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Post by grayman on Sept 9, 2023 13:34:15 GMT -8
Don’t think this would have to be a typical non-conf payout deal. Get a long-term, ideally sponsored, contract for alternating home-and-home series. Each school gets the revenue and controls the media deal when in their home stadium. Home series would start in Corvallis in 2024. The yapping from them about wanting to continue the CW is just yapping if they will not come to Corvallis in 2024. Call them on it - put up or shut up! Go Beavs! Very well said. They are the ones who left to the B1G that impacted this rivalry. OSU has done nothing different yet in any of this. Hole has. I will say this: If (and this is a big IF) OSU and WSU decided to go the Pac-2 independent two-year plan, then landing a contract to play UO and UW would go a long way in creating a schedule. That would give OSU and WSU six games a season for sure. AFAIK there is no minimum amount of games a team has to have on its schedule but the best route would be to get at least 10 in which then seems a lot more viable. Yes, schedules for Olympic sports would have to be figured out. Most likely that would be through an agreement with the WCC or something to that effect. And frankly that would have to be sorted out for a few of the sports no matter what happens. But that's for a different thread. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Sept 9, 2023 13:41:04 GMT -8
A game against uo might be tricky to schedule the next 2 years. IF the PAC takes in or joins the MWC, we'd likely be looking to fill OOC games on the first weekend of September or later on the year because we're already scheduled to play MWC games then.
Sounds easy, but uo is playing Texas Tech and one of ghe Oklahomas tose weekends and for sure they wont want to cancel those.
We both could buy out our respective games at the end of August in theory. The big trick is, I think for the Beavers that might mean losing an extra home game in one year, haven't looked at uo's whole schedules.
It'd be much easier to push a series a couple years out, if we were to continue the match up.
I still don't see the Beavers going the independent rout next year. That's a LOT of scheduling to do for multiple sports in a short time.
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Post by hawksea on Sept 9, 2023 16:40:51 GMT -8
I would say in this case it's more about the principle of it all. There are plenty of "big time" programs OSU can schedule if it so chooses. So money really isn't the issue, even if someone did offer a few million to keep it going. Diplomacy? OSU would be Neville Chamberlain. No tantrums. Just moving on to a new era. Suppose you’re driving across a long stretch of desert and notice that your gas tank is nearly empty. A sign says, “Last gas for 100 miles.” Unfortunately, the brand of gas is associated with an oil company that you consider to be unethical weasels. You have vowed to boycott their products. On principle, you drive past the gas station, run out of gas, and eventually die in the desert. Question: Were you principled or stupid? The answer is yes. You were both principled and stupid. And in this case, the principle that we are upholding is 100% pride.  Alright, Jan Brady, what "big time" team is it that we are getting a home-and-home with that isn't Oregon that's going result in a guaranteed sellout every other year to replace the Civil War? And why haven't we been scheduling that team all of these years? Is it George Glass University? There is no replacing Oregon with anyone comparable. The lack of travel. The media money. The gate. It just makes too much sense! We're Neville Chamberlain? One of the most powerful countries on Earth? What planet are you on? We're Edvard Beneš or Ignacy Mościcki at best. If we reject continuation of the Civil War, we would be Philippe Pétain, the man who rejected an English-French alliance by Winston Churchill and Charles de Gaulle. Pétain was attempting to try and ensure that the French kept their pride, their navy, and their colonies. The same a$$hole, who ordered the troops to fight the Americans at Algiers and killed my granduncle. Pride kept France from an alliance that could have saved their country from almost five years of German domination. The French could do it better on their own anyway. They didn't need the British, after all. Pétain spent most of the final months of the war as a prisoner in Germany. When it became obvious to the Germans that France would not be retaken, Pétain was released into Switzerland. 