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Post by steinlager on Aug 6, 2023 9:32:27 GMT -8
I tried to prepare myself for the possibility we would get left behind. People were writing about it last summer when the LA schools announced they were abandoning the league. It's been almost 48 hours and I'm still mad.
Loved the Pac12 since it was the Pac8 in my youth. It's like a family member was sick for a year and finally died Friday.
Time to move on and get busy living as Andy Dufrene said.
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Post by ag87 on Aug 6, 2023 10:03:23 GMT -8
So Fox sweetened the Big-10 deal and Oregon said ok which caused everyone else to cave. Is Fox Sports also Rupert Murdoch?
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Aug 6, 2023 10:24:14 GMT -8
The curse of Clownzano strikes again. Once he said that, I knew we were effed. đ¤Śđźââď¸đ¤Ź Clownzano and his "sources". And you guys have been hearing about "his sources" for years. What is even worse he will say something one day and then flip to another side the next. He is not the source you go to for accurate info. He is more of a tabloid sports reporter and a pot stirrer. Actually he was spot-on. Seven of the Pac-9 schools awoke Friday morning ready to sign on after everyone agreed on Thursday night. The deal was done until Oregon and Washington panicked and went back on their word. |
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Post by Mike84 on Aug 6, 2023 10:26:53 GMT -8
Last offer was a base of $25M, with subscription incentives up to $50 per school according to the Athletic⌠Pac-12, Apple deal was $23M per school and underwhelming, but hope remained until 11th hour Stewart Mandel For 13 months, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff publicly and privately expressed confidence that his league would receive a new media rights deal valuable enough to ensure its members stick together past 2024, the year USC and UCLA debut in the Big Ten. The morning of Aug. 1, Kliavkoff finally presented the presidents and athletic directors a concrete offer. It was not what theyâd been expecting to hear. GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to join Big Ten in 2024 as Pac-12 stumbles According to three people with knowledge of the terms, Apple offered the members a five-year deal with an annual base rate of $23 million per school (a subsequent counteroffer lifted it to $25 million), with incentives based on projected subscribers to a Pac-12 streaming product akin to Appleâs MLS League Pass. At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025. But Kliavkoff encouraged the room to think much bigger â at 5 million subscribers, the schools would eclipse $50 million per year, closer to the deep-pocketed SEC and Big Ten than the ACC or Big 12. The league also had an opt-out clause after three years if the deal didnât reach a specific revenue target. But there were no guarantees whether Apple would simulcast certain games on a linear network, as it does with Fox for MLS, in which case conference games would reach a much smaller universe than other major conferences. ESPN currently has 75 million subscribers, far more than the most optimistic projections for a Pac-12 product on Apple+. Kliavkoff updated the 10 presidents throughout the negotiations, so neither Appleâs involvement or a streaming-heavy deal came as a surprise; the New York Post first reported the possibility in February. However, three participants said theyâd been expecting to be presented with a second, more traditional option as well. Just as Kliavkoff and others had told reporters at the leagueâs Media Day on July 21, they were under the impression a new major player had emerged in the last six weeks. But that deal, which involved multiple partners, fell apart at the 11th hour, shortly before the presidentsâ self-imposed July 31 deadline for bidders to finalize their offers. â(The Apple deal) was not the deal that we had been discussing just days before, and it was not going to secure (our future),â Washington president Ana Mari Cauce told reporters Saturday. âWhen you have a deal that people are saying one of the best aspects of it is, âyou can get out in (three) years,â that tells you a lot.â GO DEEPER Arizona, ASU, Utah leaving Pac-12 for Big 12 Even despite the underwhelming offer, at least several ADs went to bed Thursday believing they had a deal. Though Arizona and Utah had already applied for Big 12 membership, an Arizona board of regents meeting Thursday night ended with ASU president Michael Crow still unwilling to leave, and he and Arizona president Robert Robbins had pledged for their schools to remain together. If they stayed, Utah would, too. âWe were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12 until the last ditch,â Crow told reporters Saturday. He described the Apple deal as âa technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that ASU was very interested in.