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Post by osubeavs721 on Jan 30, 2017 13:56:00 GMT -8
When they are 4* and 3* guys yes it does. Preferred walk-ons aren't signing early and enrolling. Get real. LOL... I'll forgive you your ignorance since you've never been in the biz or coached kids signing D1 NLIs... LMAO... Says the guy who only talks out of his ass. You're the one who is doesn't know what's going on. And guess what coaching 5th graders doesn't put you "in the biz". |
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Post by ochobeavo on Jan 30, 2017 14:07:22 GMT -8
LOL... I'll forgive you your ignorance since you've never been in the biz or coached kids signing D1 NLIs... LMAO... Says the guy who only talks out of his ass. You're the one who is doesn't know what's going on. And guess what coaching 5th graders doesn't put you "in the biz". I dunno man.. I thought he gave up some premium content for free: Original question: 23 commits so far.. How many are we taking this class? No one has signed yet. They'll figure it all out. 25 +/- Anyhow.. I'll let you two get back at it. Just passing through.  |
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Post by baseba1111 on Jan 30, 2017 15:02:29 GMT -8
LOL... I'll forgive you your ignorance since you've never been in the biz or coached kids signing D1 NLIs... there are many 3-4* kids not on a "football" scholly for many reasons... wealthy parents and offer to accept "scholly" in word only, have excellent academic rides/grants/minority schollies, sharing schollies with another sport (although football typically takes the load) are just some of the examples of ways you can save on the limit of 85. The NLI limit is for those who sign... walkons or kids going to greyshirt do not sign NLIs, but certainly can enroll early if they qualify for admittance to the university. Who qualifies under the 2016 class, who gets and how many of the 85 schollies are allotted will be decided by May 31st. You can have over 28 in a class, but only 28 NLIs signed by the may deadline. At that time Spring practice is over for those on campus, you know the status of those expected for Fall camp, etc. There is lots of "play" in how and when you allot the 85 and the time frame varies by how a staff uses it and what their "plans" are. While I do believe that all of those possibilities are in play, I believe that they are VERY rare - except for the multiple sport thing, in which I believe Football is FORCED to eat the scholarship. In all practical respects, the scholarship count and the NLIs will be a 1:1 match. I've been "counting" the scholarships for this team for many years, and in that time, I do not believe the secret football/not-really-football scholarship you speak of has occurred in the past 7 years at least, and if it has, they haven't taken advantage of it by offering that extra scholarship to anybody else. There are no secrets... there are kids who could be a schollie recipient that do not need it. Almost every year for the past 10 a kid has been awarded a schollie is Spring or fall workouts as they are available... typically 1 is "reserved" (or comes up with attrition) for a non schollie kid who has earned it thru 1-3 years of hard work. I do not keep track of the exact names, but I know at least one was award last year. If NLIs and schollies were a one to one match we'd had some wasted schollies for the kids who sign but end up not qualifying. So, as best as they can the staff tried to make sure none are wasted. |
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Post by baseba1111 on Jan 30, 2017 15:06:41 GMT -8
LOL... I'll forgive you your ignorance since you've never been in the biz or coached kids signing D1 NLIs... LMAO... Says the guy who only talks out of his ass. You're the one who is doesn't know what's going on. And guess what coaching 5th graders doesn't put you "in the biz". There ya go... words from a person in the know. Seems you have no factual information so you resort to grade school attacks. And, there as about as effective as you knowledge base so I guess what's the difference!? So, in language you can understand... "not it"! LOL  |
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Post by kersting13 on Jan 30, 2017 15:48:12 GMT -8
