|
|
Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 25, 2023 15:44:33 GMT -8
I mean "changed?".......if it's us, Wazzu, and the MW, it will be the Pac in name only. I can't remember exactly what years the mountain schools joined right off the top of my head,('78 and '11 by the way, but had to look it up) and I've actually followed this stuff. If the PAC still exists in '24 and beyond, in a relatively few years the goings on of today will fade somewhat. I was reading Disney over the years has literally absorbed 200 companies, many of them quite big, it's still Disney. If the Pac still exists in several years, there will be very few saying "it's the Pac in name only". Nothing has happened on this scale, to this conference, since it's inception.....as it stands, the conference is no longer a conference. The members who bailed will remain in a P5 conference, while we will absorb G5 schools to become a G5 conference with the Pac name.....and I don't want to hear about how the conference almost failed before.....different time. Different money. It's not comparable. None of us has a crystal ball, but do you see a path back to P5 by absorbing the MW schools? It seems to me this is a systematic tiering of universities based on tv market/AD strength/etc......there will be the "national" tier and all the "regional" tiers below that.....the broke Pac mountain will be a lesser regional tier.....UNLESS this all falls apart and it goes back to more traditional conferences...... obviously that would be best case scenario. |
|
|
|
Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Aug 25, 2023 15:57:13 GMT -8
I can't remember exactly what years the mountain schools joined right off the top of my head,('78 and '11 by the way, but had to look it up) and I've actually followed this stuff. If the PAC still exists in '24 and beyond, in a relatively few years the goings on of today will fade somewhat. I was reading Disney over the years has literally absorbed 200 companies, many of them quite big, it's still Disney. If the Pac still exists in several years, there will be very few saying "it's the Pac in name only". Nothing has happened on this scale, to this conference, since it's inception.....as it stands, the conference is no longer a conference. The members who bailed will remain in a P5 conference, while we will absorb G5 schools to become a G5 conference with the Pac name.....and I don't want to hear about how the conference almost failed before.....different time. Different money. It's not comparable. None of us has a crystal ball, but do you see a path back to P5 by absorbing the MW schools? It seems to me this is a systematic tiering of universities based on tv market/AD strength/etc......there will be the "national" tier and all the "regional" tiers below that.....the broke Pac mountain will be a lesser regional tier.....UNLESS this all falls apart and it goes back to more traditional conferences...... obviously that would be best case scenario. California, Stanford, UCLA, USC, and Washington literally dissolved the Pacific Coast Conference by a vote in 1958. They screwed up, though, and there was one final football season in 1959. Oregon and Oregon Sate were football independents for four years and five years in sports other than football. I don't know whether the money compares or not, because it was, as you say, a different time, but it was highly comparable. Brigham Young, TCU, and Utah were all Mountain West teams in 2010. TCU beat #24 Oregon State in Arlington, Baylor, #6 Utah in Salt Lake City (and the other seven Mountain West teams at the time, including BYU), and #4 Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl at season's end. Utah became a Pac-12 team in 2011, and TCU became a Big 12 team in 2012. Brigham Young has been toiling as a football independent but joined the Big 12 this year. So, yes, I see more American and Mountain West teams getting absorbed, because it almost literally happens all of the time. |
|
|
|
Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 25, 2023 16:03:25 GMT -8
Nothing has happened on this scale, to this conference, since it's inception.....as it stands, the conference is no longer a conference. The members who bailed will remain in a P5 conference, while we will absorb G5 schools to become a G5 conference with the Pac name.....and I don't want to hear about how the conference almost failed before.....different time. Different money. It's not comparable. None of us has a crystal ball, but do you see a path back to P5 by absorbing the MW schools? It seems to me this is a systematic tiering of universities based on tv market/AD strength/etc......there will be the "national" tier and all the "regional" tiers below that.....the broke Pac mountain will be a lesser regional tier.....UNLESS this all falls apart and it goes back to more traditional conferences...... obviously that would be best case scenario. California, Stanford, UCLA, USC, and Washington literally dissolved the Pacific Coast Conference by a vote in 1958. They screwed up, though, and there was one final football season in 1959. Oregon and Oregon Sate were football independents for four years and five years in sports other than football. I don't know whether the money compares or