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Post by nabeav on Jan 18, 2017 15:52:27 GMT -8
Given the largely positive attitude towards our recruiting, I was pretty surprised to see our current Pac-12 rankings:
Rivals: 7th, but four of the five teams below us have a higher average per-player rating and have fewer committed recruits. We're 9th in terms of average star ranking.
24/7: 10th, 11th in average recruit ranking
Scout: 11th, last in average recruit ranking
In fairness, much like has been pointed out in other threads, nothing is final until signing day. And while it may be true that we are recruiting at a higher level than in previous years, it appears that the rest of the Pac-12 is too.
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Post by nforkbeav on Jan 18, 2017 16:25:10 GMT -8
I was checking this out today too and was rather surprised to see Scout has our class currently ranked 52nd nationally. I thought we were in the mid 30s. We do have some JC's who could prove very productive, but don't always boost your class ranking on paper along with a 2 star and NR player which don't help a classes ranking either.
Here's some others of note:
58 Cal
48 Utah
47 Wisconsin
43 ASU
41 WSU (13th ranked OL class, 2nd in P12 behind Stanford)
35 sdtr
30 UA
27 CU wow.
24 Stanford (highest star average in P12 at 3.91, UW 3.63, UCLA 3.56, USC 3.53)
21 Nebraska
19 UCLA
16 UW
13 USC
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Post by devildog on Jan 19, 2017 6:47:35 GMT -8
Man, Gerry Andersen is a lousy recruiter. OSU should fire him and bring back Mike. Nobody can do the things Riley can do. Heck I even named my dog Riley.
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Post by nabeav on Jan 19, 2017 8:52:31 GMT -8
Man, Gerry Andersen is a lousy recruiter. OSU should fire him and bring back Mike. Nobody can do the things Riley can do. Heck I even named my dog Riley. Holy cow, in no way was I trying to make this a pro-Riley post. I mean it, I was surprised that we were that low. I thought we were much higher, based on the number of 4* recruits and the overall impression I've got from media reports about our recruiting. But if you want to take it there, I'm happy to explain my position yet again. It's not that I think GA is terrible. It's not that I think Riley is the greatest coach since Vince Lombardi. It's just that there is no tangible evidence that seems to point that we are better in any way now than we were under Mike Riley. Yes, we are different, but Andersen's top ranked recruits (so far) haven't got into school, much like the Simi Kuli's or Reggie Dunn's or Kyle Peko's of Riley's tenure. We are still near the bottom third of the conference in recruiting rankings. It frustrates me that people don't take into account that the VFC improvements were going to happen whether a coaching change happened or not, and that would have had a significant impact on recruiting regardless. We have won 6 games in two seasons, which is worse than any two year stretch of Riley's tenure here, and equal to his two worst seasons ever (1997 and 2011). We are investing significantly more money in the football program now than we did during the Riley days, and we, to this point, have nothing to show for it. I don't think Andersen is a bad coach. I preferred Mike Riley's way of doing things because my personality is much more like Riley and than Andersen. I want Gary Andersen to succeed. I'm not looking to tell anyone "I told you so" if he fails. But let's stop acting like Mike Riley's stamp is still on this program. Nobody is blaming Craig Robinson for the basketball team's difficulties this year. |
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Post by nabeav on Jan 19, 2017 9:21:37 GMT -8
Update: Scout decided overnight that David Morris is a four star now, so we moved up to 10th, 11th in average recruit ranking. Other rankings stayed the same.
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Post by devildog on Jan 19, 2017 9:38:29 GMT -8
If it makes anyone feel better, Rivals has OSU with a 3 star average. Went back to 2007 and never found OSU averaging 3 stars. Of course in 2007 OSU had a recruiting class ranked #48 with 34 recruits and a 2.59 average. 2008/2.72 2009/2.63 2010/2.8 2011/2.68 enough already.
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Post by osubeavs721 on Jan 19, 2017 9:47:58 GMT -8
I like going by 247's composite rankings. We are 50th overall there 10th in the conference. What's nice about the composite is that they just average out all the services rankings including their own. It does seem like the pac 12 is recruiting at a better rate these past few years.
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Post by beavineugene on Jan 19, 2017 10:09:36 GMT -8
Man, Gerry Andersen is a lousy recruiter. OSU should fire him and bring back Mike. Nobody can do the things Riley can do. Heck I even named my dog Riley. Holy cow, in no way was I trying to make this a pro-Riley post. I mean it, I was surprised that we were that low. I thought we were much higher, based on the number of 4* recruits and the overall impression I've got from media reports about our recruiting. But if you want to take it there, I'm happy to explain my position yet again. It's not that I think GA is terrible. It's not that I think Riley is the greatest coach since Vince Lombardi. It's just that there is no tangible evidence that seems to point that we are better in any way now than we were under Mike Riley. Yes, we are different, but Andersen's top ranked recruits (so far) haven't got into school, much like the Simi Kuli's or Reggie Dunn's or Kyle Peko's of Riley's tenure. We are still near the bottom third of the conference in recruiting rankings. It frustrates me that people don't take into account that the VFC improvements were going to happen whether a coaching change happened or not, and that would have had a significant impact on recruiting regardless. We have won 6 games in two seasons, which is worse than any two year stretch of Riley's tenure here, and equal to his two worst seasons ever (1997 and 2011). We are investing significantly more money in the football program now than we did during the Riley days, and we, to this point, have nothing to show for it. I don't think Andersen is a bad coach. I preferred Mike Riley's way of doing things because my personality is much more like Riley and Andersen. I want Gary Andersen to succeed. I'm not looking to tell anyone "I told you so" if he fails. But let's stop acting like Mike Riley's stamp is still on this program. Nobody is blaming Craig Robinson for the basketball team's difficulties this year. 2 didn't get in from last year. Garcia and Wallace are enrolled. Similar situations to Jordan Villiman.