2 1/2 months after V-E Day, he was put on trial for treason and was convicted. He spent most of the rest of his life in prison before being moved to a hospital at the very end. Or, if you want to stay with British Prime Ministers, we would be Stanley Baldwin, the prime minister before Neville Chamberlain, who was so distrustful of France and the United States of America, that he goaded both into signing the Second London Naval Treaty of 1936 to limit the size of the American and French navies, even though Italy and Japan both refused to sign on, like they had at the First London Naval Treaty of 1930. There are very bad actors in this, but they are all in the Midwest and in Southern California. They got longtime rival Oregon to go along but only after UCLA, USC, Colorado, and Washington all flipped on the Pac-12. To self-flagellate, while your enemies grow stronger is stupid and counterproductive. We don't improve by not playing Oregon. The hole that we are currently in just gets bigger. The damage that has been done to Oregon State does not improve by travelling further to play lesser opponents for less money. The damage that has been done is rectified by beating Oregon year after year after year. I disagree. A better analogy would be your wife leaves you, takes the house and all the money, remarries, and once per year she calls you up once per year to come over to her house and torture you in front of her new husband, while paying you $10 as you smile and say thank you. |
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Post by nuclearbeaver on Sept 9, 2023 16:42:39 GMT -8
Suppose you’re driving across a long stretch of desert and notice that your gas tank is nearly empty. A sign says, “Last gas for 100 miles.” Unfortunately, the brand of gas is associated with an oil company that you consider to be unethical weasels. You have vowed to boycott their products. On principle, you drive past the gas station, run out of gas, and eventually die in the desert. Question: Were you principled or stupid? The answer is yes. You were both principled and stupid. And in this case, the principle that we are upholding is 100% pride. Alright, Jan Brady, what "big time" team is it that we are getting a home-and-home with that isn't Oregon that's going result in a guaranteed sellout every other year to replace the Civil War? And why haven't we been scheduling that team all of these years? Is it George Glass University? There is no replacing Oregon with anyone comparable. The lack of travel. The media money. The gate. It just makes too much sense! We're Neville Chamberlain? One of the most powerful countries on Earth? What planet are you on? We're Edvard Beneš or Ignacy Mościcki at best. If we reject continuation of the Civil War, we would be Philippe Pétain, the man who rejected an English-French alliance by Winston Churchill and Charles de Gaulle. Pétain was attempting to try and ensure that the French kept their pride, their navy, and their colonies. The same a$$hole, who ordered the troops to fight the Americans at Algiers and killed my granduncle. Pride kept France from an alliance that could have saved their country from almost five years of German domination. The French could do it better on their own anyway. They didn't need the British, after all. Pétain spent most of the final months of the war as a prisoner in Germany. When it became obvious to the Germans that France would not be retaken, Pétain was released into Switzerland. 2 1/2 months after V-E Day, he was put on trial for treason and was convicted. He spent most of the rest of his life in prison before being moved to a hospital at the very end. Or, if you want to stay with British Prime Ministers, we would be Stanley Baldwin, the prime minister before Neville Chamberlain, who was so distrustful of France and the United States of America, that he goaded both into signing the Second London Naval Treaty of 1936 to limit the size of the American and French navies, even though Italy and Japan both refused to sign on, like they had at the First London Naval Treaty of 1930. There are very bad actors in this, but they are all in the Midwest and in Southern California. They got longtime rival Oregon to go along but only after UCLA, USC, Colorado, and Washington all flipped on the Pac-12. To self-flagellate, while your enemies grow stronger is stupid and counterproductive. We don't improve by not playing Oregon. The hole that we are currently in just gets bigger. The damage that has been done to Oregon State does not improve by travelling further to play lesser opponents for less money. The damage that has been done is rectified by beating Oregon year after year after year. I disagree. A better analogy would be your wife leaves you, takes the house and all the money, remarries, and once per year she calls you up once per year to come over to her house and torture you in front of her new husband, while paying you $10 as you smile and say thank you. This seems like a very specific fetish. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Sept 9, 2023 17:33:58 GMT -8