not, because it was, as you say, a different time, but it was highly comparable. Brigham Young, TCU, and Utah were all Mountain West teams in 2010. TCU beat #24 Oregon State in Arlington, Baylor, #6 Utah in Salt Lake City (and the other seven Mountain West teams at the time, including BYU), and #4 Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl at season's end. Utah became a Pac-12 team in 2011, and TCU became a Big 12 team in 2012. Brigham Young has been toiling as a football independent but joined the Big 12 this year. So, yes, I see more American and Mountain West teams getting absorbed, because it almost literally happens all of the time. It's not comparable unless this realignment falls apart, and things kinda go back to what they were.......this feels like a a crossroads in college football, and the road we are being forced down is Left out lane......I mean anything can happen in the future, but the financial gap between the haves, and have nots is going to be bigger than ever.....and with NIL.....the college football we grew up with is dying. This is becoming a whole different animal. |
|
|
|
Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Aug 25, 2023 16:05:48 GMT -8
California, Stanford, UCLA, USC, and Washington literally dissolved the Pacific Coast Conference by a vote in 1958. They screwed up, though, and there was one final football season in 1959. Oregon and Oregon Sate were football independents for four years and five years in sports other than football. I don't know whether the money compares or not, because it was, as you say, a different time, but it was highly comparable. Brigham Young, TCU, and Utah were all Mountain West teams in 2010. TCU beat #24 Oregon State in Arlington, Baylor, #6 Utah in Salt Lake City (and the other seven Mountain West teams at the time, including BYU), and #4 Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl at season's end. Utah became a Pac-12 team in 2011, and TCU became a Big 12 team in 2012. Brigham Young has been toiling as a football independent but joined the Big 12 this year. So, yes, I see more American and Mountain West teams getting absorbed, because it almost literally happens all of the time. It's not comparable unless this realignment falls apart, and things kinda go back to what they were.......this feels like a a crossroads in college football, and the road we are being forced down is Left out lane......I mean anything can happen in the future, but the financial gap between the haves and have nots is going to bigger than ever.....and with NIL.....the college football we grew up with is dying. This is becoming a whole different animal. Things change all the time. You either adapt or die. It is basically the same in all situations. Piss, moan, and die. Or regroup, rebuild, and attack. |
|
|
|
Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 25, 2023 16:12:56 GMT -8
It's not comparable unless this realignment falls apart, and things kinda go back to what they were.......this feels like a a crossroads in college football, and the road we are being forced down is Left out lane......I mean anything can happen in the future, but the financial gap between the haves and have nots is going to bigger than ever.....and with NIL.....the college football we grew up with is dying. This is becoming a whole different animal. Things change all the time. You either adapt or die. It is basically the same in all situations. Piss, moan, and die. Or regroup, rebuild, and attack. You do realize that we are in the position we are in currently, because we've been a pretty bad football program, and men's B ball program, overall, for like a long time, right? The time for adapting was long ago, if we wanted a seat at the big table......well, that time has passed......so we drop down to G5 and keep supporting our team.....it's funny, you guys act like I'm some nay sayer, Debbie downer...... I'm not goin anywhere, and all I'm doing is stating reality. |
|
|
|
Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Aug 25, 2023 16:22:11 GMT -8
Things change all the time. You either adapt or die. It is basically the same in all situations. Piss, moan, and die. Or regroup, rebuild, and attack. You do realize that we are in the position we are in currently, because we've been a pretty bad football program, and men's B ball program, overall, for like a long time, right? The time for adapting was long ago, if we wanted a seat at the big table......well, that time has passed......so we drop down to G5 and keep supporting our team.....it's funny, you guys act like I'm some nay sayer, Debbie downer...... I'm not goin anywhere, and all I'm doing is stating reality. I agree with much of what you say, but things could work out for the better. Look at Tulane and Vandy. One stayed with the SEC and the other left. Which one is more successful now? |
|
|
|
Post by flyfishinbeav on Aug 25, 2023 16:31:38 GMT -8
I shouldn't say bad.....I mean nationally relevant
|
|
|
|
Post by angrybeaver67 on Aug 25, 2023 16:33:03 GMT -8
Very interesting, Willie…! I did not know the history.
In 1963 - Oregon State had Oregon’s back and wouldn’t let them get screwed with conference realignment.
In 2023 - Oregon stabbed Oregon State in the back on conference realignment.
