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Post by beaversproud on Apr 1, 2022 9:30:37 GMT -8
I have no doubt of your numbers. No doubt. What does the rest of the conference spend their money on that if we were equal to,it would even the playing field? I'm trying to think of what you spend $$$ on in recruiting besides travel to tournaments,watching prospects games,Plane trips for campus visits,etc. I was curious about what osu should spend more money on to help out. i would guess the answer is staff — both in number and in size of salaries. I’m not sure where the numbers cited above came from — did schools submit their own numbers or did the survey try to ascertain what staff members (or percentage of staff members) is allocated toward recruiting. So these surveys are not always totally accurate. For example, Illinois has a staff member with title of Director of Recruiting and Scouting. Couldn’t find similar title on Beav’s’ basketball staff list, so those duties are likely being performed by a percentage of one or more staff members. So the accuracy of the numbers are in no way absolute. All that said, it would not surprise me at all if Beavers are spending in the bottom 25% or lower for recruiting operations. I think I mentioned somewhere before the lack of investment in the basketball program. It's clear 'they' are ok with having the occasional magical season.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Apr 1, 2022 9:40:10 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have?
Full complement of scholarships? Check.
On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check.
Practice facility? Check.
New locker room? Check.
Full, convenient training table? Check.
Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check.
Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check.
Academic support team? Check.
Three full-time assistants? Check.
Director of Ops? Check.
Director of Player Personnel? Check.
Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check.
So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out.
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Post by rgeorge on Apr 1, 2022 9:50:54 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have? Full complement of scholarships? Check. On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check. Practice facility? Check. New locker room? Check. Full, convenient training table? Check. Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check. Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check. Academic support team? Check. Three full-time assistants? Check. Director of Ops? Check. Director of Player Personnel? Check. Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check. So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out. I'm guessing a large recruiting budget will be one of the replies. The "governmental" response is always to toss more money at it, because of course it is sure to improve. Must be the reason WT can't recruit. Not his fault... again!
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Post by Judge Smails on Apr 1, 2022 9:57:42 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have? Full complement of scholarships? Check. On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check. Practice facility? Check. New locker room? Check. Full, convenient training table? Check. Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check. Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check. Academic support team? Check. Three full-time assistants? Check. Director of Ops? Check. Director of Player Personnel? Check. Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check. So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out. A Top of the Cock NIL deal?
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Post by rgeorge on Apr 1, 2022 10:05:18 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have? Full complement of scholarships? Check. On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check. Practice facility? Check. New locker room? Check. Full, convenient training table? Check. Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check. Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check. Academic support team? Check. Three full-time assistants? Check. Director of Ops? Check. Director of Player Personnel? Check. Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check. So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out. A Top of the Cock NIL deal? And, maybe those come slowly as the program has hope and a booster, or six, believes in the leader of said program.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Apr 1, 2022 10:26:27 GMT -8
On the recruiting spending, OSU seems to be perennially in the bottom 2 in the Pac 12 in recruiting budget, and the Pac 12 seems to be perennially at the bottom in recruiting budgets of the 6 power conferences. The most recent numbers I saw had OSU at a 165k basketball recruiting budget while Kentucky was spending over million. Now Kentucky's budget is very high, but there were lots of schools spending 200k-600k on recruiting with a handful of schools on either side of that range. I don't know what they're spending their money on, but we're clearly doing it on the cheap compared to most schools. athleticdirectoru.com/articles/an-analysis-of-college-basketball-recruiting-costs/
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Post by qbeaver on Apr 1, 2022 10:28:22 GMT -8
I have no doubt of your numbers. No doubt. What does the rest of the conference spend their money on that if we were equal to,it would even the playing field? I'm trying to think of what you spend $$$ on in recruiting besides travel to tournaments,watching prospects games,Plane trips for campus visits,etc. I was curious about what osu should spend more money on to help out. i would guess the answer is staff — both in number and in size of salaries. I’m not sure where the numbers cited above came from — did schools submit their own numbers or did the survey try to ascertain what staff members (or percentage of staff members) is allocated toward recruiting. So these surveys are not always totally accurate. For example, Illinois has a staff member with title of Director of Recruiting and Scouting. Couldn’t find similar title on Beav’s’ basketball staff list, so those duties are likely being performed by a percentage of one or more staff members. So the accuracy of the numbers are in no way absolute. All that said, it would not surprise me at all if Beavers are spending in the bottom 25% or lower for recruiting operations. Just thinking about travel. Ucla for example or SC could drive across town to pick up their recruits. No cost there but a tank of gas. No plane fare...etc.