While I do believe that all of those possibilities are in play, I believe that they are VERY rare - except for the multiple sport thing, in which I believe Football is FORCED to eat the scholarship. In all practical respects, the scholarship count and the NLIs will be a 1:1 match. I've been "counting" the scholarships for this team for many years, and in that time, I do not believe the secret football/not-really-football scholarship you speak of has occurred in the past 7 years at least, and if it has, they haven't taken advantage of it by offering that extra scholarship to anybody else. There are no secrets... there are kids who could be a schollie recipient that do not need it. Almost every year for the past 10 a kid has been awarded a schollie is Spring or fall workouts as they are available... typically 1 is "reserved" (or comes up with attrition) for a non schollie kid who has earned it thru 1-3 years of hard work. I do not keep track of the exact names, but I know at least one was award last year. If NLIs and schollies were a one to one match we'd had some wasted schollies for the kids who sign but end up not qualifying. So, as best as they can the staff tried to make sure none are wasted. Baseba1111, I typically agree with most of your content, but here, you are simply grasping and straws and doubling down on something that's not correct. (and nit-picking at NLIs = schollies for DNQs - c'mon man!). I've tracked the walk-ons who get scholarships from year-to-year. In the Riley years, the official roster specifically ID'd players who were on scholarship vs those who were walk-ons, and they did NOT simply give out "hard-work" scholarships to players who didn't contribute on the field. It was almost always full to the 85 limit. In a practical sense, giving walk-ons schollies just to fill out to 85 only works if you have a Senior walk-on who will go off the books in one season. Nowadays, you can't pull scholarships annually. Some of the walk-ons who have earned scholarships over the years (not an exhaustive list): Mike Remmers, Grant Johnson, Aaron Nichols, Andrew Seumalo, Devon Kell, Tyler Anderson, Keith Kostol, Michael Morovick, Ricky Ortiz, Naji Patrick, Devin Chappell. These guys earned their scholarships by actually contributing on the field. There are too few senior walk-ons to do this for, and coaches aren't going to waste multiple years of a scholarship to give a hard-working Sophomore or Junior walk-on who doesn't play a free ride. |
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Post by baseba1111 on Jan 30, 2017 19:54:53 GMT -8
There are no secrets... there are kids who could be a schollie recipient that do not need it. Almost every year for the past 10 a kid has been awarded a schollie is Spring or fall workouts as they are available... typically 1 is "reserved" (or comes up with attrition) for a non schollie kid who has earned it thru 1-3 years of hard work. I do not keep track of the exact names, but I know at least one was award last year. If NLIs and schollies were a one to one match we'd had some wasted schollies for the kids who sign but end up not qualifying. So, as best as they can the staff tried to make sure none are wasted. Baseba1111, I typically agree with most of your content, but here, you are simply grasping and straws and doubling down on something that's not correct. (and nit-picking at NLIs = schollies for DNQs - c'mon man!). I've tracked the walk-ons who get scholarships from year-to-year. In the Riley years, the official roster specifically ID'd players who were on scholarship vs those who were walk-ons, and they did NOT simply give out "hard-work" scholarships to players who didn't contribute on the field. It was almost always full to the 85 limit. In a practical sense, giving walk-ons schollies just to fill out to 85 only works if you have a Senior walk-on who will go off the books in one season. Nowadays, you can't pull scholarships annually. Some of the walk-ons who have earned scholarships over the years (not an exhaustive list): Mike Remmers, Grant Johnson, Aaron Nichols, Andrew Seumalo, Devon Kell, Tyler Anderson, Keith Kostol, Michael Morovick, Ricky Ortiz, Naji Patrick, Devin Chappell. These guys earned their scholarships by actually contributing on the field. There are too few senior walk-ons to do this for, and coaches aren't going to waste multiple years of a scholarship to give a hard-working Sophomore or Junior walk-on who doesn't play a free ride. Actually you made my "grasping" point... not all 85 are used at times... some are given to hard working = (most would have already known assumed) contributors. But, you knew that and used "language" to argue a minor portion of the post. So to make your research feel better and accurate... 85 schollies can be divided up in many ways and stay within the rules, INCLUDING handing out unsed (for any of numerous reasons) schollies to players not previously on scholarship but now deemed worthy... Pretty much exactly what was said! At least twice previously. Maybe you can check grammar and spelling now?! Lol |
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Post by jdogge on Jan 30, 2017 21:15:24 GMT -8
