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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on May 9, 2016 12:38:58 GMT -8
In 2007, after 21 conference games, Oregon State was 8-13, having just been swept by Arizona State at home. The Beavers took the series in Jackie Robinson Stadium to close out the regular season and then proceeded to win the Charlottesville Regional and Corvallis Super Regional, en route to their second consecutive national championship.
Absent a 10-0 finish, hosting looks like a long shot at this point. However, Pat Casey has shown in the past that he can win a regional three time zones away in a hurricane. And the 2016 team is two games up in the standings on the 2007 team. The Oregon State fans and the players should keep up the good fight to the bitter end. The Beavers have been in worse spots and pulled off miracles before. This Oregon State team is talented enough to do damage in a regional no matter, where it is.
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Post by beavaristotle on May 9, 2016 15:16:44 GMT -8
another difference is that the 2007 team had some players who were leaders, something this years team appears to be lacking
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Post by baseba1111 on May 9, 2016 17:29:56 GMT -8
Another thing is the absolute lack of correlation between the two teams and how the season may or may not unfold. If records part way through a season were a true indicator of anything you'd just get to pencil in playoff teams. As mentioned above... a TON of factors lead the 2007 team to success. This team mirrors that team in... yep almost nothing!
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Post by eugenedave on May 10, 2016 6:10:57 GMT -8
another difference is that the 2007 team had some players who were leaders, something this years team appears to be lacking There are several leaders on this team: Logan Ice, Nick Madrigal, and Trevor Morrison. Leadership isn't the issue. The lack of consistently strong pitching arms is the issue. The loss of Rasmussen was huge, and we do not have someone who can take his place on the mound. For the first time in many years we are not dominant in our pitching. When the HC says in his pre-game interview that "it will take seven runs to win this game", you are in a lot of trouble. In years past, no lead was safe if you were playing against us. This year it's just the opposite. No matter how many runs we have, no lead is safe for us. |
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Post by thewizard on May 10, 2016 6:20:12 GMT -8
another difference is that the 2007 team had some players who were leaders, something this years team appears to be lacking There are several leaders on this team: Logan Ice, Nick Madrigal, and Trevor Morrison. Leadership isn't the issue. The lack of consistently strong pitching arms is the issue. The loss of Rasmussen was huge, and we do not have someone who can take his place on the mound. For the first time in many years we are not dominant in our pitching. When the HC says in his pre-game interview that "it will take seven runs to win this game", you are in a lot of trouble. In years past, no lead was safe if you were playing against us. This year it's just the opposite. No matter how many runs we have, no lead is safe for us. If you actually listen to the pregame on the radio, the one thing that PC says is there seems to be no ON-FIELD leader of this team. Pitching is definitely down, which Beaver Nation is not use to this type of club. I also blame PC was part of this problem with our pitchers. Every year he settles in on a couple of pitchers early on the season and does not develop potential pitchers to help out later on during the season when we have a starter go down (forcing one of those relievers to become a starter) or when a starter consistently does not last past the 4th inning. Just my two cents. You can disagree or agree with me. |
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Post by baseba1111 on May 10, 2016 7:50:31 GMT -8
There are several leaders on this team: Logan Ice, Nick Madrigal, and Trevor Morrison. Leadership isn't the issue. The lack of consistently strong pitching arms is the issue. The loss of Rasmussen was huge, and we do not have someone who can take his place on the mound. For the first time in many years we are not dominant in our pitching. When the HC says in his pre-game interview that "it will take seven runs to win this game", you are in a lot of trouble. In years past, no lead was safe if you were playing against us. This year it's just the opposite. No matter how many runs we have, no lead is safe for us. If you actually listen to the pregame on the radio, the one thing that PC says is there seems to be no ON-FIELD leader of this team. Pitching is definitely down, which Beaver Nation is not use to this type of club. I