Suppose you’re driving across a long stretch of desert and notice that your gas tank is nearly empty. A sign says, “Last gas for 100 miles.” Unfortunately, the brand of gas is associated with an oil company that you consider to be unethical weasels. You have vowed to boycott their products. On principle, you drive past the gas station, run out of gas, and eventually die in the desert. Question: Were you principled or stupid? The answer is yes. You were both principled and stupid. And in this case, the principle that we are upholding is 100% pride. Alright, Jan Brady, what "big time" team is it that we are getting a home-and-home with that isn't Oregon that's going result in a guaranteed sellout every other year to replace the Civil War? And why haven't we been scheduling that team all of these years? Is it George Glass University? There is no replacing Oregon with anyone comparable. The lack of travel. The media money. The gate. It just makes too much sense! We're Neville Chamberlain? One of the most powerful countries on Earth? What planet are you on? We're Edvard Beneš or Ignacy Mościcki at best. If we reject continuation of the Civil War, we would be Philippe Pétain, the man who rejected an English-French alliance by Winston Churchill and Charles de Gaulle. Pétain was attempting to try and ensure that the French kept their pride, their navy, and their colonies. The same a$$hole, who ordered the troops to fight the Americans at Algiers and killed my granduncle. Pride kept France from an alliance that could have saved their country from almost five years of German domination. The French could do it better on their own anyway. They didn't need the British, after all. Pétain spent most of the final months of the war as a prisoner in Germany. When it became obvious to the Germans that France would not be retaken, Pétain was released into Switzerland. 2 1/2 months after V-E Day, he was put on trial for treason and was convicted. He spent most of the rest of his life in prison before being moved to a hospital at the very end. Or, if you want to stay with British Prime Ministers, we would be Stanley Baldwin, the prime minister before Neville Chamberlain, who was so distrustful of France and the United States of America, that he goaded both into signing the Second London Naval Treaty of 1936 to limit the size of the American and French navies, even though Italy and Japan both refused to sign on, like they had at the First London Naval Treaty of 1930. There are very bad actors in this, but they are all in the Midwest and in Southern California. They got longtime rival Oregon to go along but only after UCLA, USC, Colorado, and Washington all flipped on the Pac-12. To self-flagellate, while your enemies grow stronger is stupid and counterproductive. We don't improve by not playing Oregon. The hole that we are currently in just gets bigger. The damage that has been done to Oregon State does not improve by travelling further to play lesser opponents for less money. The damage that has been done is rectified by beating Oregon year after year after year. I disagree. A better analogy would be your wife leaves you, takes the house and all the money, remarries, and once per year she calls you up once per year to come over to her house and torture you in front of her new husband, while paying you $10 as you smile and say thank you. Are you planning on losing to the Ducks? If so, yeah, chicken out. A more apt analogy would be you have the solid 9 blonde at the bar, who's ready to go and doesn't have a better option. But you're going to let her walk away with a neckbeard, because you just know that a perfect 10 is going to walk in 30 minutes before close. He who hesitates...... Oregon's the chick from The Offspring's Self Esteem. Be a dweeb, if you'd like. I worry that Oregon State is not going to have the money to be picky. But here we are, acting like we're Notre Dame. I don't wanna play Oregon. They hurt my feewings once. Get over yourself! This is The Godfather. Quit being Sonny. Be Michael! We'll bide our time and take down Salvatore Tessio, Victor Stracci, Philip Tattaglia, Emilio Barzini, Moe Greene, Carlo Rizzi, and Carmine Cuneo all in one foul swoop. It's not person; it's business! Don't make it personal, because it is not. |
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Post by lebaneaver on Sept 9, 2023 19:13:21 GMT -8