Baseba1111, I typically agree with most of your content, but here, you are simply grasping and straws and doubling down on something that's not correct. (and nit-picking at NLIs = schollies for DNQs - c'mon man!). I've tracked the walk-ons who get scholarships from year-to-year. In the Riley years, the official roster specifically ID'd players who were on scholarship vs those who were walk-ons, and they did NOT simply give out "hard-work" scholarships to players who didn't contribute on the field. It was almost always full to the 85 limit. In a practical sense, giving walk-ons schollies just to fill out to 85 only works if you have a Senior walk-on who will go off the books in one season. Nowadays, you can't pull scholarships annually. Some of the walk-ons who have earned scholarships over the years (not an exhaustive list): Mike Remmers, Grant Johnson, Aaron Nichols, Andrew Seumalo, Devon Kell, Tyler Anderson, Keith Kostol, Michael Morovick, Ricky Ortiz, Naji Patrick, Devin Chappell. These guys earned their scholarships by actually contributing on the field. There are too few senior walk-ons to do this for, and coaches aren't going to waste multiple years of a scholarship to give a hard-working Sophomore or Junior walk-on who doesn't play a free ride. Actually you made my "grasping" point... not all 85 are used at times... some are given to hard working = (most would have already known assumed) contributors. But, you knew that and used "language" to argue a minor portion of the post. So to make your research feel better and accurate... 85 schollies can be divided up in many ways and stay within the rules, INCLUDING handing out unsed (for any of numerous reasons) schollies to players not previously on scholarship but now deemed worthy... Pretty much exactly what was said! At least twice previously. Maybe you can check grammar and spelling now?! Lol It must hurt to be your wife. |
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Post by kersting13 on Jan 30, 2017 21:51:03 GMT -8
Baseba1111, I typically agree with most of your content, but here, you are simply grasping and straws and doubling down on something that's not correct. (and nit-picking at NLIs = schollies for DNQs - c'mon man!). I've tracked the walk-ons who get scholarships from year-to-year. In the Riley years, the official roster specifically ID'd players who were on scholarship vs those who were walk-ons, and they did NOT simply give out "hard-work" scholarships to players who didn't contribute on the field. It was almost always full to the 85 limit. In a practical sense, giving walk-ons schollies just to fill out to 85 only works if you have a Senior walk-on who will go off the books in one season. Nowadays, you can't pull scholarships annually. Some of the walk-ons who have earned scholarships over the years (not an exhaustive list): Mike Remmers, Grant Johnson, Aaron Nichols, Andrew Seumalo, Devon Kell, Tyler Anderson, Keith Kostol, Michael Morovick, Ricky Ortiz, Naji Patrick, Devin Chappell. These guys earned their scholarships by actually contributing on the field. There are too few senior walk-ons to do this for, and coaches aren't going to waste multiple years of a scholarship to give a hard-working Sophomore or Junior walk-on who doesn't play a free ride. Actually you made my "grasping" point... not all 85 are used at times... some are given to hard working = (most would have already known assumed) contributors. But, you knew that and used "language" to argue a minor portion of the post. So to make your research feel better and accurate... 85 schollies can be divided up in many ways and stay within the rules, INCLUDING handing out unsed (for any of numerous reasons) schollies to players not previously on scholarship but now deemed worthy... Pretty much exactly what was said! At least twice previously. Maybe you can check grammar and spelling now?! Lol To quote our current President: "SAD!" |
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Post by obf on Jan 31, 2017 11:19:54 GMT -8
It is possible? yes. But, I would say it is a rare event to be sure. It is more likely a well ranked recruit is willing to walk on to a better school than didn't have room than to be acting altruistically to a school that wanted him. Lastly, there is never a situation where football can get a player that is on scholarship on another sport and absolutely no scholarship sharing whatsoever. Football HAS to own the scholarship, that is the rule the NCAA specifically created to prevent what you speak of. NCAA rules allows for a player in another sport to PRACTICE in football without counting. but once that player enters competition, they must be counted as a football scholarship (if they are scholarship in another sport). So does that mean Adley Rutschman's baseball scholarship is now a football scholarship? For all four years? Even if he decides to just do baseball only? How can Pat Casey use that scholarship now? Add it to the next class? |
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Post by obf on Jan 31, 2017 11:20:39 GMT -8
Similarly... Is Tanner Sanders still on a football scholarship even though he hasn't practiced or played with the football team in a while?