also blame PC was part of this problem with our pitchers. Every year he settles in on a couple of pitchers early on the season and does not develop potential pitchers to help out later on during the season when we have a starter go down (forcing one of those relievers to become a starter) or when a starter consistently does not last past the 4th inning. Just my two cents. You can disagree or agree with me. Watch out... Blasphemy to criticize PC!!! LOL Unfortunately PC and Yeskie (up front not a fan and highly over rated as a pitching coach) make mistakes. And this began last year when it was fairly obvious Andrew was not going to return. There was very little development (Sam being hurt before we even began might have been as big of blow as Drew) of a "staff". It basically came down to Drew and Eckert having to be studs, and hoping Hickey returned to AA form. There was not a lot of consistent "prime time" innings given early on in NC games... sort of like this year. I will say, where the hell would this team be without Fehmel??! But... on the down side he is a young Frosh with a lot of strenuous innings on his arm, he needs to take it easy this summer. PC and Yeskie have always kinda fallen back on the "next man up"... "compete"... mantras. They have depended on having extremely good talent that "steps up", not so much in developing it. No matter your view on PC and Yeskie... pitching and its development has taken a severe dip lately. We went from (3) high caliber/experienced/stopper type Fri.-Sun starters to a gradual NONE. Unfortunately that is not on the kids not stepping up... that's on the coaches. It's either misjudging recruits or lack of development, but it's a very stark reality. And, unless some unexpected huge jumps take place we're there again next year... semi experienced, semi successful, or returners from severe injuries. I can't believe that inside the coaches office PC and Yeskie did not already know this. Of course outwardly they will always project confidence and high expectations, but you do not have to be a baseball guru to look at the field and see this is not the level of play we have seen consistently. Down cycles happen, champions reload and recover and the cycle is quickly reversed. |
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Post by ochobeavo on May 10, 2016 14:49:21 GMT -8
another difference is that the 2007 team had some players who were leaders, something this years team appears to be lacking absolutely. There's "leadership" and then there's Darwin Barney/Mitch Canham willing a team to win leadership - and you can't just manufacture it.... That 07 team was so strong up the middle - Canham/Barney/Wong, had depth in the rotation (Stutes/JoePa/Turpen/Reyes) and multiple solid arms out of the pen Kunz/Grbavac/Anton Maxwell. Turpen or Reyes would probably be #1/2 on the 2016 squad and they were 3/4 on that team. I hate that I sound like that "things were always better back then.." guy.. but I don't think we're remotely as talented (pitching wise IMO). |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on May 11, 2016 13:20:45 GMT -8
another difference is that the 2007 team had some players who were leaders, something this years team appears to be lacking absolutely. There's "leadership" and then there's Darwin Barney/Mitch Canham willing a team to win leadership - and you can't just manufacture it.... That 07 team was so strong up the middle - Canham/Barney/Wong, had depth in the rotation (Stutes/JoePa/Turpen/Reyes) and multiple solid arms out of the pen Kunz/Grbavac/Anton Maxwell. Turpen or Reyes would probably be #1/2 on the 2016 squad and they were 3/4 on that team. I hate that I sound like that "things were always better back then.." guy.. but I don't think we're remotely as talented (pitching wise IMO). The 2007 team reminds me of this team, because, outside of Stutes, it seemed like pitching was a mess, the team could not get a clutch hit to save its life, and the defense was a sieve. Then, at the end of the regular season, Casey made some changes and the 2007 team became the 2007 team. JoePa started Game 1 of the Charlottesville Regional and then became the de facto closer. Reyes and Turpen were the 2/3 guys at Super Regional and at the CWS. Barney and Canham started to lead and the other players started to follow. The hits started to get a lot more timely and a bunch of the defensive miscues evaporated. Retrospectively, it was like the ending of the "Usual Suspects." The pieces were all there, but up until the UCLA series, Coach Casey just had not put them all together yet. As it stands, Oregon State has got to win about seven to feel good about a berth. A 7-2 finish should be enough. The opponents are not phenomenal. It's there. The 2016 team has the talent to become the 2007 team, but it is up to the players to get there. We'll see. |
