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Post by grayman on Jul 15, 2024 10:13:56 GMT -8
There have been a few developments lately that could relate to what the podcasters in the OP were getting at. One is that the Big 12 is going after Florida State and Clemson and other teams in realignment. This has been talked about quite a bit in the last week or so but actual reporters are now going with it. Oregon State is among those other schools that the Big 12 is reportedly interested in, though low on the list. Interestingly, not WSU. Which goes along with my theory that the two schools aren't really on the same page and it looks like they may not be viewed as being on the same page. Still lots of talk about the Pac-2 being offered to join the ACC when it starts losing schools. And Dennis Dodd just put out a story saying that the interest in a joining between the Pac-2 and Mountain West is waning.
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Jul 15, 2024 17:33:51 GMT -8
There have been a few developments lately that could relate to what the podcasters in the OP were getting at. One is that the Big 12 is going after Florida State and Clemson and other teams in realignment. This has been talked about quite a bit in the last week or so but actual reporters are now going with it. Oregon State is among those other schools that the Big 12 is reportedly interested in, though low on the list. Interestingly, not WSU. Which goes along with my theory that the two schools aren't really on the same page and it looks like they may not be viewed as being on the same page. Still lots of talk about the Pac-2 being offered to join the ACC when it starts losing schools. And Dennis Dodd just put out a story saying that the interest in a joining between the Pac-2 and Mountain West is waning. Admittedly, I do not look at all this crap too closely......but I understand the main points. Forgive me if I'm off base, but how would the big 12 be able to land Clemson and FSU? Are these schools not B1G/SEC or bust?
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Post by grayman on Jul 15, 2024 17:42:47 GMT -8
There have been a few developments lately that could relate to what the podcasters in the OP were getting at. One is that the Big 12 is going after Florida State and Clemson and other teams in realignment. This has been talked about quite a bit in the last week or so but actual reporters are now going with it. Oregon State is among those other schools that the Big 12 is reportedly interested in, though low on the list. Interestingly, not WSU. Which goes along with my theory that the two schools aren't really on the same page and it looks like they may not be viewed as being on the same page. Still lots of talk about the Pac-2 being offered to join the ACC when it starts losing schools. And Dennis Dodd just put out a story saying that the interest in a joining between the Pac-2 and Mountain West is waning. Admittedly, I do not look at all this crap too closely......but I understand the main points. Forgive me if I'm off base, but how would the big 12 be able to land Clemson and FSU? Are these schools not B1G/SEC or bust? Private equity money. Apparently this has legs as far as the Big 12's intentions. Doesn't mean FSU and Clemson wind up there. FWIW, I think OSU's chances of getting an offer from the Big 12 go up if FSU and Clemson land in the SEC or Big Ten.
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Post by EmeraldEmpire on Jul 15, 2024 18:14:11 GMT -8
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Post by grayman on Jul 15, 2024 18:26:34 GMT -8
Dodd kind of approaches the story from the MWC point of view but my point is that the MWC is likely "cooling" to the Pac-2 because it's becoming more obvious that the MWC is not where the Pac-2 is looking. The fact that industry sources during various media days were telling him that they are cooling reinforces this IMO.
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Post by bvrbred on Jul 16, 2024 8:28:29 GMT -8
MWC wants to hold onto its claim to being the preeminent G5 conference. The claim rests on the football performance of about 4 of its 12 football members. The notion that OSU/WSU "Wouldn't add much" is ridiculous. The thought I had was this might be a ploy to instill panic in OSU/WSU. Given the hard bargain Nevarez drove on scheduling this wouldn't surprise me.
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Post by rgeorge on Jul 16, 2024 9:34:01 GMT -8
MWC wants to hold onto its claim to being the preeminent G5 conference. The claim rests on the football performance of about 4 of its 12 football members. The notion that OSU/WSU "Wouldn't add much" is ridiculous. The thought I had was this might be a ploy to instill panic in OSU/WSU. Given the hard bargain Nevarez drove on scheduling this wouldn't surprise me. It's Dennis Dodd... everything he says is click bait and multiple grains of salt needed. Even some of the quotes attributed to Gould make zero sense? Yeah adding actual P4 schools not adding value is pretty much a lame comment from supposed insiders. Now, maybe how and what OSU/WSU want to merge isn't attractive?? Or maybe the supposed preeminent teams want to stay as top dogs??
