. As far as recruiting goes, as someone mentioned in earlier threads, there's only so many player positions at these schools, not that much changes. OSU hasn't been making a living off of 4 and 5 star recruits, not yet anyways and certainly not in the past, so little will change there. If we stay put and rebuild the Pac, I'd think that for every west coast recruit that wants to look at the Pac schools that went east, there could be nearly as many that will be looking to stay in the region. The recruits we have coming in from the east or the south by recruiting or transfer is kind of proof at least some kids might want to come out here for the school or the coach. I doubt they came specifically because they wanted to be in the Pac 12.. There is some potential for more wins if we're the big fish in the little pond. I think rgeorge mentioned something along the lines of building the fan base on winning, it could be somewhat easier for a bit initially in a regional league out west, if momentum is maintained and the fan base grows, money may not be a huge issue after all. I'd wonder how many of the Portland area duck fans who never went to uo will still be rabid about the ducks when they're mostly a mid-level Big10 school if OSU is regularly fighting for the conference crown? That scenario could very well happen. Anyways, there's a lot of possibilities, good and bad, ahead. I'm not sure there is any right answer. Our recruiting is better than it's ever been. Weve been winning battles against other P5 schools.....that pretty much goes away unless we get into the Big 12.....just sucks to lose that momentum Why does it have to go away? When Jonathan came in we had just finished a season where we were not only regarded to be the WORST FBS school, but we lucked into winning a game against the team regarded to be the WORST FCS school. If we become the Gonzaga of college football, small conference team with a highly regarded coach and often gets some the top regional and national talent, I'd be OK with that. Jonathan's ability to recruit and coach kids up no longer surprises me. |
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 11, 2023 14:19:31 GMT -8
Our recruiting is better than it's ever been. Weve been winning battles against other P5 schools.....that pretty much goes away unless we get into the Big 12.....just sucks to lose that momentum Why does it have to go away? When Jonathan came in we had just finished a season where we were not only regarded to be the WORST FBS school, but we lucked into winning a game against the team regarded to be the WORST FCS school. If we become the Gonzaga of college football, small conference team with a highly regarded coach and often gets some the top regional and national talent, I'd be OK with that. Jonathan's ability to recruit and coach kids up no longer surprises me. That's a HUGE if |
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 11, 2023 14:36:39 GMT -8
Wilner article on proposed value of restructured Pac. Pac rebuildYea, peanuts relatively.....zero surprise there. It's the scraps, and we are part of it in those scenarios. |
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Post by ag87 on Aug 11, 2023 16:19:34 GMT -8
Either scenario 2 or 3. Questions: the article said typically linear pays more than streaming. Does anyone know what streaming pays? Is there a chance in the world that Utah and ASU say mea culpa and we are not playing league games in West Virginia, Ohio, and Florida? And I'm guessing UTSA is a better option than Rice.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Aug 11, 2023 19:10:51 GMT -8
Either scenario 2 or 3. Questions: the article said typically linear pays more than streaming. Does anyone know what streaming pays? Is there a chance in the world that Utah and ASU say mea culpa and we are not playing league games in West Virginia, Ohio, and Florida? And I'm guessing UTSA is a better option than Rice. No. |
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