â Exiting that Thursday night regents meeting, there was enough uncertainty about the intentions of Arizona and Arizona State that the Big 12 entered Friday morning wondering whether its plan had fallen apart and the Pac-12 would survive, which mightâve forced the conference to move on and explore adding UConn as its 14th member. âLate Thursday night, we were like, âMan, I donât know if this is going to happen,ââ one person familiar with the Big 12âs discussions said. âWe went into Friday morning knowing there was a very real possibility that the Pac-12 was going to stay together as is.â GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to the Big Ten? Experts discuss implications of latest realignment move Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12âs $31.7 million. Deep into Thursday night and early Friday morning, Oregon was still torn whether to accept it, according to two people with knowledge of the deliberations. The Athletic reported early Friday that the discussions had lost momentum overnight. âThe mountain schools and Oregon and Washington didnât want to have to do this,â said a person outside the Pac-12 conference briefed on the schoolsâ discussions. âThey wanted it to be true that they could hit those (Apple) numbers. They wanted to be out west with those travel partners. âThey didnât want to be in the Big Ten with a bad deal and those crazy travel details. Even at that time (Thursday night), it could have been held together, but thatâs a lot to process in a short time. And that $50 million figure they thought they could hit on the high end, that wasnât realistic.â When the presidents reconvened at 7 a.m. PT Friday, Oregon and Washingtonâs presidents informed the group of their Big Ten intentions, and the rest of the league quickly unraveled from there. âOnce Oregon and Washington decided to go to the Big Ten, the conference was no longer viable,â said Crow, who said he met with the Big 12 for the first time at 10:30 a.m. PT Friday. âYou canât be in a non-viable position for more than a few hours in our minds, so we resolved that.â The Big Ten officially announced Oregon and Washington at 3:25 p.m. PT. The Big 12 announced Arizona, Arizona State and Utah three hours later. That left Cal, Stanford, Oregon State and Washington State as the only remaining Pac-12 members by nightâs end. âIâm furious,â Oregon State AD Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. â⌠We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.â â Max Olson contributed reporting There's plenty of blame to go around in this whole sickening situation, but part of me thinks that Apple shot themselves in the foot. If they really wanted to start streaming college football, which I think they do, and if they really wanted to make it streaming EXCLUSIVELY, which it seemed they did, they needed to offer more, much more, than the existing mainstream TV deals that the other major conferences have. I think they needed to START with $50M per school. I think they needed to be prepared to lose money, perhaps lots of money, for a while, until the west coast sports fans decided they couldn't live without Pac-12 football and started paying the subscription fee. Even then, it might have not been enough to keep everybody in the conference, since the schools would be giving up the exposure they get on ESPN, FOX, ABC, etc, but it would have at least been possible. As it was, it felt like Apple was the car salesman trying to eek out every cent and playing the "Well....I'll have to go talk to my sales manager again and see if what we can do" game. Then the buyer got up and walked out. Except in the case of a car salesman, he loses only that one sale and can just wait for the next buyer to walk in. Apple has no other buyer. Their chance was the Pac-12 and they let it get away (in a way that doesn't even allow them to try to sweeten the deal now that it's too late). |
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Aug 6, 2023 10:37:06 GMT -8
It's ugly but from the Big12's perspective, I think, the group of OSU, WSU, Utah, ASU, Cal and Stanford makes more sense than Central Florida, Cincinnati, Houston and BYU. If something like that happened the six former Pac-12'ers should quietly be lobbying to restart the PAC with maybe some returnees and San Diego State. I also think a western US conference of WSU, OSU, Utah, ASU, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, Fresno, UNLV, Colorado State, Boise State and SMU is viable. I have no idea what kind of dollars Apple would offer or if those schools would think maybe. Ultimately Skrimshander is correct that OSU needs to get busy and figure out the best way to bet on ourselves and create a better opportunity in the near future. ASU is gone, not sure why you included them. SMU adds noting, except an expensive one-off trip to Dallas for every Olympic sport to play a team that no one in its own market cares about. Dallas is not the west. Wyoming, which has great facilities and is an easy travel partner with CSU, or even UNM would be a better choice. |
