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Post by speakthetruth on Aug 4, 2023 14:01:41 GMT -8
I must be missing something but it seems there would have been alot more money for the big12 and pac10 if the two would have merged. Created two divisions and the winner of each division played in the league championship.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Aug 4, 2023 14:07:55 GMT -8
I must be missing something but it seems there would have been a lot more money for the big12 and pac10 if the two would have merged. Created two divisions and the winner of each division played in the league championship. 22 is too many teams. 20 is the most that you could have and make it work. Without Oregon and Washington, you could make it work. Put the two Kansases in the West, for example. Big 12 wanted to kill the Pac-12 and be in charge. They may get their wish.
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Post by beaver55to7 on Aug 4, 2023 14:23:12 GMT -8
As much as I didn't want to believe what this guy was saying all along, he ended up being right. Go back through his tweets and he was spot on. Maybe he just got lucky, but I'm hoping he actually knows what he's talking about now. I'd expect they look into this, only makes sense... don't know if it pencils out but Oregon State to the Big-12 is about the only way this gets resolves with us having a shot at remaining relevant. I have my fingers crossed. This would allow us to retain Smith and continue the momentum being built. I hope Utah/ASU/OSU/WSU are a united front in working for this to be completed. Really hate the state of college football right now. Seems like a temporary solution at best unfortunately. Not one of those 4 schools want to be in that conference. It will be a shotgun marriage in the time of easy divorce.
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Post by OriginalWhizzinator on Aug 4, 2023 14:26:28 GMT -8
Could be good, who knows: The curse of Clownzano strikes again. Once he said that, I knew we were effed. 🤦🏼♂️🤬
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Post by schissler on Aug 4, 2023 14:27:37 GMT -8
As much as I didn't want to believe what this guy was saying all along, he ended up being right. Go back through his tweets and he was spot on. Maybe he just got lucky, but I'm hoping he actually knows what he's talking about now. I'd expect they look into this, only makes sense... don't know if it pencils out but Oregon State to the Big-12 is about the only way this gets resolves with us having a shot at remaining relevant. I have my fingers crossed. This would allow us to retain Smith and continue the momentum being built. I hope Utah/ASU/OSU/WSU are a united front in working for this to be completed. Really hate the state of college football right now. Seems like a temporary solution at best unfortunately. Not one of those 4 schools want to be in that conference. It will be a shotgun marriage in the time of easy divorce. Right now, all four of those schools want desperately to be in that conference.
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Post by jrbeavo on Aug 4, 2023 14:28:09 GMT -8
As much as I didn't want to believe what this guy was saying all along, he ended up being right. Go back through his tweets and he was spot on. Maybe he just got lucky, but I'm hoping he actually knows what he's talking about now. I'd expect they look into this, only makes sense... don't know if it pencils out but Oregon State to the Big-12 is about the only way this gets resolves with us having a shot at remaining relevant. I have my fingers crossed. This would allow us to retain Smith and continue the momentum being built. I hope Utah/ASU/OSU/WSU are a united front in working for this to be completed. Really hate the state of college football right now. Seems like a temporary solution at best unfortunately. Not one of those 4 schools want to be in that conference. It will be a shotgun marriage in the time of easy divorce. It buys us time. It is sort of an 11th hour call from the governor to stay the execution while we set up the appeal.
I have been saying for a week or so that time is crucial here. Got to stay alive in the short term, because no one has a CLUE what college sports will be in even two to three years. This may all backfire and there could be a new set up re-org. We have to be standing when that times comes. Even if this allows for a temporary respite, it is far, far better than the MWC scenario
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Post by ag87 on Aug 4, 2023 14:29:23 GMT -8
It's ugly but from the Big12's perspective, I think, the group of OSU, WSU, Utah, ASU, Cal and Stanford makes more sense than Central Florida, Cincinnati, Houston and BYU. If something like that happened the six former Pac-12'ers should quietly be lobbying to restart the PAC with maybe some returnees and San Diego State.
I also think a western US conference of WSU, OSU, Utah, ASU, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, Fresno, UNLV, Colorado State, Boise State and SMU is viable. I have no idea what kind of dollars Apple would offer or if those schools would think maybe.
Ultimately Skrimshander is correct that OSU needs to get busy and figure out the best way to bet on ourselves and create a better opportunity in the near future.
