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Post by spudbeaver on Dec 22, 2023 17:57:01 GMT -8
They will only be able to get out if FSU wins their case. Otherwise, Cal and Stanford are locked into the same agreement that FSU is trying to get out of. Good point... creates an interesting scenario that FSU uses Cal and Trees to get out of contract, then Cal and Trees use Cal and Trees to get out of the same contract.  A new Victory Chain Linker!!! Ha ha |
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Post by spudbeaver on Dec 22, 2023 17:59:55 GMT -8
Funny, I was going to make the re-joining prediction yesterday. I think both “smart” schools will soon realize they were stupid, not only in joining the ACC for literally no money, but for exiting the PAC so fast that they forgot to read the fine print! They are getting around 30% of the payout to the other teams in the ACC. SMU is the one getting zero. But, yes, it's still stupid Where I come from people get fired with prejudice for decisions like that! |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 22, 2023 19:40:37 GMT -8
I would point out that Duke is in a different boat than the North Carolinas, because the Eleventh Amendment does not protect them in the same way that it protects the state schools. Plus it is a really... really weak legal argument to include the one year "ranking" of a football program not being chosen to join as one of the reasons to leave a media contract. So, are they saying if OSU was added instead of or additionally FSU would not have filed? I mean they list numerous other indicators, but everything mentioned was approved by a league vote as per ACC bylaws. Pretty weak legal grounds, and reads a lot like the UW docs. A bunch of gibberish to state we believe we're better than the rest and want to leave. Personally, as with most who chided Cal and Furd, a move to the ACC would be plan stupid. Especially now with control of millions and all future monies. I read Florida State's whole Complaint. Part of their argument is that certain aspects of the Grant of Rights (I believe the extension beyond 2026) and the current media deal were not actually approved by a league vote per the ACC bylaws and therefore are invalid. It is not the main thrust of their arguments, but it is in there. Florida State filed their lawsuit in a location of their choosing (Leon County, Florida) and is arguing state-specific law to their benefit. The problem is that the ACC preemptively sued first, which makes Florida State's row a tougher one to hoe. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 22, 2023 19:45:38 GMT -8
In reading Florida State's Complaint, in reading between the lines, they hint that they think that Cal, SMU, and Stanford are not 100% in yet.
Having said that, Cal and Stanford probably cannot stay out, unless Florida State can get out.
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Post by irimi on Dec 22, 2023 19:53:24 GMT -8
Screw stanford and cal. No fricking way we take them back. Their bs helped cause the fall of the pac 12. I'd take them back. But keep their money. I like what they have to offer, both in academics and on the field. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 22, 2023 19:59:52 GMT -8
Screw stanford and cal. No fricking way we take them back. Their bs helped cause the fall of the pac 12. I'd take them back. But keep their money. I like what they have to offer, both in academics and on the field. They would be worth it to have back even with a full share. We have to be the bigger people, if we are going to either get an invite or to rebuild. Revenge is cathartic but not very helpful, unless we truly hold the cards. And I do not believe that we do. |
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Post by spudbeaver on Dec 22, 2023 21:24:53 GMT -8
I'd take them back. But keep their money. I like what they have to offer, both in academics and on the field. They would be worth it to have back even with a full share. We have to be the bigger people, if we are going to either get an invite or to rebuild. Revenge is cathartic but not very helpful, unless we truly hold the cards. And I do not believe that we do. I was with you right to the end. |
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Post by irimi on Dec 22, 2023 21:25:59 GMT -8
I'd take them back. But keep their money. I like what they have to offer, both in academics and on the field. They would be worth it to have back even with a full share. We have to be the bigger people, if we are going to either get an invite or to rebuild. Revenge is cathartic but not very helpful, unless we truly hold the cards. And I do not believe that we do. I think we got a nice piece of $$revenge$$ already. The way that I see it, Cal and Stanford ran away to join the ACC at a reduced rate and lost part of the Pac 12 money. They are hurting. If they had stayed, we would have had to split that money 4 ways. I'll take them back and thank them for the cash. |
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Post by ag87 on Dec 22, 2023 22:12:17 GMT -8
