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Post by cake on Jul 28, 2023 15:24:50 GMT -8
Since speculation is running wild.... I'll say hole and the fuskies end up in the B10.....Utah, ARZ schools in B12 Not sure about Cal and Furd. Us, and wazzu in the MWC I'm holding onto hope that we get into the B12..... I thought the B12 had a written cap on how large there conference could be? Less openings than schools that want to be there. Yes, it's 16 for this current cycle.
They'll have 13 when OUT leaves and Colorado arrives. Every current Power 5 team they add automatically adds $31.7M, a full share, to the deal. So they can add 3 more.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Jul 28, 2023 15:35:13 GMT -8
I thought the B12 had a written cap on how large there conference could be? Less openings than schools that want to be there. Yes, it's 16 for this current cycle.
They'll have 13 when OUT leaves and Colorado arrives. Every current Power 5 team they add automatically adds $31.7M, a full share, to the deal. So they can add 3 more.
I thought that it was 14 for this current cycle? |
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Post by gotmilk on Jul 28, 2023 15:51:03 GMT -8
I am still not sold on the idea that Fresno gets us any eyeballs. They are in a very small market in a very large state. Does getting us Fresno give us Los Angeles? My guess is no. There are better universities. From what I'm seeing, Fresno is in the 55th ranked TV market, not big but not tiny. If they do well and draw fans from the entire Central Valley that market sizes jumps substantially. As it is, FSU already had a higher average viewership than SDSU medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-were-the-most-watched-in-2022-94eca4f6acbdMy main goal is to keep California eyeballs. We've now got the mountain states somewhat locked in (assuming the CSU scenario comes to fruition and others don't leave). Unfortunately the major power schools in Texas are already committed. SMU I think is a good idea, I'd like to have a Houston school as well, but Tulane has shown interest and would be a good backup. I think both FSU's and SDSU's viewership would rise dramatically (not enough to "replace" the loss of USC and UCLA) with a move to the Pac 12/14/16. BSU had reasonable viewing numbers, but they kinda have their region locked up and there probably isn't as much upside potential, so that's why I left them out. I'd welcome an Oklahoma State or a Tulsa type school(a big city school anyways, the university itself is pretty small). I don't think we'll ever poach a Big 10 school. I'd be thrilled if we could get a couple east coast teams to commit to coming this way (much rater see that than having Pac12 teams go there), but we're kind of running low on bigger market relatively successful football schools that gave expressed interest or aren't locked into long term agreements. I read somewhere where Cal and Stanford would veto Fresno, but now you know desparate times. Stanford vetoing Texas looks like brilliant foresight now. |
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Post by ag87 on Jul 28, 2023 16:01:55 GMT -8
I made a crack about cross country and Colorado. But I do think it's a big deal. These are my mostly uninformed opinions. The Big12 is a better fit for Colorado. It's a plains state and their rival is Nebraska. But I think there is more local interest in Colorado vs Texas Tech than Colorado vs Oregon State or Stanford. Why would Oregon State ever go to the Big12 and why would the Big12 ever covet Oregon State? I think saying there is a 1/10 of one percent chance of that happening is overstating. Why would any remaining Pac9 University want to go to the Big12? I can kind of see Arizona, but no one else. Like Colorado, it may help their football team gain competitiveness. But Arizona is tied to the west coast, not Texas and Kansas. The two super conference makes almost no sense for football and less than that for everything else. Two super conferences of 24 teams? Why have a conference if you see some members once every six years? My time in Colorado has been sitting in an office in downtown Denver for three or four days about five times. Maybe because I'm an engineer but I heard as much talk about CSU as CU. Colorado State vs Arizona State will outdraw and have more eyeballs than Colorado vs Central Florida. Someone in this thread talked about patience. If the current nine add Colorado State, San Diego State, and SMU they will outperform the ACC and Big12 on the field and maybe in TV viewership. If a media deal is short, around six years, a much bigger deal will be coming. I believe UCLA and USC left the PAC because their administration folk were mostly midwesterners. I also believe their fan base already regrets it. When administration changes, I'm guessing they want back in. I'm not sure of the Colorado administration. But I do think Kansas State vs Colorado and Oklahoma State vs Colorado has some pull for their fans. I don't think any Colorado State fan will miss playing New Mexico, Fresno State, (somewhat Wyoming because it is only 90 minutes away) or Hawaii in football. Finally the PAC does need to move in the direction of a "keep what you kill" financial model. Colorado's rival is Colorado State. The Big 12 team that Colorado played most? Missouri. Colorado has played Nebraska two more times than Colorado has played