And the top recruit from this year is already in school, enrolled, and practicing. As are few other 3* kids.
The recruiting profile under GA has grown incredibility under GA. He's battling with the "top programs" for kids now. OSU isn't going to win those often, but we have won a few this year. And more importantly, GA is going after those kids and the kids have interest. That did not happen often under Riley at OSU.
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Post by atownbeaver on Jan 19, 2017 10:26:58 GMT -8
Man, Gerry Andersen is a lousy recruiter. OSU should fire him and bring back Mike. Nobody can do the things Riley can do. Heck I even named my dog Riley. Holy cow, in no way was I trying to make this a pro-Riley post. I mean it, I was surprised that we were that low. I thought we were much higher, based on the number of 4* recruits and the overall impression I've got from media reports about our recruiting. But if you want to take it there, I'm happy to explain my position yet again. It's not that I think GA is terrible. It's not that I think Riley is the greatest coach since Vince Lombardi. It's just that there is no tangible evidence that seems to point that we are better in any way now than we were under Mike Riley. Yes, we are different, but Andersen's top ranked recruits (so far) haven't got into school, much like the Simi Kuli's or Reggie Dunn's or Kyle Peko's of Riley's tenure. We are still near the bottom third of the conference in recruiting rankings. It frustrates me that people don't take into account that the VFC improvements were going to happen whether a coaching change happened or not, and that would have had a significant impact on recruiting regardless. We have won 6 games in two seasons, which is worse than any two year stretch of Riley's tenure here, and equal to his two worst seasons ever (1997 and 2011). We are investing significantly more money in the football program now than we did during the Riley days, and we, to this point, have nothing to show for it. I don't think Andersen is a bad coach. I preferred Mike Riley's way of doing things because my personality is much more like Riley and Andersen. I want Gary Andersen to succeed. I'm not looking to tell anyone "I told you so" if he fails. But let's stop acting like Mike Riley's stamp is still on this program. Nobody is blaming Craig Robinson for the basketball team's difficulties this year. With all due respect nabeav we have been down this road a few dozens times and some people are just going to be the way they are. Some people can't help but make it a Riley-Andersen fight, when there wasn't one anywhere in the horizon. and I'd like to point out that it was a "anti-Riley" person that started it out of the blue. again. The humor is how they continue to tell us to get over it, all while they cannot for the life of them ever shut the phuck up about the man. Some people want to grind an axe until there is nothing left. But moving on, you are spot on. Andersen has improved the PERCEPTION of recruiting at OSU. and I think in the long run that will help. GA has not noticeably improved the overall quality of who actually steps on campus. To be fair, that takes a few years to see. Elu Aydon is a through and though GA guy and a full blown stud. Pierce as well. This year will be interesting. We will be at a point where half or more of our starters will be GA recruits. The "Quality" thing can start to be evaluated. His OL recruiting has me pretty nervous. I will say that. |
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Post by ochobeavo on Jan 19, 2017 10:39:22 GMT -8
Holy cow, in no way was I trying to make this a pro-Riley post. I mean it, I was surprised that we were that low. I thought we were much higher, based on the number of 4* recruits and the overall impression I've got from media reports about our recruiting. But if you want to take it there, I'm happy to explain my position yet again. It's not that I think GA is terrible. It's not that I think Riley is the greatest coach since Vince Lombardi. It's just that there is no tangible evidence that seems to point that we are better in any way now than we were under Mike Riley. Yes, we are different, but Andersen's top ranked recruits (so far) haven't got into school, much like the Simi Kuli's or Reggie Dunn's or Kyle Peko's of Riley's tenure. We are still near the bottom third of the conference in recruiting rankings. It frustrates me that people don't take into account that the VFC improvements were going to happen whether a coaching change happened or not, and that would have had a significant impact on recruiting regardless. We have won 6 games in two seasons, which is worse than any two year stretch of Riley's tenure here, and equal to his two worst seasons ever (1997 and 2011). We are investing significantly more money in the football program now than we did during the Riley days, and we, to this point, have nothing to show for it. I don't think Andersen is a bad coach. I preferred Mike Riley's way of doing things because my personality is much more like Riley and Andersen. I want Gary Andersen to succeed. I'm not looking to tell anyone "I told you so" if he fails. But let's stop acting like Mike Riley's stamp is still on this program. Nobody is blaming Craig Robinson for the basketball team's difficulties this year. 2 didn't get in from last year. Garcia and Wallace are enrolled. Similar situations to Jordan Villiman.
