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Post by rmancarl on Dec 5, 2023 16:16:41 GMT -8
We've talked a lot about Point Guards the last few seasons, and I've often wondered if we are all on the same page as to what we are really talking about. Just for fun, I googled the definition of Point Guard. The definition was "the backcourt player who directs the team's offense". My question to posters on this board would be what role or aspects of the game do you consider to be attributed to a point guard? Second question is who do you think has been the player who has directed the Beaver's offense most often this early season?
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Dec 5, 2023 16:46:19 GMT -8
I think of the point guard as the backcourt player bringing the ball up the court. Secondary is directing the offense. Most point guards do both. However this season Rueck has used Talia and Raegan to run the offense at times. Donovyn and Kennedie are starting to run the offense more as they get more experience. Martha started out running the offense more because of her experience.
I like using Talia to run the offense without having to bring the ball up court. I really like having Raegan running the offense at the top of the key. She has amazing court vision. Having them as an option makes the Beavers more difficult to defend.
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Post by grad1973 on Dec 5, 2023 17:01:37 GMT -8
We by this weekend will fall behind most pack 12 schools in games played by four games. Is that because of the Italy trip. Ducks are behind other tesms also but not as much as us. Our rating is top 40 in the country. Well behind the 7 other schools in our league. Seems if we were more agrressive we might be rated higher by now. We are slow in developing i dont get this. Based on games played.
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Dec 5, 2023 17:24:04 GMT -8
We by this weekend will fall behind most pack 12 schools in games played by four games. Is that because of the Italy trip. Ducks are behind other tesms also but not as much as us. Our rating is top 40 in the country. Well behind the 7 other schools in our league. Seems if we were more agrressive we might be rated higher by now. We are slow in developing i dont get this. Based on games played. Don't worry we'll catch up. There is a limit to the number of out of conference games allowed. |
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Post by lotrader on Dec 5, 2023 17:46:51 GMT -8
believeinthebeavs good observation about TvO not bringing the ball from back court to the front court, but playing PG once the ball is in the front court. I like that Rueck mixes it up with this approach where Donovyn/Kennedie/Martha get the ball in the front court, and either they (traditional PG) or TvO run the offensive set. TvO is an excellent distributor of the ball as long as she doesn't hold the ball too long before either shooting or distributing. We are in a much better position than we were last season with competent PGs, offensively, and definitely defensively. Heck, I like it when Domonika takes the ball from back court to front court because she is lightning fast and has good handles.
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Post by grad1973 on Dec 5, 2023 18:57:08 GMT -8
believeinthebeavs good observation about TvO not bringing the ball from back court to the front court, but playing PG once the ball is in the front court. I like that Rueck mixes it up with this approach where Donovyn/Kennedie/Martha get the ball in the front court, and either they (traditional PG) or TvO run the offensive set. TvO is an excellent distributor of the ball as long as she doesn't hold the ball too long before either shooting or distributing. We are in a much better position than we were last season with competent PGs, offensively, and definitely defensively. Heck, I like it when Domonika takes the ball from back court to front court because she is lightning fast and has good handles. My only issue with this is its unnecessary. Donovan was getting the same assists as talia but she gives us scoring and defense talia cant do.  |
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Post by beaveragain on Dec 5, 2023 19:10:32 GMT -8
believeinthebeavs good observation about TvO not bringing the ball from back court to the front court, but playing PG once the ball is in the front court. I like that Rueck mixes it up with this approach where Donovyn/Kennedie/Martha get the ball in the front court, and either they (traditional PG) or TvO run the offensive set. TvO is an excellent distributor of the ball as long as she doesn't hold the ball too long before either shooting or distributing. We are in a much better position than we were last season with competent PGs, offensively, and definitely defensively. Heck, I like it when Domonika takes the ball from back court to front court because she is lightning fast and has good handles. My only issue with this is its unnecessary. Donovan was getting the same assists as talia but she gives us scoring and defense talia cant do. No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. |
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Post by grad1973 on Dec 5, 2023 19:32:12 GMT -8
My only issue with this is its unnecessary. Donovan was getting the same assists as talia but she gives us scoring and defense talia cant do. No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. Donovons assists to turn over ratio a two week ago was tops in the country . sorry i dont agree. Talia isnt shooting well but donovan much better. Face it who passes to players controls who scores, so another i disagree. My biggest problem with all this is talia speed is a liability defensively and because of thst we are keeping on the bench with little developement Dom. Dom started the seasin in double figures and great transition player and rebounder and so stick with the facts! Heres the thing talia scored forty last year amazing right but she cant do that against pac 12 competition. This is my concern. I have watched the pac 12 pass us Ruecks loyalties to players who are not ready for the pac 12. You watch in pac 12 play if we still keep relying on players the other teams in PAC 12 know how to defend we are toast! |
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Dec 5, 2023 19:44:36 GMT -8
No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. Donovons assists to turn over ratio a two week ago was tops in the country . sorry i dont agree. Talia isnt shooting well but donovan much better. Face it who passes to players controls who scores, so another i disagree. My biggest problem with all this is talia speed is a liability defensively and because of thst we are keeping on the bench with little developement Dom. Dom started the seasin in double figures and great transition player and rebounder and so stick with the facts! Heres the thing talia scored forty last year amazing right but she cant do that against pac 12 competition. This is my concern. I have watched the pac 12 pass us Ruecks loyalties to players who are not ready for the pac 12. You watch in pac 12 play if we still keep relying on players the other teams in PAC 12 know how to defend we are toast! Right now Donovyn is #1 in the country in assist to turnover ratio. That is the fact! |
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Post by lotrader on Dec 5, 2023 21:07:12 GMT -8
These are the kind of problems to have! These are not the problems we had the last couple of seasons. Having both TvO and the stable of guards we have now is so wonderful. Let's enjoy.