Utah. The Colorado-Nebraska Rivalry was a make-believe rivalry that was created with the creation of the Big 12 in 1996. Colorado and Nebraska were "rivals" for 15 years. Before 1996, Nebraska's rival was Oklahoma. Nebraska and Oklahoma were each other's Big 6/7/8 season finale in 50 of the 57 meetings between 1939 and 1995. My old boss two or three bosses (or maybe four, depending on how you count) was a big Nebraska honk. And he hated Oklahoma more than anyone. He could care less about Colorado. Colorado may have adorably thought that they were rivals with Nebraska, just like Baylor and Texas Tech believed that they were rivals with Texas. Adorable! Between 1972 and 1990, Colorado's rival was Kansas State, playing each other in the season finale or the penultimate game every single year. Before that, Air Force and Colorado were primary rivals, playing each other in the final weekend of the season in 14 of 15 seasons with only Kansas State sneaking in once to take the spot. 1956 and 1957 were transition years with Colorado finishing with Arizona and Iowa State, respectively. Colorado finished against Colorado State in seven of the previous nine with only Kansas State and Michigan State jumping in to take up that position. And before that Colorado was in the Mountain States/Rocky Mountain Conference, finishing up against a team from Colorado in the final 16 years before joining the Big Six. (Colorado was the seventh in the Big Seven. Oklahoma State was the eighth in the Big Eight.) As for Colorado State, Colorado State and Wyoming's biggest rivals are each other. List of most-played interstate rivalries: 1. Paul Bunyan's Axe (Minnesota v. Wisconson)
2. The Deep South & South's Oldest Rivalry (Auburn v. Georgia and North Carolina v. Virginia)
4. Army-Navy Game
5. The Game (Michigan v. Ohio State); Kentucky-Tennessee Rivalry, & Red River Showdown (Oklahoma v. Texas)
8. Floyd of Rosedale(Iowa v. Minnesota) & LSU-Mississippi State
10. Border War (Colorado State & Wyoming) & Oregon-Washington Rivalry
Border War has been played as often as the Apple Cup and the Oregon-Washington Rivalry and more often than the Magnolia Bowl and Oregon State's rivalry with both Washington and Wazzu.I'm fairly certain Colorado and Nebraska were both in the Big 8 and played every year for many years. And yes, Nebraska considered Oklahoma their biggest rival but Colorado considered Nebraska their biggest rival. I don't think Colorado ever considered the Air Force Academy as a significant rival. AF obviously considers their primary rivals as Navy and Army. As a wild guess, I think Colorado and Utah have played less than 20 times. . . . . and fwiw, when I was in high school, Linfield and PLU were big rivals. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Jul 28, 2023 16:04:20 GMT -8
From what I'm seeing, Fresno is in the 55th ranked TV market, not big but not tiny. If they do well and draw fans from the entire Central Valley that market sizes jumps substantially. As it is, FSU already had a higher average viewership than SDSU medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-were-the-most-watched-in-2022-94eca4f6acbdMy main goal is to keep California eyeballs. We've now got the mountain states somewhat locked in (assuming the CSU scenario comes to fruition and others don't leave). Unfortunately the major power schools in Texas are already committed. SMU I think is a good idea, I'd like to have a Houston school as well, but Tulane has shown interest and would be a good backup. I think both FSU's and SDSU's viewership would rise dramatically (not enough to "replace" the loss of USC and UCLA) with a move to the Pac 12/14/16. BSU had reasonable viewing numbers, but they kinda have their region locked up and there probably isn't as much upside potential, so that's why I left them out. I'd welcome an Oklahoma State or a Tulsa type school(a big city school anyways, the university itself is pretty small). I don't think we'll ever poach a Big 10 school. I'd be thrilled if we could get a couple east coast teams to commit to coming this way (much rater see that than having Pac12 teams go there), but we're kind of running low on bigger market relatively successful football schools that gave expressed interest or aren't locked into long term agreements. The Pac-12 already gets Sacramento based on having both California and Stanford. Fresno is almost twice as far away from Sacramento than Berkeley. There is no way that adding Fresno gets you Sacramento better than California and Stanford get you Sacramento. The question is does Fresno bring in Los Angeles better than say San Diego State? If the answer is yes, invite Fresno. Otherwise, no. Hard pass. I believe that the answer is no, so hard pass. So who do you suggest? Out of the Universities left in California with football programs and a significant fanbase, FSU is probably the largest and most successful. Heck, ask them to play in SoFi once or twice a year as part of the entry deal. I'm not sure any of the current LA schools that have football are anywhere near ready to jump to a Power 5 league. There might be 1 or 2 that could potentially make that jump and basically play at a huge disadvantage for a few years as they build their programs, not sure how many would watch them get beat up 9 weeks out of the season for several years though. I think FSU could thrive in recruiting the LA area if they were in a power 5 conference. I'm not so certain going to the Big 10 is a 100% recruiting win for USC and UCLA, FSU and SDSU are likely to improve their recruiting in that area if they jump to the Pac. Neither school will replace the lost viewership in LA, but they could pick up some of it. |