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Post by ag87 on Aug 6, 2023 10:52:07 GMT -8
It's ugly but from the Big12's perspective, I think, the group of OSU, WSU, Utah, ASU, Cal and Stanford makes more sense than Central Florida, Cincinnati, Houston and BYU. If something like that happened the six former Pac-12'ers should quietly be lobbying to restart the PAC with maybe some returnees and San Diego State. I also think a western US conference of WSU, OSU, Utah, ASU, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, Fresno, UNLV, Colorado State, Boise State and SMU is viable. I have no idea what kind of dollars Apple would offer or if those schools would think maybe. Ultimately Skrimshander is correct that OSU needs to get busy and figure out the best way to bet on ourselves and create a better opportunity in the near future. ASU is gone, not sure why you included them. SMU adds noting, except an expensive one-off trip to Dallas for every Olympic sport to play a team that no one in its own market cares about. Dallas is not the west. Wyoming, which has great facilities and is an easy travel partner with CSU, or even UNM would be a better choice. At that point of time I probably didn't realize that Utah and ASU were leaving. The ASU president's comments on joining the Big12 sounded like someone had a gun to his head. This is probably more than 99% unrealistic. But I wish Apple would let those six Pac-6 schools know that the offer of $22M or $25M is still good if they stay associated with the Pacific time zone instead of CST and EST. I believe six is still a conference. Obviously, I know nothing about contracts (American Conference) but add SMU and perhaps UTSA for the 24-25 school year. After San Diego State can get away (25-26 or 26-27) without financial penalties add them and Colorado State. That's 10. 12 could be two of the following three - Fresno, UNLV, and Boise. If ASU and Utah backed away, there would likely be litigation. But I think you can walk away from a new car in 72 hours without penalties also. Who knows? edit - I've been to Laramie a few times. Montana or North Dakota State is a better option than that. |
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Aug 6, 2023 10:54:56 GMT -8
Expanding to Texas is a loser. Nobody cares about anyone there except UT and A&M and that will only increase now that they are in the same league.
Stay regional. Easier for the athletes as well when travel is considered.
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Post by ag87 on Aug 6, 2023 11:05:38 GMT -8
It's ugly but from the Big12's perspective, I think, the group of OSU, WSU, Utah, ASU, Cal and Stanford makes more sense than Central Florida, Cincinnati, Houston and BYU. If something like that happened the six former Pac-12'ers should quietly be lobbying to restart the PAC with maybe some returnees and San Diego State. I also think a western US conference of WSU, OSU, Utah, ASU, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, Fresno, UNLV, Colorado State, Boise State and SMU is viable. I have no idea what kind of dollars Apple would offer or if those schools would think maybe. Ultimately Skrimshander is correct that OSU needs to get busy and figure out the best way to bet on ourselves and create a better opportunity in the near future. ASU is gone, not sure why you included them. SMU adds noting, except an expensive one-off trip to Dallas for every Olympic sport to play a team that no one in its own market cares about. Dallas is not the west. Wyoming, which has great facilities and is an easy travel partner with CSU, or even UNM would be a better choice. And I can't figure out New Mexico. I like Albuquerque. I've thought about moving there. The combined statistical area has a population of 1.16M. (about #50 in the USA). They have had some excellent basketball teams and traditions. But football is horrible and I don't know why. They should be better. Anyway I think it's a bad choice but the potential is there to make it a great choice. |
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Post by jefframp on Aug 6, 2023 11:12:30 GMT -8
And I can't figure out New Mexico. I like Albuquerque. I've thought about moving there. The combined statistical area has a population of 1.16M. (about #50 in the USA). They have had some excellent basketball teams and traditions. But football is horrible and I don't know why. They should be better. Anyway I think it's a bad choice but the potential is there to make it a great choice. Maybe it is the altitude. Albuquerque at 5318 ft, Boulder is at 5312 ft |
