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Post by beaverwbb fan on Feb 4, 2023 18:11:10 GMT -8
Lot of discussion about OSU WBB and what has potentially gone wrong over the years. This post is my attempt at trying to use some stats (from HerHoopsStats) to point out some trends. I'll be looking at the 2013-14 season and onward.
1. Pace - There's a lot of discussion about OSU playing too slow and Rueck not adapting, however this year is by far the fastest OSU has played. For the first time they're averaging over 70 possessions per 40 minutes (71.1) and for the first time they're over the 50th percentile in pace (54%, previous high was 34% in 2020-21).
2. FG% - Until the past two seasons, OSU was never below 85th percentile (and was generally in the mid- to high-90th percentile) in FG%. The past two years they were 76% and 74%. Simply not the efficiency we're used to.
3. 3FG% - The disparity here is even worse. OSU had never been below the 93rd percentile in 3FG% until the past two years. Last year fell to the 78th percentile and this year the 40th percentile.
4. DEF RTG - This is measured by opponents points scored per 100 possessions. Our defense took a massive fall in 2020-21. Prior to that season OSU never had a DEF RTG over 90, and the past three years it has been 98.0, 90.8, and 91.2.
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Post by beavaristotle on Feb 4, 2023 19:06:31 GMT -8
Great information. Easy to see what the problems are, answers might be a little more difficult to find
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Post by grayman on Feb 4, 2023 19:34:30 GMT -8
Lot of discussion about OSU WBB and what has potentially gone wrong over the years. This post is my attempt at trying to use some stats (from HerHoopsStats) to point out some trends. I'll be looking at the 2013-14 season and onward. 1. Pace - There's a lot of discussion about OSU playing too slow and Rueck not adapting, however this year is by far the fastest OSU has played. For the first time they're averaging over 70 possessions per 40 minutes (71.1) and for the first time they're over the 50th percentile in pace (54%, previous high was 34% in 2020-21). 2. FG% - Until the past two seasons, OSU was never below 85th percentile (and was generally in the mid- to high-90th percentile) in FG%. The past two years they were 76% and 74%. Simply not the efficiency we're used to. 3. 3FG% - The disparity here is even worse. OSU had never been below the 93rd percentile in 3FG% until the past two years. Last year fell to the 78th percentile and this year the 40th percentile. 4. DEF RTG - This is measured by opponents points scored per 100 possessions. Our defense took a massive fall in 2020-21. Prior to that season OSU never had a DEF RTG over 90, and the past three years it has been 98.0, 90.8, and 91.2. I believe one major reason for the increase in pace is the arrival of Bendu Yeaney. She adds a level of speed and quickness that the Beavers really only had in one other player, Destiny Slocum. Add Aaron, Marotte, now Gardiner and even Mannen (yes, she plays at a fairly frenetic pace) into the mix. Has Rueck changed his philosophy? No. Has he loosened the reigns a bit? Very likely. I believe he has more trust in Yeaney's ability to push the pace than he has had in any other player to this point. Unfortunately, Yeaney is not a naturally gifted passer. So the Beavers continue to lack that aspect that a top point guard would bring to the table. IMO, that leads into a main reason behind the slide in shooting percentage, both 2s and 3s. Defense is a different beast altogether. This team seems confused about how to deal with good ball/player movement. The struggles also coincide with the Beavers taking more hits through the portal.
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Post by beaveragain on Feb 4, 2023 21:46:07 GMT -8
The flip side of b. fan's point is the defense. For the past three years OSU 3 point defense has been over 30%, and it's previously been under 30% since 2013. The team keeps having new players at the guard position and it takes 2/3 of a season to play defense the Beav's way. So over and over it takes the new folks a while to learn the ropes.
Meanwhile the interior has had experience inside and the Beav's 2 point defense has stayed consistently in the high 90th percentile.
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Post by hoopheritic on Feb 5, 2023 9:07:57 GMT -8
Lot of discussion about OSU WBB and what has potentially gone wrong over the years. This post is my attempt at trying to use some stats (from HerHoopsStats) to point out some trends. I'll be looking at the 2013-14 season and onward. 1. Pace - There's a lot of discussion about OSU playing too slow and Rueck not adapting, however this year is by far the fastest OSU has played. For the first time they're averaging over 70 possessions per 40 minutes (71.1) and for the first time they're over the 50th percentile in pace (54%, previous high was 34% in 2020-21). 2. FG% - Until the past two seasons, OSU was never below 85th percentile (and was generally in the mid- to high-90th percentile) in FG%. The past two years they were 76% and 74%. Simply not the efficiency we're used to. 3. 3FG% - The disparity here is even worse. OSU had never been below the 93rd percentile in 3FG% until the past two years. Last year fell to the 78th percentile and this year the 40th percentile. 4. DEF RTG - This is measured by opponents points scored per 100 possessions. Our defense took a massive fall in 2020-21. Prior to that season OSU never had a DEF RTG over 90, and the past three years it has been 98.0, 90.8, and 91.2. I believe one major reason for the increase in pace is the arrival of Bendu Yeaney. She adds a level of speed and quickness that the Beavers really only had in one other player, Destiny Slocum. Add Aaron, Marotte, now Gardiner and even Mannen (yes, she plays at a fairly frenetic pace) into the mix. Has Rueck changed his philosophy? No. Has he loosened the reigns a bit? Very likely. I believe he has more trust in Yeaney's ability to push the pace than he has had in any other player to this point. Unfortunately, Yeaney is not a naturally gifted passer. So the Beavers continue to lack that aspect that a top point guard would bring to the table. IMO, that leads into a main reason behind the slide in shooting percentage, both 2s and 3s. Defense is a different beast altogether. This team seems confused about how to deal with good ball/player movement. The struggles also coincide with the Beavers taking more hits through the portal. Biggest issue with Yeaney is that there is far too much real estate in the half court where she isn't a threat. Teams now sag off her in the middle near the three point line. She's not a natural PG but she has adapted pretty well this season.