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Post by baseba1111 on May 11, 2016 14:56:58 GMT -8
absolutely. There's "leadership" and then there's Darwin Barney/Mitch Canham willing a team to win leadership - and you can't just manufacture it.... That 07 team was so strong up the middle - Canham/Barney/Wong, had depth in the rotation (Stutes/JoePa/Turpen/Reyes) and multiple solid arms out of the pen Kunz/Grbavac/Anton Maxwell. Turpen or Reyes would probably be #1/2 on the 2016 squad and they were 3/4 on that team. I hate that I sound like that "things were always better back then.." guy.. but I don't think we're remotely as talented (pitching wise IMO). The 2007 team reminds me of this team, because, outside of Stutes, it seemed like pitching was a mess, the team could not get a clutch hit to save its life, and the defense was a sieve. Then, at the end of the regular season, Casey made some changes and the 2007 team became the 2007 team. JoePa started Game 1 of the Charlottesville Regional and then became the de facto closer. Reyes and Turpen were the 2/3 guys at Super Regional and at the CWS. Barney and Canham started to lead and the other players started to follow. The hits started to get a lot more timely and a bunch of the defensive miscues evaporated. Retrospectively, it was like the ending of the "Usual Suspects." The pieces were all there, but up until the UCLA series, Coach Casey just had not put them all together yet. As it stands, Oregon State has got to win about seven to feel good about a berth. A 7-2 finish should be enough. The opponents are not phenomenal. It's there. The 2016 team has the talent to become the 2007 team, but it is up to the players to get there. We'll see. We'll have to agree to disagree on almost all of that... this team wishes it could be a shadow of the 2007 team, make the post season or not. Where do you see a Barney or Canham... athletically, accomplishment or leadership by example wise? Stutes, Reyes, JoPa, Turpen... we'd be set if we had just two of those guys and their desire and leadership/grit by example As for a "berth", it's 7-2 or better or most likely stay home... we've basically blown any leeway. I don't see 6 teams getting picked from this mess of a league, maybe 5 if one finishes strong and is rich on tourney tradition. But, as of now it will not matter. This is not a regional winning team on the mound or at the plate facing high quality teams/arms. They will not be facing any UP, Seattle, or Kansas St as a 3 or 4 seed... |
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rafer
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Post by rafer on May 11, 2016 15:11:10 GMT -8
The 2007 team reminds me of this team, because, outside of Stutes, it seemed like pitching was a mess, the team could not get a clutch hit to save its life, and the defense was a sieve. Then, at the end of the regular season, Casey made some changes and the 2007 team became the 2007 team. JoePa started Game 1 of the Charlottesville Regional and then became the de facto closer. Reyes and Turpen were the 2/3 guys at Super Regional and at the CWS. Barney and Canham started to lead and the other players started to follow. The hits started to get a lot more timely and a bunch of the defensive miscues evaporated. Retrospectively, it was like the ending of the "Usual Suspects." The pieces were all there, but up until the UCLA series, Coach Casey just had not put them all together yet. As it stands, Oregon State has got to win about seven to feel good about a berth. A 7-2 finish should be enough. The opponents are not phenomenal. It's there. The 2016 team has the talent to become the 2007 team, but it is up to the players to get there. We'll see. We'll have to agree to disagree on almost all of that... this team wishes it could be a shadow of the 2007 team, make the post season or not. Where do you see a Barney or Canham... athletically, accomplishment or leadership by example wise? Stutes, Reyes, JoPa, Turpen... we'd be set if we had just two of those guys and their desire and leadership/grit by example As for a "berth", it's 7-2 or better or most likely stay home... we've basically blown any leeway. I don't see 6 teams getting picked from this mess of a league, maybe 5 if one finishes strong and is rich on tourney tradition. But, as of now it will not matter. This is not a regional winning team on the mound or at the plate facing high quality teams/arms. They will not be facing any UP, Seattle, or Kansas St as a 3 or 4 seed... |
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rafer
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Post by rafer on May 11, 2016 15:13:24 GMT -8
Sad to say, and really hope you're wrong, but I don't think so, this team is just falling short, period. Agree with the analysis mostly, just don't see much fight left in this group, really going to be a frustrating year when it's all said and done.