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Post by sparty on Aug 6, 2023 11:48:37 GMT -8
Last offer was a base of $25M, with subscription incentives up to $50 per school according to the Athletic⌠Pac-12, Apple deal was $23M per school and underwhelming, but hope remained until 11th hour Stewart Mandel For 13 months, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff publicly and privately expressed confidence that his league would receive a new media rights deal valuable enough to ensure its members stick together past 2024, the year USC and UCLA debut in the Big Ten. The morning of Aug. 1, Kliavkoff finally presented the presidents and athletic directors a concrete offer. It was not what theyâd been expecting to hear. GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to join Big Ten in 2024 as Pac-12 stumbles According to three people with knowledge of the terms, Apple offered the members a five-year deal with an annual base rate of $23 million per school (a subsequent counteroffer lifted it to $25 million), with incentives based on projected subscribers to a Pac-12 streaming product akin to Appleâs MLS League Pass. At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025. But Kliavkoff encouraged the room to think much bigger â at 5 million subscribers, the schools would eclipse $50 million per year, closer to the deep-pocketed SEC and Big Ten than the ACC or Big 12. The league also had an opt-out clause after three years if the deal didnât reach a specific revenue target. But there were no guarantees whether Apple would simulcast certain games on a linear network, as it does with Fox for MLS, in which case conference games would reach a much smaller universe than other major conferences. ESPN currently has 75 million subscribers, far more than the most optimistic projections for a Pac-12 product on Apple+. Kliavkoff updated the 10 presidents throughout the negotiations, so neither Appleâs involvement or a streaming-heavy deal came as a surprise; the New York Post first reported the possibility in February. However, three participants said theyâd been expecting to be presented with a second, more traditional option as well. Just as Kliavkoff and others had told reporters at the leagueâs Media Day on July 21, they were under the impression a new major player had emerged in the last six weeks. But that deal, which involved multiple partners, fell apart at the 11th hour, shortly before the presidentsâ self-imposed July 31 deadline for bidders to finalize their offers. â(The Apple deal) was not the deal that we had been discussing just days before, and it was not going to secure (our future),â Washington president Ana Mari Cauce told reporters Saturday. âWhen you have a deal that people are saying one of the best aspects of it is, âyou can get out in (three) years,â that tells you a lot.â GO DEEPER Arizona, ASU, Utah leaving Pac-12 for Big 12 Even despite the underwhelming offer, at least several ADs went to bed Thursday believing they had a deal. Though Arizona and Utah had already applied for Big 12 membership, an Arizona board of regents meeting Thursday night ended with ASU president Michael Crow still unwilling to leave, and he and Arizona president Robert Robbins had pledged for their schools to remain together. If they stayed, Utah would, too. âWe were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12 until the last ditch,â Crow told reporters Saturday. He described the Apple deal as âa technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that ASU was very interested in.â Exiting that Thursday night regents meeting, there was enough uncertainty about the intentions of Arizona and Arizona State that the Big 12 entered Friday morning wondering whether its plan had fallen apart and the Pac-12 would survive, which mightâve forced the conference to move on and explore adding UConn as its 14th member. âLate Thursday night, we were like, âMan, I donât know if this is going to happen,ââ one person familiar with the Big 12âs discussions said. âWe went into Friday morning knowing there was a very real possibility that the Pac-12 was going to stay together as is.â GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to the Big Ten? Experts discuss implications of latest realignment move Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12âs $31.7 million. Deep into Thursday night and early Friday morning, Oregon was still torn whether to accept it, according to two people with knowledge of the deliberations. The Athletic reported early Friday that the discussions had lost momentum overnight. âThe mountain schools and Oregon and Washington didnât want to have to do this,â said a person outside the Pac-12 conference briefed on the schoolsâ discussions. âThey wanted it to be true that they could hit those (Apple) numbers. They wanted to be out west with those travel partners. âThey didnât want to be in the Big Ten with a bad deal and those crazy travel details. Even at that time (Thursday night), it could have been held together, but thatâs a lot to process in a short time. And that $50 million figure they thought they could hit on the high end, that wasnât realistic.