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thomasg86
Freshman
FTd
Posts: 376
Grad Year: 2009
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Post by thomasg86 on Aug 4, 2023 14:33:25 GMT -8
As much as I didn't want to believe what this guy was saying all along, he ended up being right. Go back through his tweets and he was spot on. Maybe he just got lucky, but I'm hoping he actually knows what he's talking about now. I'd expect they look into this, only makes sense... don't know if it pencils out but Oregon State to the Big-12 is about the only way this gets resolves with us having a shot at remaining relevant. I have my fingers crossed. This would allow us to retain Smith and continue the momentum being built. I hope Utah/ASU/OSU/WSU are a united front in working for this to be completed. Really hate the state of college football right now. Seems like a temporary solution at best unfortunately. Not one of those 4 schools want to be in that conference. It will be a shotgun marriage in the time of easy divorce. Sure, but I don't see any other options. We are moving toward a world of the Big Two (Big 10 & SEC), the Almost Big (Big-12 and ACC) and all the rest. Unless any of these teams is planning on getting an SEC or Big Ten invite, this is the best they are going to do for the foreseeable future. Also, if the ACC blows up, the best teams will be snatched up by the Big Ten & SEC. Big 12 will still have room for a couple they can snag... conferences are all going to be around 18-22 teams.
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ftd
Junior
"I think real leaders show up when times are hard." Trent Bray 11/29/2023
Posts: 2,517
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Post by ftd on Aug 4, 2023 14:58:15 GMT -8
Seems like a temporary solution at best unfortunately. Not one of those 4 schools want to be in that conference. It will be a shotgun marriage in the time of easy divorce. It buys us time. It is sort of an 11th hour call from the governor to stay the execution while we set up the appeal.
I have been saying for a week or so that time is crucial here. Got to stay alive in the short term, because no one has a CLUE what college sports will be in even two to three years. This may all backfire and there could be a new set up re-org. We have to be standing when that times comes. Even if this allows for a temporary respite, it is far, far better than the MWC scenario
Time to make lemonade! We sure as hell have enough lemons! Keeps us in a P5 conference with P5 money..or at least a share of it... Gives the college athletics world to come to it's senses and get back to regional conferences. Crap even the pros keep their divisions regional in most cases.
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thomasg86
Freshman
FTd
Posts: 376
Grad Year: 2009
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Post by thomasg86 on Aug 6, 2023 0:24:03 GMT -8
So the Big-12 voted to explore adding two more members (#17 and #18) at their meeting officially adding ASU and Utah. Big Ten is already 18 members, and conferences seem to be headed to 20 and beyond, so Big-12 seems fairly serious about two more. That has been confirmed, not rumor.
I've been scouring social media all day (the last couple of days has been nothing but refreshing) and the sentiment I've seen from a number of people claiming inside knowledge is that ESPN is not happy about being completely locked out of the west coast. So they agreed to pay for two more teams... they want west coast inventory.
Again, you can choose whether or not to believe this certain individual. But I did see this sentiment in a couple of places and it makes sense.
This particular detail I've only seen from this guy...
Again, huge grain of salt. Dude has been pretty spot in and these make sense. I believe they want to add Gonzaga and UConn in their quest to become the "ultimate basketball conference" but I'm not sure either would jump. This window also seems focused on west coast football inventory to go up against Fox (maybe they add 19 and 20 as basketball only schools). That leaves...
OSU Wazzu Stanford Cal SDSU
I have to think of those 5, Oregon State has a pretty good shot. Stanford seems destined to go independent and San Diego State has a large buyout with the Mountain West conference before 2025. Cal seems like a weird fit. Beavs and Wazzu slide in culturally and we already have good P-5 sports programs. If it somehow came down to us and Wazzu, I think our baseball team (big sport in B12 country) and overall better teams across the board (WBB, gymnastics, wrestling), along with much easier travel, would nudge us ahead of Wazzu.
Maybe it's wishful thinking, but this may be OSU's best shot at staying relevant. Plus, the Big-12 will be a very fun conference. Some really fun teams would come cycling through Reser!
Scott Barnes better be kicking down the door to make this happen!
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Post by sparty on Aug 6, 2023 5:24:31 GMT -8
Could be good, who knows: The curse of Clownzano strikes again. Once he said that, I knew we were effed. 🤦🏼♂️🤬 Clownzano and his "sources". And you guys have been hearing about "his sources" for years. What is even worse he will say something one day and then flip to another side the next. He is not the source you go to for accurate info. He is more of a tabloid sports reporter and a pot stirrer.
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Post by fridaynightlights on Aug 6, 2023 5:55:26 GMT -8
The curse of Clownzano strikes again. Once he said that, I knew we were effed. 🤦🏼♂️🤬 Clownzano and his "sources". And you guys have been hearing about "his sources" for years. What is even worse he will say something one day and then flip to another side the next. He is not the source you go to for accurate info. He is more of a tabloid sports reporter and a pot stirrer. I would not be surprised if his sources were inside the OSU AD office who were trying to spin an impending disaster in a positive light. Clownzano bought it hook, line and sinker.
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Post by avidbeaver on Aug 6, 2023 7:58:30 GMT -8
Does anyone know the full details of the offer to the conference? Was there anyone else involved besides Apple? Just wondering
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Post by avidbeaver on Aug 6, 2023 8:15:15 GMT -8
The reason I ask is that if it was just Apple and 20 mil per team, I would think things would have went south quicker. Maybe it was posted and I didn't see it.