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Post by blackbug on Jan 31, 2017 12:31:24 GMT -8
Similarly... Is Tanner Sanders still on a football scholarship even though he hasn't practiced or played with the football team in a while? No to both. You are not on scholarship for the sport when you are not participating in it. You could say the 4 year football scholarship is guaranteed as long as you are part of the football team. Rutschman is currently on scholarship for football only, but obviously still an integral part of the baseball team. Now the way I understand it now is if you medically retire then the football scholarship is guaranteed, but not counted toward the 85 limit. |
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Post by baseba1111 on Jan 31, 2017 13:04:20 GMT -8
Similarly... Is Tanner Sanders still on a football scholarship even though he hasn't practiced or played with the football team in a while? l don't believe TS was ever a schollie athlete in any sport. |
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Post by beavs6 on Jan 31, 2017 13:25:45 GMT -8
It is possible? yes. But, I would say it is a rare event to be sure. It is more likely a well ranked recruit is willing to walk on to a better school than didn't have room than to be acting altruistically to a school that wanted him. Lastly, there is never a situation where football can get a player that is on scholarship on another sport and absolutely no scholarship sharing whatsoever. Football HAS to own the scholarship, that is the rule the NCAA specifically created to prevent what you speak of. NCAA rules allows for a player in another sport to PRACTICE in football without counting. but once that player enters competition, they must be counted as a football scholarship (if they are scholarship in another sport). So does that mean Adley Rutschman's baseball scholarship is now a football scholarship? For all four years? Even if he decides to just do baseball only? How can Pat Casey use that scholarship now? Add it to the next class? No to both. You are not on scholarship for the sport when you are not participating in it. You could say the 4 year football scholarship is guaranteed as long as you are part of the football team. Rutschman is currently on scholarship for football only, but obviously still an integral part of the baseball team. Now the way I understand it now is if you medically retire then the football scholarship is guaranteed, but not counted toward the 85 limit. ^^^This^^^ is what I understand of scholarships as well.(For Track and partials anyway.) Partial scholarship athletes that get to practice and suit up for football ABSOLUTELY WANT to see the field for just 1 play. I'm not sure how this jives with the resident expert. I'm sure we will find out how this information is either wrong...or is absolutely making the point and it is reading comprehension/lack of intelligence that is our issue. |
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Post by blackbug on Jan 31, 2017 14:19:37 GMT -8
Similarly... Is Tanner Sanders still on a football scholarship even though he hasn't practiced or played with the football team in a while? l don't believe TS was ever a schollie athlete in any sport. He was on scholarship in football. |
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Post by atownbeaver on Jan 31, 2017 14:59:56 GMT -8
It is possible? yes. But, I would say it is a rare event to be sure. It is more likely a well ranked recruit is willing to walk on to a better school than didn't have room than to be acting altruistically to a school that wanted him. Lastly, there is never a situation where football can get a player that is on scholarship on another sport and absolutely no scholarship sharing whatsoever. Football HAS to own the scholarship, that is the rule the NCAA specifically created to prevent what you speak of. NCAA rules allows for a player in another sport to PRACTICE in football without counting. but once that player enters competition, they must be counted as a football scholarship (if they are scholarship in another sport). So does that mean Adley Rutschman's baseball scholarship is now a football scholarship? For all four years? Even if he decides to just do baseball only? How can Pat Casey use that scholarship now? Add it to the next class? I do not fully know the series of events specific to Rutschman but it goes down like this. If you have a scholarship in another sport (even partial) and opt to participate in football, and engage in competition, your scholarship must now be carried by football for that eligible season. If you never had a scholarship in a sport (say he walked on to the baseball team) and then went to football, there is no issue. He was never offered a scholarship anywhere. That would release the scholarship for use again, BUT when it can be used depends on the eligible period. Because football precedes baseball it is likely Casey could use an abandoned scholarship that coming season. Because football must take the scholarship, you don't see a ton of cross over athletes anymore. It isn't just that sports are so specialized and full year commitments now, it is also that football has to be okay with using a scholarship on you. This bylaw was in response to a scandal. I want to say it was Oklahoma, but I can't remember the detail. but basically they were using Wrestling team scholarships for football players. The students primarily were football players and barely (if at all) competed on the wrestling team. Other teams historically did the same thing with Track scholarships. It was giving many schools more like 90-95 scholarship players in reality. Teams doing this were never sanctioned of course, as it was simply a loophole. not illegal practice. Comically, football players are free to compete in any other sport they want with no consequence (other than time, energy, coach scorn etc). Oregon State used this to its advantage in trying to rebuild a Track presence. Having Wheaton, James Rodgers and others run in track meets on behalf of Oregon State. |
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