I disagree. A better analogy would be your wife leaves you, takes the house and all the money, remarries, and once per year she calls you up once per year to come over to her house and torture you in front of her new husband, while paying you $10 as you smile and say thank you. Are you planning on losing to the Ducks? If so, yeah, chicken out. A more apt analogy would be you have the solid 9 blonde at the bar, who's ready to go and doesn't have a better option. But you're going to let her walk away with a neckbeard, because you just know that a perfect 10 is going to walk in 30 minutes before close. He who hesitates...... Oregon's the chick from The Offspring's Self Esteem. Be a dweeb, if you'd like. I worry that Oregon State is not going to have the money to be picky. But here we are, acting like we're Notre Dame. I don't wanna play Oregon. They hurt my feewings once. Get over yourself! This is The Godfather. Quit being Sonny. Be Michael! We'll bide our time and take down Salvatore Tessio, Victor Stracci, Philip Tattaglia, Emilio Barzini, Moe Greene, Carlo Rizzi, and Carmine Cuneo all in one foul swoop. It's not person; it's business! Don't make it personal, because it is not. “Tattaglia’s a pimp…” |
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Post by Werebeaver on Sept 9, 2023 23:44:38 GMT -8
(no matter what happens with the legal action) about continuing the Civil War? Or having to do with any of these schools moving forward? Personally, I'm not sure Utah has any ill wishes toward OSU and WSU. Maybe there's another school (or two). that is similar in that respect. But the outcome here has a major bearing on the future of OSU's athletics and most of the defectors couldn't care less. I would say at the very least all ties should be cut with the Big Ten defectors unless it's to play in a bowl game or NCAA tournament. Oregon State makes millions each year, if they keep the Civil War going, even without a media contract. Someone would probably buy that game for at least four million, assuming both teams aren't just straight-up awful. When the Pacific Coast Conference fell apart in 1959, Oregon State kept scheduling the AAWU teams until they were invited back in. They played Stanford and Washington, home and home every year until Oregon State got the invite to rejoin in 1964. And they played Wazzu every year from 1959 to 1963, as well, even after Wazzu beat Oregon State back into the AAWU. Can you f#*king imagine what would have happened, if a bunch of arrogant a##holes back then had torpedoed any efforts to get back into the AAWU. Diplomacy kids. You beat 'em on the field. They schedule someone else and that team makes millions and laughs and laughs and laughs at Oregon State's pride. If you shut out the defectors, you only hurt yourself. You could probably schedule six of the former Pac-12 teams for each of the next two years, if we want to. Then, hopefully, only four more years with a former Pac-12-heavy nonconference schedule before the inevitable invite comes for Oregon State to join back up with one or more of the Pac-12 teams. That is, unless we seclude ourselves in a little mini-tantrum that absolutely no one notices, as everyone else moves to fill the vacuum that we stupidly created.  |
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Post by bvrbred on Sept 10, 2023 10:39:34 GMT -8
I don't see an invite for Oregon State to join one or more former Pac12 teams as inevitable. How would it happen? OR/WA leave the Big10 (and all that promised media money) and decide to come home to form a Pac conference? Or the Big10 invites Oregon State to join? Both are beyond my wildest fantasies. The ACC inviting Oreogn State? Even wilder. The Big12 inviting Oregon State? Possible but I wouldn't call it inevitable. The legacy Pac schools splitting off from the Big12 and forming a new western conference? Possibly our best bet for playing in a conference with legacy Pac teams again. I believe they would likely invite OSU/WSU to join. But this assumes they would split off int the first place.
The reconstitution of the old PCC I believe was inevitable but was under quite a bit different circumstances. It wasn't about TV money. It was about scheduling. The Big 5 only had 4 conference games a year. That meant they had to go on the hunt for six other games. There were a lot more independent teams back then but even so coming up with 6 games/year had to have been a hassle for athletic departments. I don't believe the LA schools were scheduling NW schools apart from UW after 1960. And scheduling the SW schools would become more difficul after the WAC formed in 1961. And, the Oregon schools had reputations for being good. Oregon was in the hunt for the Rose Bowl in 1959 before Oregon State beat them, and went to bowl games in 1960 and 63. Oregon State got bowl invites in 1960 and 62, not to mention a Heisman winner before anyone else in either the AAWU or PCC had had one.