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Post by skyrider on Feb 5, 2023 10:36:08 GMT -8
Biggest issue with Yeaney is that there is far too much real estate in the half court where she isn't a threat. Teams now sag off her in the middle near the three point line. She's not a natural PG but she has adapted pretty well this season.
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Post by spudbeaver on Feb 5, 2023 11:28:56 GMT -8
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Post by grayman on Feb 5, 2023 11:52:39 GMT -8
Yeah, I brought the issue up in the 3-point shooting thread. The Beavers lack a point guard who has the speed/quickness to get to the hoop and finish combined with very good passing and ballhandling skills and the ability to hit the 3-point shot. Yeaney gives them the speed/quickness, ballhandling and the ability to finish at the hoop, but she's not a great passer or 3-point shooter. The Beavers have had similar problems with other players at PG since Goodman left. Hopefully Shuler can step in and fit the bill if Rueck can't land an experienced PG in the portal.
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Post by beaveragain on Feb 5, 2023 15:15:23 GMT -8
Yeah, I brought the issue up in the 3-point shooting thread. The Beavers lack a point guard who has the speed/quickness to get to the hoop and finish combined with very good passing and ballhandling skills and the ability to hit the 3-point shot. Yeaney gives them the speed/quickness, ballhandling and the ability to finish at the hoop, but she's not a great passer or 3-point shooter. The Beavers have had similar problems with other players at PG since Goodman left. Hopefully Shuler can step in and fit the bill if Rueck can't land an experienced PG in the portal. Rogers and Sherrod are the only two PG's in the Pac-12 that fit that. Kind of a tall order and it doesn't seem to have done much for Oregon. And the best two teams, Stanford and Utah, don't have that kind of PG so.....
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Post by grayman on Feb 5, 2023 15:46:34 GMT -8
Yeah, I brought the issue up in the 3-point shooting thread. The Beavers lack a point guard who has the speed/quickness to get to the hoop and finish combined with very good passing and ballhandling skills and the ability to hit the 3-point shot. Yeaney gives them the speed/quickness, ballhandling and the ability to finish at the hoop, but she's not a great passer or 3-point shooter. The Beavers have had similar problems with other players at PG since Goodman left. Hopefully Shuler can step in and fit the bill if Rueck can't land an experienced PG in the portal. Rogers and Sherrod are the only two PG's in the Pac-12 that fit that. Kind of a tall order and it doesn't seem to have done much for Oregon. And the best two teams, Stanford and Utah, don't have that kind of PG so..... Yeah, I'm not saying that the PG has to have elite quickness. Yeaney does but lacks other skills that keeps her from being a top player at the position. You don't need elite quickness to get to the hoop and finish. Or hit 3-pointers. Or pass at a high level. Goodman did all of those things. Utah has two really good guards in Kneepkens and McQueen who can both play those roles when needed and the Utes have good depth there. They both score (Kneepkens is also a top 3-point shooter) when the team isn't getting the ball inside to Pili. Stanford has very good guards and has been loaded throughout the roster. Lepolo was fourth in the Pac-12 in assists going into today. Rogers is third in assists and the Ducks are 14-8 and maybe 15-8 if they pull the upset against Utah. She has 33 at the moment against the Utes.
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beav74
Freshman
Posts: 741
Grad Year: OSU 1974
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Post by beav74 on Feb 6, 2023 9:13:41 GMT -8
I’m not exactly sure what the expectation is this year? People need to ease up a bit. We are a team that lost the potential of having two seniors and a sixth year Grad player. A roster that had players who have been in the system with experience. Instead, we have a roster with seven new players….five freshmen and two transfer players. Our most experienced player is a sophomore! And fans expect us to compete for the NCAA tournament?? The future is very bright. This team did not reload….its rebuilding.
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Post by lotrader on Feb 6, 2023 9:57:31 GMT -8
I’m not exactly sure what the expectation is this year? People need to ease up a bit. We are a team that lost the potential of having two seniors and a sixth year Grad player. A roster that had players who have been in the system with experience. Instead, we have a roster with seven new players….five freshmen and two transfer players. Our most experienced player is a sophomore! And fans expect us to compete for the NCAA tournament?? The future is very bright. This team did not reload….its rebuilding. I think what OSU WBB Fans are expecting is that by now the coaching staff would have recognized this is a rebuilding year and to rebuild--i.e., play your freshmen and sophomores. Otherwise they are going to leave the program via the transfer portal.
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beav74
Freshman
Posts: 741
Grad Year: OSU 1974
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Post by beav74 on Feb 6, 2023 10:25:54 GMT -8
And I think that's what's happening at this very moment....
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Feb 6, 2023 11:58:02 GMT -8
I think it's tough to build a consistently good basketball roster, especially now with the portal. Also, the conference seems to get more and more competitive each year.
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Post by grayman on Feb 6, 2023 12:11:54 GMT -8
I think it's tough to build a consistently good basketball roster, especially now with the portal. Also, the conference seems to get more and more competitive each year. It's made it tougher to keep continuity for a lot of teams. But OSU lost a bunch of key players and was unable to come even close to matching those losses with arrivals through the portal. Teams that are successful moving forward will be able to use the portal to their advantage. Rueck has not so far. Ellie Mack and Yeaney are the best he's done.
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