I know absolutely zip about the agreements that Stanford and Cal signed, but wondering out loud: Would the agreement call for the same draconian penalties on schools who have not yet officially entered as for those who have been members all along? Even if so, is it really enforceable? Cal and Stanford have zero monies coming from the ACC, so nothing to lose there. Would the ACC want to pursue them legally when they have the FSU thing hanging over their heads? Or would they just say, "OK, after further study, the San Francisco Bay is not fed by the Atlantic Ocean after all; we'll agree this was a bad idea to begin with." Not that I care whatsoever if Stanford and Cal are hoisted on their own petard; just wondering. If they wanted to come back, do we let them? Hell, yes. It regains the Northern California market and revives longstanding rivalries nd traditions. But, like the ACC, we don't give them a full share for 10 years.Hell yea! Our media rights are going to be about 30,000 per year (like a nice used car). We dont give them one more nickel than $16,000. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Dec 22, 2023 23:24:08 GMT -8
They would be worth it to have back even with a full share. We have to be the bigger people, if we are going to either get an invite or to rebuild. Revenge is cathartic but not very helpful, unless we truly hold the cards. And I do not believe that we do. I think we got a nice piece of $$revenge$$ already. The way that I see it, Cal and Stanford ran away to join the ACC at a reduced rate and lost part of the Pac 12 money. They are hurting. If they had stayed, we would have had to split that money 4 ways. I'll take them back and thank them for the cash. Winning hearts and minds! And when the next media contract negotiation comes up, Cal and Stanford in the Bay sign for big money and laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh. Part of the reason that the Pac-12 fell apart in the first place is that UCLA and USC felt like they were getting crapped on. They were making the conference a higher percentage money and were seeing only an equal share. But let's make it clear that we are crapping on Cal and Stanford from the get-go. Good way to set ourselves up for failure once again! |
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Post by mbabeav on Dec 23, 2023 8:49:33 GMT -8
Cal and Stanford panicked, sold out for next to nothing and now find themselves in a bad situation. We and wazzu resisted the panic and seem to be in a better place. We can be a bit magnanimous if need be should they want to jump at the chance to become part of a reconstituted pac 12.
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Post by bigorangebeaver on Dec 23, 2023 8:53:38 GMT -8
The ACC is falling apart..Fla. State is going to court to get out of the ACC and the N. Carolinas (+Duke) may not be far behind. Also, I know for a fact that there is huge and significant, campus-wide, dissatisfaction with Cal+ Stanford's crazy hasty decision to join a conference that's 3,000 miles away. And now that OSU+WSU have bigtime won their lawsuit against the PAC deserters, IMO and FWIW, watch for Cal+ Stanford to start making noises about rejoining the PAC within the next couple of years. Especially if FSU wins its lawsuit. If they wish to come back in, I would like to see a suitable level of groveling first. |
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Post by bigorangebeaver on Dec 23, 2023 8:58:33 GMT -8
You always hear how great an education you get from Stanford and Cal yet the people working there can sure make some stupid decisions. You can find stupid decisions at any university, or in any government entity, or any business, etc., come to that. Panic makes people stupid. |
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Post by beaverology on Dec 23, 2023 9:01:23 GMT -8
Remember, Stanford and Cal have no desire to play competitive sports against the academically unwashed (OSU and WSU). They have even less a desire to play sports against MWC members, let alone join a conference with the uncivilized. Could Stan/Cal be left with no choice to join and lower their standards? I hope so. But they'll do it kicking and screaming. Remember who sits above in the ivory tower.
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Post by bigorangebeaver on Dec 23, 2023 9:03:42 GMT -8
Plus it is a really... really weak legal argument to include the one year "ranking" of a football program not being chosen to join as one of the reasons to leave a media contract. So, are they saying if OSU was added instead of or additionally FSU would not have filed? I mean they list numerous other indicators, but everything mentioned was approved by a league vote as per ACC bylaws. Pretty weak legal grounds, and reads a lot like the UW docs. A bunch of gibberish to state we believe we're better than the rest and want to leave. Personally, as with most who chided Cal and Furd, a move to the ACC would be plan stupid. Especially now with control of millions and all future monies. I read Florida State's whole Complaint. Part of their argument is that certain aspects of the Grant of Rights (I believe the extension beyond 2026) and the current media deal were not actually approved by a league vote per the ACC bylaws and therefore are invalid. It is not the main thrust of their arguments, but it is in there. Florida State filed their lawsuit in a location of their choosing (Leon County, Florida) and is arguing state-specific law to their benefit. The problem is that the ACC preemptively sued first, which makes Florida State's row a tougher one to hoe. Apparently nobody reads the By Laws. The dueling legal actions are always fun. "Education is what you get when you read the fine print. Experience is what you get when you don't." Pete Seeger |
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