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Post by grayman on Sept 10, 2023 11:09:33 GMT -8
I don't see an invite for Oregon State to join one or more former Pac12 teams as inevitable. How would it happen? OR/WA leave the Big10 (and all that promised media money) and decide to come home to form a Pac conference? Or the Big10 invites Oregon State to join? Both are beyond my wildest fantasies. The ACC inviting Oreogn State? Even wilder. The Big12 inviting Oregon State? Possible but I wouldn't call it inevitable. The legacy Pac schools splitting off from the Big12 and forming a new western conference? Possibly our best bet for playing in a conference with legacy Pac teams again. I believe they would likely invite OSU/WSU to join. But this assumes they would split off int the first place. The reconstitution of the old PCC I believe was inevitable but was under quite a bit different circumstances. It wasn't about TV money. It was about scheduling. The Big 5 only had 4 conference games a year. That meant they had to go on the hunt for six other games. There were a lot more independent teams back then but even so coming up with 6 games/year had to have been a hassle for athletic departments. I don't believe the LA schools were scheduling NW schools apart from UW after 1960. And scheduling the SW schools would become more difficul after the WAC formed in 1961. And, the Oregon schools had reputations for being good. Oregon was in the hunt for the Rose Bowl in 1959 before Oregon State beat them, and went to bowl games in 1960 and 63. Oregon State got bowl invites in 1960 and 62, not to mention a Heisman winner before anyone else in either the AAWU or PCC had had one. This is an interesting scenario that I've also mulled over. It's unlikely to happen because I think Colorado is gone for sure and UA and ASU are most likely all-in for the Big 12. I could almost see Utah being tempted a bit (I don't think the Utes are all that gung-ho about joining BYU) but no way if it's just them with OSU and WSU. There is one way it could happen, though. If OSU and WSU were able to negotiate a deal with Apple or others that depended on the addition of four or more Pac-12 teams (maybe Cal goes for it?). Then you might be able to land enough to go for it. And you could use those six as a foundation to "rebuild" the conference. But yeah, seems pretty unlikely. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Sept 10, 2023 22:10:00 GMT -8
I don't see an invite for Oregon State to join one or more former Pac12 teams as inevitable. How would it happen? OR/WA leave the Big10 (and all that promised media money) and decide to come home to form a Pac conference? Or the Big10 invites Oregon State to join? Both are beyond my wildest fantasies. The ACC inviting Oregon State? Even wilder. The Big12 inviting Oregon State? Possible but I wouldn't call it inevitable. The legacy Pac schools splitting off from the Big12 and forming a new western conference? Possibly our best bet for playing in a conference with legacy Pac teams again. I believe they would likely invite OSU/WSU to join. But this assumes they would split off int the first place. The reconstitution of the old PCC I believe was inevitable but was under quite a bit different circumstances. It wasn't about TV money. It was about scheduling. The Big 5 only had 4 conference games a year. That meant they had to go on the hunt for six other games. There were a lot more independent teams back then but even so coming up with 6 games/year had to have been a hassle for athletic departments. I don't believe the LA schools were scheduling NW schools apart from UW after 1960. And scheduling the SW schools would become more difficul after the WAC formed in 1961. And, the Oregon schools had reputations for being good. Oregon was in the hunt for the Rose Bowl in 1959 before Oregon State beat them, and went to bowl games in 1960 and 63. Oregon State got bowl invites in 1960 and 62, not to mention a Heisman winner before anyone else in either the AAWU or PCC had had one. After the service academies stopped a nationwide conference, the remaining five PCC teams created the AAWU. At Washington's insistence, they added Wazzu in 1962. At Stanford, Washington, and Wazzu's insistence (half the conference at that point), both Oregons were re-added after Oregon State made it known that they would not come alone. Penn State threatened to leave the Big Ten in 2012, if more Eastern teams were not added to reduce travel expenses, and the Big Ten added Maryland and Rutgers. If any of the former Pac-12 teams push for Oregon State's inclusion in the new conference, it may happen. The Big Ten feels like a longshot, because of the whole AAU thing, but it's always possible, if Oregon State just crushes it over the next six years. And isn't a complete malcontent whiner, who tries to burn all of the bridges with the old Pac-12 members, in the meantime. The 1959-1963 era provides a great framework for how Oregon State moves forward, not as a bunch of malcontent whiners, but as a university who takes the shot, schedules and beats most of their old conference mates, and builds their way out of their situation to something better, e.g., a Liberty Bowl win and Heisman Trophy in 1962 and Final Four in 1963. After five years out of the AAWU, Oregon State won the AAWU their first year back in 1964. |
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Post by rgeorge on Sept 10, 2023 22:45:29 GMT -8
I'll just say, any type of comparison to the 1959 to ?? era is nonsensical.