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on May 12, 2016 0:13:44 GMT -8
The 2007 team reminds me of this team, because, outside of Stutes, it seemed like pitching was a mess, the team could not get a clutch hit to save its life, and the defense was a sieve. Then, at the end of the regular season, Casey made some changes and the 2007 team became the 2007 team. JoePa started Game 1 of the Charlottesville Regional and then became the de facto closer. Reyes and Turpen were the 2/3 guys at Super Regional and at the CWS. Barney and Canham started to lead and the other players started to follow. The hits started to get a lot more timely and a bunch of the defensive miscues evaporated. Retrospectively, it was like the ending of the "Usual Suspects." The pieces were all there, but up until the UCLA series, Coach Casey just had not put them all together yet. As it stands, Oregon State has got to win about seven to feel good about a berth. A 7-2 finish should be enough. The opponents are not phenomenal. It's there. The 2016 team has the talent to become the 2007 team, but it is up to the players to get there. We'll see. We'll have to agree to disagree on almost all of that... this team wishes it could be a shadow of the 2007 team, make the post season or not. Where do you see a Barney or Canham... athletically, accomplishment or leadership by example wise? Stutes, Reyes, JoPa, Turpen... we'd be set if we had just two of those guys and their desire and leadership/grit by example As for a "berth", it's 7-2 or better or most likely stay home... we've basically blown any leeway. I don't see 6 teams getting picked from this mess of a league, maybe 5 if one finishes strong and is rich on tourney tradition. But, as of now it will not matter. This is not a regional winning team on the mound or at the plate facing high quality teams/arms. They will not be facing any UP, Seattle, or Kansas St as a 3 or 4 seed... K.J. Harrison is more talented Barney or Canham. Ice, Madrigal, and Morrison are all very solid. With Ice and Morrison, this team should have enough leadership to be successful. Having said that, the position players are younger than that 2007 team, which explains at least some of the offensive inconsistencies. Casey's great teams seem to mature overnight, though. Pitching-wise, 2016 Oregon State still does not have a reliable day 3 starter, much less a reliable midweek starter. In 2007, Reyes started the season as a situational starter. He did not take over the Sunday spot until six weeks left in the regular season. He finished the regular season 4-3. He finished the season as MVP of the College World Series. Eckert and Heimlich are both great starters. Neither is probably as good as Stutes was in 2007, but each could sub in for a Reyes at this stage of the season. Baseball America's projections, Oregon State is a three seed in Lubbock with Minnesota as a two. Oregon State notably beat Minnesota in Arizona at the beginning of the year. Texas Tech dropped a home series to Cal State Fullerton and split a series with California in Berkeley. They are not unbeatable. A good game out of Eckert and Heimlich and Oregon State is into the championship game. Good execution and timely hitting, and the Beavers are through to the Supers. Baseball America has the Lubbock regional paired with the Seattle regional. All Oregon State would need is to win a three game series likely against Washington, and they would be off to Omaha. Negativity is infectious, and I am personally tired of it. Pat Casey is a baseball guru, and, if Oregon State is on, this team is good enough to beat anybody. |
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rafer
Sophomore
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Post by rafer on May 12, 2016 6:24:46 GMT -8
We'll have to agree to disagree on almost all of that... this team wishes it could be a shadow of the 2007 team, make the post season or not. Where do you see a Barney or Canham... athletically, accomplishment or leadership by example wise? Stutes, Reyes, JoPa, Turpen... we'd be set if we had just two of those guys and their desire and leadership/grit by example As for a "berth", it's 7-2 or better or most likely stay home... we've basically blown any leeway. I don't see 6 teams getting picked from this mess of a league, maybe 5 if one finishes strong and is rich on tourney tradition. But, as of now it will not matter. This is not a regional winning team on the mound or at the plate facing high quality teams/arms. They will not be facing any UP, Seattle, or Kansas St as a 3 or 4 seed... K.J. Harrison is more talented Barney or Canham. Ice, Madrigal, and Morrison are all very solid. With Ice and Morrison, this team should have enough leadership to be successful. Having said that, the position players are younger than that 2007 team, which explains at least some of the offensive inconsistencies. Casey's great teams seem to mature overnight, though. Pitching-wise, 2016 Oregon State still does not have a reliable day 3 starter, much less a reliable midweek starter. In 2007, Reyes started the season as a situational starter. He did not take over the Sunday spot until six weeks left in the regular season. He finished the regular season 4-3. He finished the season as MVP of the College World Series. Eckert and Heimlich are both great starters. Neither is probably as good as Stutes was in 2007, but each could sub in for a Reyes at this stage of the season. Baseball America's projections, Oregon State is a three seed in Lubbock with Minnesota as a two. Oregon State notably beat Minnesota in Arizona at the beginning of the year. Texas Tech dropped a home series to Cal State Fullerton and split a series with California in Berkeley. They are not unbeatable. A good game out of Eckert and Heimlich and Oregon State is into the championship game. Good execution and timely hitting, and the Beavers are through to the Supers. Baseball America has the Lubbock regional paired with the Seattle regional. All Oregon State would need is to win a three game series likely against Washington, and they would be off to Omaha. Negativity is infectious, and I am personally tired of it. Pat Casey is a baseball guru, and, if Oregon State is on, this team is good enough to beat anybody. |