â When the presidents reconvened at 7 a.m. PT Friday, Oregon and Washingtonâs presidents informed the group of their Big Ten intentions, and the rest of the league quickly unraveled from there. âOnce Oregon and Washington decided to go to the Big Ten, the conference was no longer viable,â said Crow, who said he met with the Big 12 for the first time at 10:30 a.m. PT Friday. âYou canât be in a non-viable position for more than a few hours in our minds, so we resolved that.â The Big Ten officially announced Oregon and Washington at 3:25 p.m. PT. The Big 12 announced Arizona, Arizona State and Utah three hours later. That left Cal, Stanford, Oregon State and Washington State as the only remaining Pac-12 members by nightâs end. âIâm furious,â Oregon State AD Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. â⌠We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.â â Max Olson contributed reporting There's plenty of blame to go around in this whole sickening situation, but part of me thinks that Apple shot themselves in the foot. If they really wanted to start streaming college football, which I think they do, and if they really wanted to make it streaming EXCLUSIVELY, which it seemed they did, they needed to offer more, much more, than the existing mainstream TV deals that the other major conferences have. I think they needed to START with $50M per school. I think they needed to be prepared to lose money, perhaps lots of money, for a while, until the west coast sports fans decided they couldn't live without Pac-12 football and started paying the subscription fee. Even then, it might have not been enough to keep everybody in the conference, since the schools would be giving up the exposure they get on ESPN, FOX, ABC, etc, but it would have at least been possible. As it was, it felt like Apple was the car salesman trying to eek out every cent and playing the "Well....I'll have to go talk to my sales manager again and see if what we can do" game. Then the buyer got up and walked out. Except in the case of a car salesman, he loses only that one sale and can just wait for the next buyer to walk in. Apple has no other buyer. Their chance was the Pac-12 and they let it get away (in a way that doesn't even allow them to try to sweeten the deal now that it's too late). Excellent, excellent post Mike84. Great point about Apple had a chance to be the leader and innovator in all of this and could have made a better offer. This could be their oh crap moment if someone like Amazon or whomever gets out first on it. The could have had their streaming and did something unique. Someone is gonna pair up with linear and streaming as a team. I think Apple could of found the other component. So yeah, it may come back to haunt them, |
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Post by irimi on Aug 6, 2023 14:36:47 GMT -8
Last offer was a base of $25M, with subscription incentives up to $50 per school according to the Athletic⌠Pac-12, Apple deal was $23M per school and underwhelming, but hope remained until 11th hour Stewart Mandel For 13 months, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff publicly and privately expressed confidence that his league would receive a new media rights deal valuable enough to ensure its members stick together past 2024, the year USC and UCLA debut in the Big Ten. The morning of Aug. 1, Kliavkoff finally presented the presidents and athletic directors a concrete offer. It was not what theyâd been expecting to hear. GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to join Big Ten in 2024 as Pac-12 stumbles According to three people with knowledge of the terms, Apple offered the members a five-year deal with an annual base rate of $23 million per school (a subsequent counteroffer lifted it to $25 million), with incentives based on projected subscribers to a Pac-12 streaming product akin to Appleâs MLS League Pass. At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025. But Kliavkoff encouraged the room to think much bigger â at 5 million subscribers, the schools would eclipse $50 million per year, closer to the deep-pocketed SEC and Big Ten than the ACC or Big 12. The league also had an opt-out clause after three years if the deal didnât reach a specific revenue target. But there were no guarantees whether Apple would simulcast certain games on a linear network, as it does with Fox for MLS, in which case conference games would reach a much smaller universe than other major conferences. ESPN currently has 75 million