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2ndGenBeaver
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Post by 2ndGenBeaver on Jul 16, 2024 9:58:16 GMT -8
MWC wants to hold onto its claim to being the preeminent G5 conference. The claim rests on the football performance of about 4 of its 12 football members. The notion that OSU/WSU "Wouldn't add much" is ridiculous. The thought I had was this might be a ploy to instill panic in OSU/WSU. Given the hard bargain Nevarez drove on scheduling this wouldn't surprise me. It's Dennis Dodd... everything he says is click bait and multiple grains of salt needed. Even some of the quotes attributed to Gould make zero sense? Yeah adding actual P4 schools not adding value is pretty much a lame comment from supposed insiders. Now, maybe how and what OSU/WSU want to merge isn't attractive?? Or maybe the supposed preeminent teams want to stay as top dogs?? This latest news re: MWC screams "negotiating posture" to me more than anything. Yes, OSU/WSU would jump at a P4 invite, but I doubt any such invite is coming soon, and with the season upon us, P4 administrators will be distracted and looking to see "how things play out". Unless some other conference blows up soon, the clock is ticking on the Pac-2 needing a 'story' - schedule, recruiting, planning, etc. all hinge on getting things scheduled and conference affinities worked out. I have admired how the MWC has structured things to keep all their members on board, and I hope we don't try to use the "war chest" to attempt to fund a selective raid........Early next year we are probably at least trying to exercise year 2 of the schedule option, if not just announcing some kind of reverse merger/conglomeration of the MWC + Pac-2+ ? (could the shine come off the ACC for Standford and Cal?). I think to work on the media rights deals, we also need to have some crisp plan soon after this season winds up. But it's probably in the MWC's best interests to settle things sooner rather than later, and in the Pac-2's best interest to wait until the last second to step away from P4 aspirations, so....... negotiating posture. We will also have a better idea of how well sports like baseball and gymnastics have fared this time next year..... I found it more interesting that another force could be the networks and streaming media companies needing/wanting live sports inventory. A reformed west coast conference might be more interesting in the coming year if the economy upticks or large sports properties leave some network high and dry and needing stuff on the shelf or late night programming. I actually thought the Apple deal might have been more attractive than departing conference members painted it out to be, but that is water under the bridge now..... Go Beavers!
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Post by grayman on Jul 16, 2024 10:07:37 GMT -8
There was always going to be an issue with a reverse merger from the MWC point of view. There was always going to be an issue with full membership in the MWC from the Pac-2 point of view.
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Post by grayman on Jul 16, 2024 10:15:27 GMT -8
It's Dennis Dodd... everything he says is click bait and multiple grains of salt needed. Even some of the quotes attributed to Gould make zero sense? Yeah adding actual P4 schools not adding value is pretty much a lame comment from supposed insiders. Now, maybe how and what OSU/WSU want to merge isn't attractive?? Or maybe the supposed preeminent teams want to stay as top dogs?? This latest news re: MWC screams "negotiating posture" to me more than anything. Yes, OSU/WSU would jump at a P4 invite, but I doubt any such invite is coming soon, and with the season upon us, P4 administrators will be distracted and looking to see "how things play out". Unless some other conference blows up soon, the clock is ticking on the Pac-2 needing a 'story' - schedule, recruiting, planning, etc. all hinge on getting things scheduled and conference affinities worked out. I have admired how the MWC has structured things to keep all their members on board, and I hope we don't try to use the "war chest" to attempt to fund a selective raid........Early next year we are probably at least trying to exercise year 2 of the schedule option, if not just announcing some kind of reverse merger/conglomeration of the MWC + Pac-2+ ? (could the shine come off the ACC for Standford and Cal?). I think to work on the media rights deals, we also need to have some crisp plan soon after this season winds up. But it's probably in the MWC's best interests to settle things sooner rather than later, and in the Pac-2's best interest to wait until the last second to step away from P4 aspirations, so....... negotiating posture. We will also have a better idea of how well sports like baseball and gymnastics have fared this time next year..... I found it more interesting that another force could be the networks and streaming media companies needing/wanting live sports inventory. A reformed west coast conference might be more interesting in the coming year if the economy upticks or large sports properties leave some network high and dry and needing stuff on the shelf or late night programming. I actually thought the Apple deal might have been more attractive than departing conference members painted it out to be, but that is water under the bridge now..... Go Beavers! Cooling does not indicate preparation for negotiations. The Pac-2 has no reason to go into negotiations with the MWC anyway. All the MWC really offers is a landing place for football if no other options open up. There is no money to be had by joining the MWC.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Jul 16, 2024 10:55:29 GMT -8
There was always going to be an issue with a reverse merger from the MWC point of view. There was always going to be an issue with full membership in the MWC from the Pac-2 point of view. I think the MWC was absolutely fine with a reverse merger, probably wanted it immediately to boost their TV revenue under a new deal. They pretty much said if the Pac 2 took every team, they were in. The trick now is, because it didn’t happen right away, and there is no guarantee it’ll happen at all, the MWC is in the position of looking out for its own interests. According to Nevarrez they started to put some feelers out there in 2023 (that’s how they got a recent agreement with TNT to show some games). If the Pac 2 wants a reverse merger or to raid the MWC for teams they might want to get on the stick and get it done before the 25 season. My guess is a lot of the stories we’re hearing are basically versions of the first story, recounted by writers/podcasters/youtubers that might not have actually gone to the league press day or contacted many of the MWC schools. I could see the MWC getting impatient, especially with their existing TV contact expiring in June of 26.