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Post by baseba1111 on May 12, 2016 7:41:29 GMT -8
We'll have to agree to disagree on almost all of that... this team wishes it could be a shadow of the 2007 team, make the post season or not. Where do you see a Barney or Canham... athletically, accomplishment or leadership by example wise? Stutes, Reyes, JoPa, Turpen... we'd be set if we had just two of those guys and their desire and leadership/grit by example As for a "berth", it's 7-2 or better or most likely stay home... we've basically blown any leeway. I don't see 6 teams getting picked from this mess of a league, maybe 5 if one finishes strong and is rich on tourney tradition. But, as of now it will not matter. This is not a regional winning team on the mound or at the plate facing high quality teams/arms. They will not be facing any UP, Seattle, or Kansas St as a 3 or 4 seed... K.J. Harrison is more talented Barney or Canham. Ice, Madrigal, and Morrison are all very solid. With Ice and Morrison, this team should have enough leadership to be successful. Having said that, the position players are younger than that 2007 team, which explains at least some of the offensive inconsistencies. Casey's great teams seem to mature overnight, though. Pitching-wise, 2016 Oregon State still does not have a reliable day 3 starter, much less a reliable midweek starter. In 2007, Reyes started the season as a situational starter. He did not take over the Sunday spot until six weeks left in the regular season. He finished the regular season 4-3. He finished the season as MVP of the College World Series. Eckert and Heimlich are both great starters. Neither is probably as good as Stutes was in 2007, but each could sub in for a Reyes at this stage of the season. Baseball America's projections, Oregon State is a three seed in Lubbock with Minnesota as a two. Oregon State notably beat Minnesota in Arizona at the beginning of the year. Texas Tech dropped a home series to Cal State Fullerton and split a series with California in Berkeley. They are not unbeatable. A good game out of Eckert and Heimlich and Oregon State is into the championship game. Good execution and timely hitting, and the Beavers are through to the Supers. Baseball America has the Lubbock regional paired with the Seattle regional. All Oregon State would need is to win a three game series likely against Washington, and they would be off to Omaha. Negativity is infectious, and I am personally tired of it. Pat Casey is a baseball guru, and, if Oregon State is on, this team is good enough to beat anybody. Now that is funny... I suppose you see KJ as the next Conforto too? I personally don't get "infected" by unrealistic aspirations/expectations that are constantly adjusted, excused, and based solely on a wish list. Everyone has their belief system, heck it's how Disney made their fortune!! I mean everything you state "could" happen... basically everything would have to play out "perfectly", completely contrary to how the team has played for a few weeks now... ya, I get it. We don;t believe what you believe and we are the purveyor of negativity holding this team back! LOL I'll leave it just as I stated... agree to disagree... STRONGLY!!! And, the last three game series OSU has won??? But, no problem... have to go at least 6-3 to stay in top 5 in league, win a regional on the road as a 3 or 4 seed, and sweep thru a Seattle Super (you do realize that is a projection, right?) when we could not sweep UW at home. Hmmmm, and people disagreeing with that are negative??? Wow. LOL |
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Post by ochobeavo on May 12, 2016 9:02:44 GMT -8
Negativity is infectious, and I am personally tired of it. Pat Casey is a baseball guru, and, if Oregon State is on, this team is good enough to beat anybody.
Buddy - I think we'd all be happy to be wrong here and eat some crow, I'd be thrilled. And we absolutely are good enough to beat anybody - that's what makes it all the more frustrating. But this is a team that is playing WORSE as the season goes. We have 1 quality start in our last 10 games, we are 9th in BA in conference play, trending south across the board in just about every category. We've got coaches hinting that the kids aren't all rowing in the same direction. It's pretty hard for me to get on board with "no problem, we did it in 2007"....
I don't think it's a negative to not see what you're seeing on the 07 vs 16 team. All I'm seeing are similar records. That team caught lightning in a bottle. Whatever the case may be, what we really need now is a visit from Jobu. Quickly.
Bats, they are sick. I cannot hit curveball. Straightball I hit it very much. Curveball, bats are afraid. I ask Jobu to come, take fear from bats. I offer him cigar, rum. He will come.
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