Only 60 years later… Another reason to hate the Ducks!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by orangeattack on Aug 25, 2023 17:22:23 GMT -8
California, Stanford, UCLA, USC, and Washington literally dissolved the Pacific Coast Conference by a vote in 1958. They screwed up, though, and there was one final football season in 1959. Oregon and Oregon Sate were football independents for four years and five years in sports other than football. I don't know whether the money compares or not, because it was, as you say, a different time, but it was highly comparable. Brigham Young, TCU, and Utah were all Mountain West teams in 2010. TCU beat #24 Oregon State in Arlington, Baylor, #6 Utah in Salt Lake City (and the other seven Mountain West teams at the time, including BYU), and #4 Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl at season's end. Utah became a Pac-12 team in 2011, and TCU became a Big 12 team in 2012. Brigham Young has been toiling as a football independent but joined the Big 12 this year. So, yes, I see more American and Mountain West teams getting absorbed, because it almost literally happens all of the time. It's not comparable unless this realignment falls apart, and things kinda go back to what they were.......this feels like a a crossroads in college football, and the road we are being forced down is Left out lane......I mean anything can happen in the future, but the financial gap between the haves, and have nots is going to be bigger than ever.....and with NIL.....the college football we grew up with is dying. This is becoming a whole different animal. The 85 scholarship rule had a bigger effect on the game than any of this. Title IX had a bigger effect than any of this. This is not the first shakeup to hit college football, and it's not earth-shattering in terms of precedent, as Wilky pointed out extensively. It's just the biggest thing to hit college football lately is all. Destroyed a bunch of rivalries, destroyed West Coast football.... for now. There is no way to know how it's going to turn out in the future, and this may actually end up harming a bunch of the momentum that programs like Oregon have worked so hard to achieve. Let's be real for a moment. Oregon State has mostly been on the wrong side of refereeing inside of Pac12 games, and part of that is due to mostly being the underdog and the league to some degree having preference for their marquee teams. It's absolutely a true statement, bias exists and it is real. Oregon and SC in particular have been the beneficiary of questionable calls by zebra crews. That's about to go the opposite direction, for sure for the Ducks at least. They aren't going to get the benefit of calls against Michigan or Ohio State, the travel is going to be brutal. If Uncle Phil kicks the bucket, what happens to their pockets? Even if there is a path of succession set up to ensure support, it is never the same. Paul Allen died and the Blazers lost what was making it an organization that had a chance at building around their star. Now Lillard is asking for a trade, and the Blazers are headed for the dumpster. A similar level of damage could be dealt to Oregon's athletics program. They're going from arguably the marquee program on the West Coast to mid-tier. |
|
|
|
Post by seastape on Aug 25, 2023 17:36:58 GMT -8
Things change all the time. You either adapt or die. It is basically the same in all situations. Piss, moan, and die. Or regroup, rebuild, and attack. You do realize that we are in the position we are in currently, because we've been a pretty bad football program, and men's B ball program, overall, for like a long time, right? The time for adapting was long ago, if we wanted a seat at the big table......well, that time has passed......so we drop down to G5 and keep supporting our team.....it's funny, you guys act like I'm some nay sayer, Debbie downer...... I'm not goin anywhere, and all I'm doing is stating reality. This is the best post on this thread. |
|
|
|
Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Aug 25, 2023 18:04:47 GMT -8
Very interesting, Willie…! I did not know the history. In 1963 - Oregon State had Oregon’s back and wouldn’t let them get screwed with conference realignment. In 2023 - Oregon stabbed Oregon State in the back on conference realignment. Only 60 years later… Another reason to hate the Ducks!!! To be fair to Oregon and Oregon State, there was a combined Department of Higher Education in Oregon until 2013. And then Oregon and Portland State pushed to get rid of the combined Department and allow each school do what it wanted. Oregon State went along without a fuss, which is now biting us. |
|
|
|
Post by Judge Smails on Aug 25, 2023 18:06:44 GMT -8
Very interesting, Willie…! I did not know the history. In 1963 - Oregon State had Oregon’s back and wouldn’t let them get screwed with conference realignment. In 2023 - Oregon stabbed Oregon State in the back on conference realignment. Only 60 years later… Another reason to hate the Ducks!!! To be fair to Oregon and Oregon State, there was a combined Department of Higher Education in Oregon until 2013. And then Oregon and Portland State pushed to get rid of the combined Department and allow each school do what it wanted. Oregon State went along without a fuss, which is now biting us. [b Well, we didn’t get screwed over as bad as Portland St. in that deal, so we got that going for us, which is nice. |
|
|
|
Post by spudbeaver on Aug 25, 2023 19:02:36 GMT -8
Change our name to a color, and cheat like an SOB? Well, ok.
|
|
|
|
Post by rgeorge on Aug 25, 2023 21:01:49 GMT -8
To be fair to Oregon and Oregon State, there was a combined Department of Higher Education in Oregon until 2013. And then Oregon and Portland State pushed to get rid of the combined Department and allow each school do what it wanted. Oregon State went along without a fuss, which is now biting us. [b Well, we didn’t get screwed over as bad as Portland St. in that deal, so we got that goe fairing for us, which is nice. And, to be fair it took legislation to change the system. Would OSU making a fuss mattered? Doubt it |
|
|
|
Post by korculabeav on Aug 26, 2023 5:48:14 GMT -8
How did the dissolution of OUS hurt OSU?
|
|