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Post by grayman on Jul 16, 2024 11:04:46 GMT -8
There was always going to be an issue with a reverse merger from the MWC point of view. There was always going to be an issue with full membership in the MWC from the Pac-2 point of view. I think the MWC was absolutely fine with a reverse merger, probably wanted it immediately to boost their TV revenue under a new deal. They pretty much said if the Pac 2 took every team, they were in. The trick now is, because it didn’t happen right away, and there is no guarantee it’ll happen at all, the MWC is in the position of looking out for its own interests. According to Nevarrez they started to put some feelers out there in 2023 (that’s how they got a recent agreement with TNT to show some games). If the Pac 2 wants a reverse merger or to raid the MWC for teams they might want to get on the stick and get it done before the 25 season. My guess is a lot of the stories we’re hearing are basically versions of the first story, recounted by writers/podcasters/youtubers that might not have actually gone to the league press day or contacted many of the MWC schools. I could see the MWC getting impatient, especially with their existing TV contact expiring in June of 26. I don't believe the MWC and Nevarez in particular want to relinquish control to the degree that would be necessary for a reverse merger. Yes, the MWC is always looking out for its own interests. That would include the addition of OSU and WSU as full MWC members. I don't believe for a second the MWC believes it includes a reverse merger. And the MWC can be impatient all it wants. The Pac-2 is going to wait for as long as possible to see what happens in realignment.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Jul 16, 2024 15:07:36 GMT -8
I wanted to throw my two cents in there that the ACC lawsuits impact the enforceability of the Mountain West's grant of rights agreement. If Clemson and Florida State beat the ACC, then the Mountain West's Grant of Rights similarly is probably not worth the paper that it is written on.
Even if the ACC does not fracture apart beforehand, there is a possibility that a ruling in the ACC lawsuits can serve as persuasive authority in a lawsuit in say Clark and San Diego Counties.
Contrariwise, if the ACC wins, that might refocus Oregon State, Wazzu, and the Mountain West Universities into figuring out exactly what to do.
There is absolutely no rush at the moment. And, unless the Mountain West puts pressure on Oregon State and Wazzu, Oregon State and Wazzu will probably not working on anything concrete.
That said, until the Mountain West at least opens conversations with media partners, there really is pretty much absolutely nothing for Oregon State, Wazzu, and the Mountain West to talk about.
And a pro-CBS negotiating ploy masquerading as "news" is laughable.
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Post by Henry Skrimshander on Jul 17, 2024 8:33:58 GMT -8
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Post by grayman on Jul 17, 2024 10:33:16 GMT -8
Funny how FSU and Clemson haven't suddenly dropped their court cases against the ACC. The Big Ten and the SEC are not going to come out and say they want FSU and Clemson. They really can't at this point. Sankey's quote in particular was basically right down the middle. He absolutely gave no indication either way. The reports that have surfaced in recent days have all pointed to the Big 12 as a landing spot because Yormark is still open for business (Yep, something that you and others denied vociferously a few months ago). And the idea that the Big 12 is marginally better than the MWC is laughable. Huge gap. And acknowledged by TV money and CFP payouts, etc. Again, the Big 12 will try to bring those two schools in with a big money offer. IMO, I still think FSU and Clemson will probably wind up in the SEC or possibly the Big Ten with the SEC a more likely candidate. The Big 12 will target other teams in the ACC (even if it fails to bring in FSU and Clemson) and I think the Big Ten might actually want North Carolina and will eventually make a move to bring it in probably with another school. And I'm not burying the ACC, though it WILL lose some teams at some point in the near future. There's a solid chance it will move forward, just in a different form. There's a good chance that the remaining schools offer OSU and WSU in an effort to build up its West Coast presence. IMO that would work if SDSU and a few others (Boise State might be a problem for Stanford and Cal but if Stanford goes independent, then you go with Boise State for sure) were added so that there would be a full West Coast division to alleviate travel expenses. Even better, the Pac-12 merges with the ACC and retains its name.
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