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Post by ag87 on Jul 28, 2023 16:18:47 GMT -8
The Pac-12 already gets Sacramento based on having both California and Stanford. Fresno is almost twice as far away from Sacramento than Berkeley. There is no way that adding Fresno gets you Sacramento better than California and Stanford get you Sacramento. The question is does Fresno bring in Los Angeles better than say San Diego State? If the answer is yes, invite Fresno. Otherwise, no. Hard pass. I believe that the answer is no, so hard pass. So who do you suggest? Out of the Universities left in California with football programs and a significant fanbase, FSU is probably the largest and most successful. Heck, ask them to play in SoFi once or twice a year as part of the entry deal. I'm not sure any of the current LA schools that have football are anywhere near ready to jump to a Power 5 league. There might be 1 or 2 that could potentially make that jump and basically play at a huge disadvantage for a few years as they build their programs, not sure how many would watch them get beat up 9 weeks out of the season for several years though. I think FSU could thrive in recruiting the LA area if they were in a power 5 conference. I'm not so certain going to the Big 10 is a 100% recruiting win for USC and UCLA, FSU and SDSU are likely to improve their recruiting in that area if they jump to the Pac. Neither school will replace the lost viewership in LA, but they could pick up some of it. I believe the southern Cal presence, for now (I hope), is San Diego State. When SC and UCLA bailed a year ago, I suggested Long Beach State, partially being serious and partially being provocative. I liked the thought of saying LBSU and SDSU could replace UCLA and USC as a shot to the blueblood's arrogance. I'm aware LBSU has not played football since 1991. Harry Scrim about blew a gasquet. Not related, but the Pac12 wiki page lists Colorado's endowment as 2.12B and the Big8 page lists it as 665M, with a reference link to 2012 data. Did it grow that much? Anyone know? The Pac12 page also lists our endowment as 830M and I thought it was over a billion. |
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Post by irimi on Jul 28, 2023 17:37:27 GMT -8
I’d vote for two or more California teams. Fresno played us hard last year. SDSU would be a fine get. Irvine or Santa Barbara would be a great baseball get. Santa Clara?
Get one from Nevada and two from Texas and we’d be set.
The trick is to not look at the school as it is now, but see the inherent potential if it were upgraded to a power five school. I think some of these schools aren’t much different than the OSU you or I attended.
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Post by grayman on Jul 28, 2023 17:54:49 GMT -8
I see much more inherent potential in San Diego State than most any other school being talked about on or near the West Coast.
SMU would be a good add as well.
But that's even if the Pac-12 agrees to add schools (which shouldn't even be a debate IMO).
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Jul 28, 2023 17:58:09 GMT -8
So who do you suggest? Out of the Universities left in California with football programs and a significant fanbase, FSU is probably the largest and most successful. Heck, ask them to play in SoFi once or twice a year as part of the entry deal. I'm not sure any of the current LA schools that have football are anywhere near ready to jump to a Power 5 league. There might be 1 or 2 that could potentially make that jump and basically play at a huge disadvantage for a few years as they build their programs, not sure how many would watch them get beat up 9 weeks out of the season for several years though. I think FSU could thrive in recruiting the LA area if they were in a power 5 conference. I'm not so certain going to the Big 10 is a 100% recruiting win for USC and UCLA, FSU and SDSU are likely to improve their recruiting in that area if they jump to the Pac. Neither school will replace the lost viewership in LA, but they could pick up some of it. I believe the southern Cal presence, for now (I hope), is San Diego State. When SC and UCLA bailed a year ago, I suggested Long Beach State, partially being serious and partially being provocative. I liked the thought of saying LBSU and SDSU could replace UCLA and USC as a shot to the blueblood's arrogance. I'm aware LBSU has not played football since 1991. Harry Scrim about blew a gasquet.
Not related, but the Pac12 wiki page lists Colorado's endowment as 2.12B and the Big8 page lists it as 665M, with a reference link to 2012 data. Did it grow that much? Anyone know? The Pac12 page also lists our endowment as 830M and I thought it was over a billion. Yeah. Adding a team without a football program is pretty freaking stupid. And it's Henry. |
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Post by sparty on Jul 28, 2023 18:07:33 GMT -8
So the Mountain West Conference office is in Colorado Springs and Pac office is in San Francisco. Makes more sense after all of this to keep the conference office it in Colorado Springs after all of this.