subscribers, far more than the most optimistic projections for a Pac-12 product on Apple+. Kliavkoff updated the 10 presidents throughout the negotiations, so neither Appleâs involvement or a streaming-heavy deal came as a surprise; the New York Post first reported the possibility in February. However, three participants said theyâd been expecting to be presented with a second, more traditional option as well. Just as Kliavkoff and others had told reporters at the leagueâs Media Day on July 21, they were under the impression a new major player had emerged in the last six weeks. But that deal, which involved multiple partners, fell apart at the 11th hour, shortly before the presidentsâ self-imposed July 31 deadline for bidders to finalize their offers. â(The Apple deal) was not the deal that we had been discussing just days before, and it was not going to secure (our future),â Washington president Ana Mari Cauce told reporters Saturday. âWhen you have a deal that people are saying one of the best aspects of it is, âyou can get out in (three) years,â that tells you a lot.â GO DEEPER Arizona, ASU, Utah leaving Pac-12 for Big 12 Even despite the underwhelming offer, at least several ADs went to bed Thursday believing they had a deal. Though Arizona and Utah had already applied for Big 12 membership, an Arizona board of regents meeting Thursday night ended with ASU president Michael Crow still unwilling to leave, and he and Arizona president Robert Robbins had pledged for their schools to remain together. If they stayed, Utah would, too. âWe were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12 until the last ditch,â Crow told reporters Saturday. He described the Apple deal as âa technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that ASU was very interested in.â Exiting that Thursday night regents meeting, there was enough uncertainty about the intentions of Arizona and Arizona State that the Big 12 entered Friday morning wondering whether its plan had fallen apart and the Pac-12 would survive, which mightâve forced the conference to move on and explore adding UConn as its 14th member. âLate Thursday night, we were like, âMan, I donât know if this is going to happen,ââ one person familiar with the Big 12âs discussions said. âWe went into Friday morning knowing there was a very real possibility that the Pac-12 was going to stay together as is.â GO DEEPER Oregon, Washington to the Big Ten? Experts discuss implications of latest realignment move Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12âs $31.7 million. Deep into Thursday night and early Friday morning, Oregon was still torn whether to accept it, according to two people with knowledge of the deliberations. The Athletic reported early Friday that the discussions had lost momentum overnight. âThe mountain schools and Oregon and Washington didnât want to have to do this,â said a person outside the Pac-12 conference briefed on the schoolsâ discussions. âThey wanted it to be true that they could hit those (Apple) numbers. They wanted to be out west with those travel partners. âThey didnât want to be in the Big Ten with a bad deal and those crazy travel details. Even at that time (Thursday night), it could have been held together, but thatâs a lot to process in a short time. And that $50 million figure they thought they could hit on the high end, that wasnât realistic.â When the presidents reconvened at 7 a.m. PT Friday, Oregon and Washingtonâs presidents informed the group of their Big Ten intentions, and the rest of the league quickly unraveled from there. âOnce Oregon and Washington decided to go to the Big Ten, the conference was no longer viable,â said Crow, who said he met with the Big 12 for the first time at 10:30 a.m. PT Friday. âYou canât be in a non-viable position for more than a few hours in our minds, so we resolved that.â The Big Ten officially announced Oregon and Washington at 3:25 p.m. PT. The Big 12 announced Arizona, Arizona State and Utah three hours later. That left Cal, Stanford, Oregon State and Washington State as the only remaining Pac-12 members by nightâs end. âIâm furious,â Oregon State AD Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. â⌠We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.