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Post by beaverinohio on Apr 2, 2022 3:20:26 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have? Full complement of scholarships? Check. On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check. Practice facility? Check. New locker room? Check. Full, convenient training table? Check. Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check. Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check. Academic support team? Check. Three full-time assistants? Check. Director of Ops? Check. Director of Player Personnel? Check. Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check. So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out. As I noted in previous post, number of staff and salaries surely makes up for at least some of the reasons why OSU lags in financial commitment. So you can’t just say 3 assistants, check because every team’s 3 assistants aren’t created equal — and salaries they demand is often indicative of the quality. Same goes for other staff positions. None of this is meant as an overarching excuse that relieves WT of blame. But I think it might be naive to suggest that budget — especially when it might inhibit hiring additional and quality staff — doesn’t impact things. But it is up to WT to get results with the resources he has, and he hasn’t done that. If you lack resources, one way to keep up is work smarter. Theoretically, having experienced ACs should help that happen. It doesn’t seem to have worked out like that. So maybe a hiring some younger assistants who have had success — even at mid majorish level — will help. Sometimes hungry is better than smarter. I will say that if WT is let go at some point in the future and if the numbers reported in this thread are correct, then I hope the incoming coach negotiates an overall increase in the basketball program budget. Not advocating “throwing money at the problem” per se, but often if you try to go cheap you get a cheap product. And overall budget and salary pool for ACs and other key staff will be important to attracting a good HC. If it is not, I’d worry the guy doesn’t really have a plan for the program — or at least a clue how to implement it.
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Post by irimi on Apr 2, 2022 8:46:13 GMT -8
We could always hire Rick Pitino and have his staff run a brothel out of the dorms like they did at Louisville. Bring in revenue! Now you’re thinking!
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Post by Werebeaver on Apr 2, 2022 9:02:19 GMT -8
I read about this "lack of investment." So what don't we have? Full complement of scholarships? Check. On-campus arena with video boards, etc? Check. Practice facility? Check. New locker room? Check. Full, convenient training table? Check. Band and cheerleaders at every game? Check. Generally favorable OOC schedule? Check. Academic support team? Check. Three full-time assistants? Check. Director of Ops? Check. Director of Player Personnel? Check. Dedicated Strength and Conditioning coach? Check. So put coaching issues aside. What do we not have that other programs (who are supposedly "more invested" than we are) have? I'm genuinely curious to find out. I would put the discrepancy down to things just being more affordable in Corvallis.
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Post by Werebeaver on Apr 2, 2022 9:12:37 GMT -8
Hookers and blow, huh? Meet our new recruiting "coordinator": Corvallis may be a little change of pace for Pat, but he'll soon find out where the action is.
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Post by beaversproud on Apr 4, 2022 10:51:49 GMT -8
football = bowl game = little bit better then 500? lose = $5 mil investment, in a bad PAC-12 year
Basketball = Tournament Champions, Elite 8 = 100K for Wayne and a strength coach. in a good PASC-12 year
Seems pretty comparable to me.... definitely screams investment and desire to win/support a program/coach.
Oh, forgot to mention... found $50 million + for brand new 1/2 football stadium during Covid.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Apr 4, 2022 11:49:40 GMT -8
OSU did not simply "find" $50 million for 1/4 of a new football stadium. The benefactors made a specific, one-time donation to the Reser project. If they had wanted to make the donation to the basketball program, they would have.
More people enjoy college football than college basketball. And there is much more money to be made in college football than in college basketball. So it should be the priority.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Apr 4, 2022 12:22:58 GMT -8
football = bowl game = little bit better then 500? lose = $5 mil investment, in a bad PAC-12 year Basketball = Tournament Champions, Elite 8 = 100K for Wayne and a strength coach. in a good PASC-12 year Seems pretty comparable to me.... definitely screams investment and desire to win/support a program/coach. Oh, forgot to mention... found $50 million + for brand new 1/2 football stadium during Covid. Tinkle's 2020-21 contract gave him a bonus of $150,000.00 + $100,000.00 for each round won (3) = $450,000.00. But Tinkle chose to forego the bonus, as part of his negotiation of a new contract. I.e. $0 for Wayne in a great Pac-12 year. He did get the new contract, though.
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