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Post by believeinthebeavs on Dec 5, 2023 21:27:13 GMT -8
My only issue with this is its unnecessary. Donovan was getting the same assists as talia but she gives us scoring and defense talia cant do. No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. What is the assist % and how is it computed? And where is the defense rating posted? I looked but couldn't find either |
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Post by rmancarl on Dec 5, 2023 21:47:08 GMT -8
Donovyn is off to a great start for the Beavs. She takes care of the ball, and is good passer. She's not at this point in her career a scorer. She doesn't drive to the hoop. She doesn't pop that mid-range shot with regularity. She looks to be average at 3pt shots. Nor does she take bad shots, make bad passes, or dribble into trouble. She's a solid starter in my opinion.
Talia is both a better passer, and a worse passer. The Talia of two years ago could take her defender to the hoop, finish her shot or pass to her big, stop and hit the mid-range jumper, or step behind her screen and hit the 3. She is struggling with most all of her shots (except free throws) right now, and I have no idea if she will get it back. I'm hoping it returns by Pac12 season.
This talk that Talia is too slow to score against Pac12 guards is just plain wrong. I still have some of the games from 2021/2022 on TV. Here's a small sampling of what she did against some decent opponents:
11/25/21 25pts against Notre Dame 4-8 from 3.
1/28/22 31pts against USC 5-10 from 3.
1/30/22 21pts against UCLA 4-6 from 3.
2/13/22 23pts, 12rbs, against oregon 3-3 from 3.
against New Mexico in the 3rd round of the NIT, 25pts 5-11 from 3
against UCLA in the 4th round of the NIT 19pts
It's easy to forget after what we saw last season, the last half in particular. With this current team, I still think she has the best chance to be that second offensive threat, but not if she doesn't get her shot back.
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Post by Werebeaver on Dec 5, 2023 21:55:58 GMT -8
No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. Donovons assists to turn over ratio a two week ago was tops in the country . sorry i dont agree. Talia isnt shooting well but donovan much better. Face it who passes to players controls who scores, so another i disagree. My biggest problem with all this is talia speed is a liability defensively and because of thst we are keeping on the bench with little developement Dom. Dom started the seasin in double figures and great transition player and rebounder and so stick with the facts! Heres the thing talia scored forty last year amazing right but she cant do that against pac 12 competition. This is my concern. I have watched the pac 12 pass us Ruecks loyalties to players who are not ready for the pac 12. You watch in pac 12 play if we still keep relying on players the other teams in PAC 12 know how to defend we are toast! Did you see anything you liked in our 6-0 start? Or is everything about Oregon State women’s basketball disturbing and upsetting to you? Kinda seems that way. |
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Post by rmancarl on Dec 5, 2023 22:00:41 GMT -8
I think of the point guard as the backcourt player bringing the ball up the court. Secondary is directing the offense. Most point guards do both. However this season Rueck has used Talia and Raegan to run the offense at times. Donovyn and Kennedie are starting to run the offense more as they get more experience. Martha started out running the offense more because of her experience. I like using Talia to run the offense without having to bring the ball up court. I really like having Raegan running the offense at the top of the key. She has amazing court vision. Having them as an option makes the Beavers more difficult to defend. This is exactly correct, and part of the reason I asked the question. Once the ball is in the front court Talia has ran the offense in the early season. You'll hear that from commentators and coaches. If you watch the early season games you can really notice. It's true that Donovyn and Kennedie are learning the role. Talia will always play a role, but as Dono gains experience, you will see her run the team more. Raegan has her own special role as well. That's another story. She's helped the team in so many ways! |
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Post by beaveragain on Dec 5, 2023 23:13:12 GMT -8
No, Donovan is a great freshman but her Assist % is 24 and Talia's is 36. And Talia gives rebounding, blocks, steals, and her defensive rating is 72 while Donovans is 87. Donovan is a great addition to the team, but let's not go wacky. If Talia can get her shot back, and that's a big if, she would easily be one of the top 10 guards in the country. What is the assist % and how is it computed? And where is the defense rating posted? I looked but couldn't find either "her hoop stats" |
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