The "game" being played on and off the field isn't remotely the same.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Sept 10, 2023 23:00:55 GMT -8
I'll just say, any type of comparison to the 1959 to ?? era is nonsensical. The "game" being played on and off the field isn't remotely the same. That is like saying that there was nothing to learn Napoleonic Wars in the American Civil War. Or hell, nothing to learn from the Second Punic War in the Napoleonic Wars.  I love the painting, because you can see Hannibal's name carved in rock right below Napoleon's, as Napoleon crossed the Alps to win the Battle of Marengo, cut off the Austrian Army, and win the War of the Second Coalition. I have a picture of me in front of a copy at the Cafe Napoleon in New Orleans, which was originally built to serve as Napoleon's house should the Americans rescue Napoleon from Saint Helena. The finer points change over the decades but the larger themes rarely change. |
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Post by rgeorge on Sept 11, 2023 7:49:51 GMT -8
I'll just say, any type of comparison to the 1959 to ?? era is nonsensical. The "game" being played on and off the field isn't remotely the same. That is like saying that there was nothing to learn Napoleonic Wars in the American Civil War. Or hell, nothing to learn from the Second Punic War in the Napoleonic Wars. I love the painting, because you can see Hannibal's name carved in rock right below Napoleon's, as Napoleon crossed the Alps to win the Battle of Marengo, cut off the Austrian Army, and win the War of the Second Coalition. I have a picture of me in front of a copy at the Cafe Napoleon in New Orleans, which was originally built to serve as Napoleon's house should the Americans rescue Napoleon from Saint Helena. The finer points change over the decades but the larger themes rarely change. Larger themes certainly do change... There were no media deals & conferences weren't realigned because of them. Apples to plastic... as is consistent using of battle/war analogies. |
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Post by rgeorge on Sept 11, 2023 7:51:04 GMT -8
I'll just say, any type of comparison to the 1959 to ?? era is nonsensical. The "game" being played on and off the field isn't remotely the same. That is like saying that there was nothing to learn Napoleonic Wars in the American Civil War. Or hell, nothing to learn from the Second Punic War in the Napoleonic Wars. I love the painting, because you can see Hannibal's name carved in rock right below Napoleon's, as Napoleon crossed the Alps to win the Battle of Marengo, cut off the Austrian Army, and win the War of the Second Coalition. I have a picture of me in front of a copy at the Cafe Napoleon in New Orleans, which was originally built to serve as Napoleon's house should the Americans rescue Napoleon from Saint Helena. The finer points change over the decades but the larger themes rarely change. Larger themes certainly do change... There were no media deals & conferences weren't realigned because of them. Apples to plastic... as is consistent use of battle/war analogies. |
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Post by rgeorge on Sept 11, 2023 7:51:28 GMT -8
I'll just say, any type of comparison to the 1959 to ?? era is nonsensical. The "game" being played on and off the field isn't remotely the same. That is like saying that there was nothing to learn Napoleonic Wars in the American Civil War. Or hell, nothing to learn from the Second Punic War in the Napoleonic Wars. I love the painting, because you can see Hannibal's name carved in rock right below Napoleon's, as Napoleon crossed the Alps to win the Battle of Marengo, cut off the Austrian Army, and win the War of the Second Coalition. I have a picture of me in front of a copy at the Cafe Napoleon in New Orleans, which was originally built to serve as Napoleon's house should the Americans rescue Napoleon from Saint Helena. The finer points change over the decades but the larger themes rarely change. Larger themes certainly do change... There were no media deals & conferences weren't realigned because of them. Apples to plastic... as is consistent use of battle/war analogies. |
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