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Post by korculabeav on Jul 28, 2023 19:30:41 GMT -8
Colorado's rival is Colorado State. The Big 12 team that Colorado played most? Missouri. Colorado has played Nebraska two more times than Colorado has played Utah. The Colorado-Nebraska Rivalry was a make-believe rivalry that was created with the creation of the Big 12 in 1996. Colorado and Nebraska were "rivals" for 15 years. Before 1996, Nebraska's rival was Oklahoma. Nebraska and Oklahoma were each other's Big 6/7/8 season finale in 50 of the 57 meetings between 1939 and 1995. My old boss two or three bosses (or maybe four, depending on how you count) was a big Nebraska honk. And he hated Oklahoma more than anyone. He could care less about Colorado. Colorado may have adorably thought that they were rivals with Nebraska, just like Baylor and Texas Tech believed that they were rivals with Texas. Adorable! Between 1972 and 1990, Colorado's rival was Kansas State, playing each other in the season finale or the penultimate game every single year. Before that, Air Force and Colorado were primary rivals, playing each other in the final weekend of the season in 14 of 15 seasons with only Kansas State sneaking in once to take the spot. 1956 and 1957 were transition years with Colorado finishing with Arizona and Iowa State, respectively. Colorado finished against Colorado State in seven of the previous nine with only Kansas State and Michigan State jumping in to take up that position. And before that Colorado was in the Mountain States/Rocky Mountain Conference, finishing up against a team from Colorado in the final 16 years before joining the Big Six. (Colorado was the seventh in the Big Seven. Oklahoma State was the eighth in the Big Eight.) As for Colorado State, Colorado State and Wyoming's biggest rivals are each other. List of most-played interstate rivalries: 1. Paul Bunyan's Axe (Minnesota v. Wisconson)
2. The Deep South & South's Oldest Rivalry (Auburn v. Georgia and North Carolina v. Virginia)
4. Army-Navy Game
5. The Game (Michigan v. Ohio State); Kentucky-Tennessee Rivalry, & Red River Showdown (Oklahoma v. Texas)
8. Floyd of Rosedale(Iowa v. Minnesota) & LSU-Mississippi State
10. Border War (Colorado State & Wyoming) & Oregon-Washington Rivalry
Border War has been played as often as the Apple Cup and the Oregon-Washington Rivalry and more often than the Magnolia Bowl and Oregon State's rivalry with both Washington and Wazzu.I'm fairly certain Colorado and Nebraska were both in the Big 8 and played every year for many years. And yes, Nebraska considered Oklahoma their biggest rival but Colorado considered Nebraska their biggest rival. I don't think Colorado ever considered the Air Force Academy as a significant rival. AF obviously considers their primary rivals as Navy and Army. As a wild guess, I think Colorado and Utah have played less than 20 times. . . . . and fwiw, when I was in high school, Linfield and PLU were big rivals. And both Nebbie and CU are two of the worst Power 5 programs in the country. CU hasn’t contributed two $hits since coming to the Pac 12. |
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Post by matt90 on Jul 28, 2023 20:25:28 GMT -8
I think UNLV. We could have HQ there. Vegas is growing fast. It is right in the middle of the geography. They will get better and grow along with the city.
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Post by Judge Smails on Jul 28, 2023 20:44:22 GMT -8
I think UNLV. We could have HQ there. Vegas is growing fast. It is right in the middle of the geography. They will get better and grow along with the city. Not ever happening as long as our Presidents grasp to the academic side of the conference. Same thing with Boise. |
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Jul 28, 2023 20:44:55 GMT -8
I think UNLV. We could have HQ there. Vegas is growing fast. It is right in the middle of the geography. They will get better and grow along with the city. I lived in NV thru the housing market crash.....oh I guess it's been almost 15 years ago now. Didn't live in Vegas....Northern NV is a much better area to live......Vegas was hit HARD by the crash. NV is boom/bust in general. That said, having the pro team there is nice....helps to keep it a travel destination.....the native casinos have hit the gaming destination thing kinda hard. Lots of business meeting crap and all that still there though......so yea, I guess maybe ....although, water......they only have so much. I remember they were trying to tap into the eastern NV aquifers when we lived down there. That went over like a turd in the punchbowl. |
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Post by spudbeaver on Jul 28, 2023 20:52:50 GMT -8
I think UNLV. We could have HQ there. Vegas is growing fast. It is right in the middle of the geography. They will get better and grow along with the city. I lived in NV thru the housing market crash.....oh I guess it's been almost 15 years ago now. Didn't live in Vegas....Northern NV is a much better area to live......Vegas was hit HARD by the crash. NV is boom/bust in general. That said, having the pro team there is nice....helps to keep it a travel destination.....the native casinos have hit the gaming destination thing kinda hard. Lots of business meeting crap and all that still there though......so yea, I guess maybe ....although, water......they only have so much. I remember they were trying to tap into the eastern NV aquifers when we lived down there. That went over like a turd in the punchbowl. Weird. The gambling Mecca of America is boom/bust? Go figure! |
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