And the top recruit from this year is already in school, enrolled, and practicing. As are few other 3* kids.
The recruiting profile under GA has grown incredibility under GA. He's battling with the "top programs" for kids now. OSU isn't going to win those often, but we have won a few this year. And more importantly, GA is going after those kids and the kids have interest. That did not happen often under Riley at OSU.
Nemec over at Oregonian seems to agree with that assessment. Still going to take time, but sure seems like we are trending the right direction on the recruiting front. |
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Post by nabeav on Jan 19, 2017 10:41:40 GMT -8
Aydon is an interesting case to me. We all agree he has talent, but he had one tackle for loss and seventeen total tackles on the season. The D gave up 218 rushing yards a game last season, which (while a slight improvement over 2015) was the most yards OSU has surrendered on the ground since Dave Kragthorpe was coaching. So I'm not sure how good he really is......granted he's only going to be a sophomore, and have Evans lined up next to him now. I'd expect his production to be much higher in 2017
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Post by devildog on Jan 19, 2017 10:50:18 GMT -8
Aydon and the overall defense would have done great under Riley. Love me some Smiley. Fire Anderzen!!
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Post by ochobeavo on Jan 19, 2017 10:58:41 GMT -8
Aydon is an interesting case to me. We all agree he has talent, but he had one tackle for loss and seventeen total tackles on the season. The D gave up 218 rushing yards a game last season, which (while a slight improvement over 2015) was the most yards OSU has surrendered on the ground since Dave Kragthorpe was coaching. So I'm not sure how good he really is......granted he's only going to be a sophomore, and have Evans lined up next to him now. I'd expect his production to be much higher in 2017 Stat's alone can be pretty misleading w/NTs in a 3-4 defense. In theory, he's going to occupy a couple blockers, clog the middle and free up the LBs to make plays. Vince Wilfork is still a good one and he only had 20ish tackles this season, his peak years w/NE were more like 40-50 tackles. Danny Shelton for the Browns had 30 solos, they run a 3-4 as well. That being said, like you, I'm still not sure how good he is. We had a lot of moving pieces last year on defense w/injuries etc. But, I think we're going to be a ton better this year as far as the front 7 goes. |
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Post by nforkbeav on Jan 19, 2017 11:02:57 GMT -8
If it makes anyone feel better, Rivals has OSU with a 3 star average. Went back to 2007 and never found OSU averaging 3 stars. Of course in 2007 OSU had a recruiting class ranked #48 with 34 recruits and a 2.59 average. 2008/2.72 2009/2.63 2010/2.8 2011/2.68 enough already. Can you tell us how we ranked in those years compared to the rest of the conference as opposed to now? I'll help you out by book ending the time frame. The 2007 class ranked 7th in P10 ahead of Stanford, UofA, and WSU. The 2014 class ranked 9th in P12 ahead of WSU, UU, and CU. Our current class ranks 10th in P12 ahead of only UU, and Cal who luckily for us is going through a coaching change or we'd likely be 11th and might still end up there if Cal's new coaches put some commits together. The other fact of the matter is, we're spending a ton more money now than back then. So far the increased investment has produced a lower ranked class relative to our conference competition than when we spent a lot less. Glad you're impressed with that result. I'm willing to give GA 4-5 years, but in your opinion, when will it be fair to question paying more for lower ranked classes in relationship to our conference foes? Is that being unfair or unreasonable in your opinion? |
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Post by nabeav on Jan 19, 2017 11:09:42 GMT -8
The recruiting profile under GA has grown incredibility under GA. He's battling with the "top programs" for kids now. OSU isn't going to win those often, but we have won a few this year. And more importantly, GA is going after those kids and the kids have interest. That did not happen often under Riley at OSU. Last couple things, and then I'm off the recruiting board until signing day. It's consuming way too much of my time! ....just looking back through Rivals at some of Riley's last classes, there were kids with offers from Nebraska, Michigan, UCLA and other major programs that picked Oregon State. Some (Sean Harlow) panned out, some (Malik Gilmore) didn't. I definitely think that the media focused more on the under-recruited people that hit big (Stroughter, James Rodgers, etc.) for OSU under Riley than they do under Andersen. I mean, Markus Wheaton had offers from everyone, no real connection to Oregon State, and he picked us. I'm not sure how to check 4 and 5 star kids that had offers from us that picked other schools, but in my mind, a lot of it is media perception. I saw someone tweeted at Nemec asking how Riley was pulling all these great recruits at Nebraska, and Nemec basically credited the facilities and tradition at Nebraska...which yes that helps, but Nebraska hasn't been a major player on the national scene since these kids were toddlers. Plays well with the parents I'm sure....but Nemec basically reinforced my point that the VFC upgrades will do wonders for recruiting, regardless of who the coach is. And it is a GREAT thing that our perception is better now. Perception is reality in this business, and Andersen and his staff deserve a ton of credit for flipping that perception. I hope it leads to better things in the future for OSU on the football field. |
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