â â Max Olson contributed reporting There's plenty of blame to go around in this whole sickening situation, but part of me thinks that Apple shot themselves in the foot. If they really wanted to start streaming college football, which I think they do, and if they really wanted to make it streaming EXCLUSIVELY, which it seemed they did, they needed to offer more, much more, than the existing mainstream TV deals that the other major conferences have. I think they needed to START with $50M per school. I think they needed to be prepared to lose money, perhaps lots of money, for a while, until the west coast sports fans decided they couldn't live without Pac-12 football and started paying the subscription fee. Even then, it might have not been enough to keep everybody in the conference, since the schools would be giving up the exposure they get on ESPN, FOX, ABC, etc, but it would have at least been possible. As it was, it felt like Apple was the car salesman trying to eek out every cent and playing the "Well....I'll have to go talk to my sales manager again and see if what we can do" game. Then the buyer got up and walked out. Except in the case of a car salesman, he loses only that one sale and can just wait for the next buyer to walk in. Apple has no other buyer. Their chance was the Pac-12 and they let it get away (in a way that doesn't even allow them to try to sweeten the deal now that it's too late). I agree. Moving to an all streaming platform is a heck of a risk for the conference. Apple needed to at least match the big numbers that are out there. I think Apple production wouldâve been outstanding and the conference wouldâve been better for it in the long run, but surprisingly, Apple couldnât convince them that the audience would be there. |
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Post by seastape on Aug 6, 2023 17:43:44 GMT -8
It's ugly but from the Big12's perspective, I think, the group of OSU, WSU, Utah, ASU, Cal and Stanford makes more sense than Central Florida, Cincinnati, Houston and BYU. If something like that happened the six former Pac-12'ers should quietly be lobbying to restart the PAC with maybe some returnees and San Diego State. I also think a western US conference of WSU, OSU, Utah, ASU, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, Fresno, UNLV, Colorado State, Boise State and SMU is viable. I have no idea what kind of dollars Apple would offer or if those schools would think maybe. Ultimately Skrimshander is correct that OSU needs to get busy and figure out the best way to bet on ourselves and create a better opportunity in the near future. ASU is gone, not sure why you included them. SMU adds noting, except an expensive one-off trip to Dallas for every Olympic sport to play a team that no one in its own market cares about.
Dallas is not the west. Wyoming, which has great facilities and is an easy travel partner with CSU, or even UNM would be a better choice. I have understood why the Pac was interested in SMU, but it never moved the needle for me at all. The Big 12 would have unquestionably snatched up SMU if they had any worth. For the Pac...it always seemed like a move of desperation. |
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Post by irimi on Aug 6, 2023 17:46:05 GMT -8
ASU is gone, not sure why you included them. SMU adds noting, except an expensive one-off trip to Dallas for every Olympic sport to play a team that no one in its own market cares about.
Dallas is not the west. Wyoming, which has great facilities and is an easy travel partner with CSU, or even UNM would be a better choice. I have understood why the Pac was interested in SMU, but it never moved the needle for me at all. The Big 12 would have unquestionably snatched up SMU if they had any worth. For the Pac...it always seemed like a move of desperation. It's a move geared toward recruiting in a new market. I'm not sure how important that is, given that Mike Riley could get kids from Texas. |
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Post by seastape on Aug 6, 2023 17:47:45 GMT -8
I have understood why the Pac was interested in SMU, but it never moved the needle for me at all. The Big 12 would have unquestionably snatched up SMU if they had any worth. For the Pac...it always seemed like a move of desperation. It's a move geared toward recruiting in a new market. I'm not sure how important that is, given that Mike Riley could get kids from Texas. Like I said, I understood why, but SMU is way down on the ladder and I'm not sold that the recruiting in would be all that great. |
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Aug 6, 2023 18:13:45 GMT -8
I have understood why the Pac was interested in SMU, but it never moved the needle for me at all. The Big 12 would have unquestionably snatched up SMU if they had any worth. For the Pac...it always seemed like a move of desperation. It's a move geared toward recruiting in a new market. I'm not sure how important that is, given that Mike Riley could get kids from Texas. Except now the 4 corner schools will be recruiting Texas more than ever, since they will be playing games there. All the defecting teams have either significantly reduced the number of games they will play in California (SC, UCLA) or eliminated them completely (ASU, UA, Utah, Colorado). That's where the opportunity will be, especially if our new conference is totally western-based. |
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