OSU's current rankings

You've convinced me.  Fire Anderzen and hire Banker or Riley back.  OSU was much better off and it cost so much less.  Your logic is sound and I applaud you.

My goal was never to convince you of something you already knew to begin with.  Your flippant often child like responses not withstanding.

My goal now, as it was when MR was our coach, is to point out and get people to accept when it comes to recruiting the program itself is the primary driving force behind the type and numbers of recruits you can attract.  Getting rid of MR and replacing him with GA was not the panacea some expected.   So far the numbers suggest recruiting has actually gone backwards.

That said I dont' believe calling for the coaches head for undesirable recruiting results is the answer.  My comparison above shows that can actually lead to a decline in recruiting.  Improved results would be more readily obtained by analyzing the program and what about it needs to be improved to help the coach attract better quality players.  Maybe a concerted and major effort to expand the fan base and stadium by 10k, improved marketing and brand, giving a coach a long enough time to build a reputation(relationships do matter), heck maybe even looking into a street agent type arrangement for a period of time to generate some on field momentum, etc...    It's the program stupid.  

LOL.  Attempted self flattery, so cute.  You fool easy.  You're my ramp to drive off of and nothing more.  Might leave you with a few tread marks, but certainly not looking to hurt anyone.

My patience for dimwits is quite remarkable actually.

As I grow older, I grow weary of people running their idiot mouths with idiot drivel and then recoiling to a defense of "well that is just my opinion man..." 

I think we need to have an adult conversation about opinions. 

There are things in this world that are not opinions. they are objectively right or wrong, good or bad, true or false. 2+2=4. always and forever. you cannot say that 2+2=5 and claim that it is your opinion and that others should respect it. it is not an opinion, you are just wrong.  

There are things in this world that are entirely opinion, they are completely subjective and based entirely on our own believes, values, tastes and preference. Things like your favorite music and band, favorite color and food. These decisions are not based much on rational thought and logic, but on emotion and personality. People will argue until they are blue in the face over who was the best band of all time, and never be able to win the argument because at the most fundamental level, we decide these things because of who we are as a person. 

Then there are things that are a blend. the very large squishy middle of topics that have both objective fact and subjective factors as a part of it. 

How good a coach is, is a perfect example of this. A person can objectively compare undeniable things about the coach. W-L record. bowl record. championships. players in the NFL, or player awards. These are known, undeniable facts about a person. 

Then there is the squish. the yeah-buts. The qualifiers to the facts. The idea that it is harder to win at OSU than it is at Alabama. that it is harder to recruit to OSU than it is to recruit to USC. that 8 wins at OSU means success while 8 wins at Bama is an utter failure. This is the realm where you can't just think a thought just because... you can't just ignore all the objective and lean entirely on subjective factors because both things are important. 

So that is why you can have a debate about stuff like if a coach is good or bad. great or mediocre. All the "facts" have qualifiers. And when you are using these qualifying subjective things in a reasonable and grown up manner, your differing opinion should be respected. you can engage in stimulating debate over the topic. 

But when you fail to include the objective fact, or if your subjective opinion is wildly irrational or does not align, or is not defensible it is really hard to put out an opinion worthy of respect. When all you can conjure is "Riley sucks" with nothing said in defense, nobody on this earth owes you a god damned thing. man up and own it and don't cry for equal time at the big boy table when you cannot articulate yourself like a big boy. 


This rant may or may not have parallels to our current level of political discourse. but no politics in football! golden rule. 

I'm happy to debate Riley vs. Andersen with anyone, but that was sincerely not my intent with the original post, and I don't think recruiting borderline academic kids with great talent is wasteful either. If you've got huge numbers of high talent kids with no academic issues wanting to come to your school, then yes, trying to chase one kid who is slightly better with a crummy academic record, then yeah. What I was trying to say is that both Riley and Andersen took fliers on iffy academic kids who could make the team better. That hasn't changed (yet.)

If we consider our real competition as the power 5 conference teams, lets consider that those conferences are the Pac-12, the Big 10, Big 12, ACC and SEC. That is 65 teams. 

Being ranked in the 30's basically means you are better than half the power 5 teams. I think that is a good spot to shoot to consistently be at if you are OSU. our historic rankings in the 50s and 60's meant we were recruiting in the bottom third at best, and the bottom 10% at worse. with some Mid Majors sneaking in here and there above us. 

I think it pays to have realistic expectations. long term and immediate. an immediate goal is to have a class in the 30's every year. be better than half the power 5 schools. be... quite frankly, above average!