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Post by bennysdentist on Aug 6, 2023 8:54:25 GMT -8
Last offer was a base of $25M, with subscription incentives up to $50 per school according to the Athletic…
Pac-12, Apple deal was $23M per school and underwhelming, but hope remained until 11th hour Stewart Mandel For 13 months, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff publicly and privately expressed confidence that his league would receive a new media rights deal valuable enough to ensure its members stick together past 2024, the year USC and UCLA debut in the Big Ten.
The morning of Aug. 1, Kliavkoff finally presented the presidents and athletic directors a concrete offer. It was not what they’d been expecting to hear.
GO DEEPER
Oregon, Washington to join Big Ten in 2024 as Pac-12 stumbles
According to three people with knowledge of the terms, Apple offered the members a five-year deal with an annual base rate of $23 million per school (a subsequent counteroffer lifted it to $25 million), with incentives based on projected subscribers to a Pac-12 streaming product akin to Apple’s MLS League Pass.
At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025. But Kliavkoff encouraged the room to think much bigger — at 5 million subscribers, the schools would eclipse $50 million per year, closer to the deep-pocketed SEC and Big Ten than the ACC or Big 12.
The league also had an opt-out clause after three years if the deal didn’t reach a specific revenue target.
But there were no guarantees whether Apple would simulcast certain games on a linear network, as it does with Fox for MLS, in which case conference games would reach a much smaller universe than other major conferences. ESPN currently has 75 million subscribers, far more than the most optimistic projections for a Pac-12 product on Apple+.
Kliavkoff updated the 10 presidents throughout the negotiations, so neither Apple’s involvement or a streaming-heavy deal came as a surprise; the New York Post first reported the possibility in February. However, three participants said they’d been expecting to be presented with a second, more traditional option as well. Just as Kliavkoff and others had told reporters at the league’s Media Day on July 21, they were under the impression a new major player had emerged in the last six weeks.
But that deal, which involved multiple partners, fell apart at the 11th hour, shortly before the presidents’ self-imposed July 31 deadline for bidders to finalize their offers.
“(The Apple deal) was not the deal that we had been discussing just days before, and it was not going to secure (our future),” Washington president Ana Mari Cauce told reporters Saturday. “When you have a deal that people are saying one of the best aspects of it is, ‘you can get out in (three) years,’ that tells you a lot.”
GO DEEPER
Arizona, ASU, Utah leaving Pac-12 for Big 12
Even despite the underwhelming offer, at least several ADs went to bed Thursday believing they had a deal. Though Arizona and Utah had already applied for Big 12 membership, an Arizona board of regents meeting Thursday night ended with ASU president Michael Crow still unwilling to leave, and he and Arizona president Robert Robbins had pledged for their schools to remain together. If they stayed, Utah would, too.
“We were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12 until the last ditch,” Crow told reporters Saturday. He described the Apple deal as “a technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that ASU was very interested in.”
Exiting that Thursday night regents meeting, there was enough uncertainty about the intentions of Arizona and Arizona State that the Big 12 entered Friday morning wondering whether its plan had fallen apart and the Pac-12 would survive, which might’ve forced the conference to move on and explore adding UConn as its 14th member.
“Late Thursday night, we were like, ‘Man, I don’t know if this is going to happen,’” one person familiar with the Big 12’s discussions said. “We went into Friday morning knowing there was a very real possibility that the Pac-12 was going to stay together as is.”
GO DEEPER
Oregon, Washington to the Big Ten? Experts discuss implications of latest realignment move
Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12’s $31.7 million. Deep into Thursday night and early Friday morning, Oregon was still torn whether to accept it, according to two people with knowledge of the deliberations. The Athletic reported early Friday that the discussions had lost momentum overnight.
“The mountain schools and Oregon and Washington didn’t want to have to do this,” said a person outside the Pac-12 conference briefed on the schools’ discussions. “They wanted it to be true that they could hit those (Apple) numbers. They wanted to be out west with those travel partners.
“They didn’t want to be in the Big Ten with a bad deal and those crazy travel details. Even at that time (Thursday night), it could have been held together, but that’s a lot to process in a short time. And that $50 million figure they thought they could hit on the high end, that wasn’t realistic.”
When the presidents reconvened at 7 a.m. PT Friday, Oregon and Washington’s presidents informed the group of their Big Ten intentions, and the rest of the league quickly unraveled from there.
“Once Oregon and Washington decided to go to the Big Ten, the conference was no longer viable,” said Crow, who said he met with the Big 12 for the first time at 10:30 a.m. PT Friday. “You can’t be in a non-viable position for more than a few hours in our minds, so we resolved that.”
The Big Ten officially announced Oregon and Washington at 3:25 p.m. PT. The Big 12 announced Arizona, Arizona State and Utah three hours later. That left Cal, Stanford, Oregon State and Washington State as the only remaining Pac-12 members by night’s end.
“I’m furious,” Oregon State AD Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. “… We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.”
— Max Olson contributed reporting
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