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Post by grayman on Jan 10, 2023 21:42:43 GMT -8
Well, yeah, the more you play and the more you have the ball in your hands, the more turnovers you will have. That's particularly true for point guards. Last year TVO had 91 turnovers with 94 assists. To put it in perspective, Sydney Wiese had 97 turnovers with 154 assists in 2016-17. Destiny Slocum had 94 TOs with 165 assists in 17-18. Slocum had 97 TOs with 153 assists and Mikayla Pivec had 76 TOs with 114 assists, in 18-19. Slocum had 76 TOs with 150 assists and Pivec 76 with 145 in 19-20. In 20-21, Aleah Goodman had 47 turnovers with 98 assists in a shortened season..TVO has 55 assists and 45 TOs this season So TVO's 91 TOs last year weren't the most in recent seasons as Slocum had three more one year, six the other and Wiese six more, but look at the assist to turnover ratio for those players and all others as well. Much, much better. I can tell with my own eyes that TVO is not the best ballhandler in the world when under pressure and the stats bear that out. TVO does not have great skills to play point guard and she really doesn't for the most part now. If she would maybe not try to do too much off the dribble and take care on her passes more consistently (she's actually a good passer IMO, but she forces some and is too lackadaisical on others...meaning I've seen her just whip one-handed passes to players and she went behind the back in a recent game as well and those look cool but are not really high percentage and always accurate) then she would cut down on the turnovers. I agree with you regarding Talia's assist to TO ratio, I also wonder how much better last season would have looked for Talia had she been surrounded by better scorers. She was just about the only guard who could score. Ellie finished strong and that helped, but Talia didn't have a 'Raegan' to pass the ball to. Kennedy had a poor shooting year, Jelena wasn't where she is this year. Tea, Emily, AJ, etc, just weren't great shooters. We'll never know, but I bet Talia could have added another 10-20 assist if she had players around her who could score. Oh, it probably did have an effect to an extent. And having Raegan this season will probably help her in that respect. But assists are both a give and take play. A true assist enables another player to score. That's why statisticians really aren't supposed to hand them out for just passing to a player who then creates the shot by driving past someone or whatever. As an aside, I looked up Sydney Wiese's other seasons. She did have over 100 turnovers as a freshman (109 to 141 assists)..she had 179 assists with 87 TOs as a soph and 143-89 as a junior. Some really good stats for her. |
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Post by rmancarl on Jan 10, 2023 22:25:22 GMT -8
Useless stat of the day. This season Talia is averaging a TO every 12 minutes. Raegan is averaging a TO every 11.5 minutes. If we could get those two down to zero TO's per game the Beavs would have a really good team.  |
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Post by rmancarl on Jan 11, 2023 9:36:42 GMT -8
Useless stat of the day. This season Talia is averaging a TO every 12 minutes. Raegan is averaging a TO every 11.5 minutes. If we could get those two down to zero TO's per game the Beavs would have a really good team. Actually rmancarl, if they were getting zero TO's per game, they either aren't playing much, or aren't playing at all. Neither one of those scenario's would be a good thing for the Beavers win/loss record. |
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Post by grayman on Jan 11, 2023 12:45:32 GMT -8
Useless stat of the day. This season Talia is averaging a TO every 12 minutes. Raegan is averaging a TO every 11.5 minutes. If we could get those two down to zero TO's per game the Beavs would have a really good team. Actually rmancarl, if they were getting zero TO's per game, they either aren't playing much, or aren't playing at all. Neither one of those scenario's would be a good thing for the Beavers win/loss record. LOL...we knew what you were getting at |
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Post by algernon14 on Jan 11, 2023 12:57:48 GMT -8
Talia is the leader and the face of the Beaver program, period. If we still had 3 pt shooters like Goodman and Tutor it would take a lot of pressure off her, but we don't and teams focus on her, and she still scores. Yes her TO's can be frustrating but that is minor compared to the positives she brings to the floor, she's got Pittsburgh Steelers moxie like her dad. GO BEAVS!
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Post by lotrader on Jan 11, 2023 13:37:09 GMT -8
Talia is the leader and the face of the Beaver program, period. If we still had 3 pt shooters like Goodman and Tutor it would take a lot of pressure off her, but we don't and teams focus on her, and she still scores. Yes her TO's can be frustrating but that is minor compared to the positives she brings to the floor, she's got Pittsburgh Steelers moxie like her dad. GO BEAVS! It is only frustrating because we all know TvO is fully capable of better decision making, which is what most of TvO's turnovers can be attributed. I don't think anyone on this blog questions TvO's value to OSU WBB. And are confident TvO will only get better as time progresses. Most everyone has commented on areas of her game that she has improved upon this season. |
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Post by scottybooks on Jan 11, 2023 13:41:26 GMT -8
Part of me would like to see Scott "unleash the Caitlin." Just once or twice. Talia's got the range, for sure, and a rifle passing arm.
Let TVO pop from outside at will, throw more baseball outlets (a way to break doubleteams and traps?) to open teammates.
(Parenthetically: how many times did we watch Marie and Taya break free near the hoop early on a possession change, arms up, ready to receive, and not be rewarded?)
Another 41 point game or two...sweet.
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Post by grayman on Jan 11, 2023 15:24:22 GMT -8
Part of me would like to see Scott "unleash the Caitlin." Just once or twice. Talia's got the range, for sure, and a rifle passing arm.
Let TVO pop from outside at will, throw more baseball outlets (a way to break doubleteams and traps?) to open teammates.
(Parenthetically: how many times did we watch Marie and Taya break free near the hoop early on a possession change, arms up, ready to receive, and not be rewarded?)
Another 41 point game or two...sweet.
Those teams did use the outlet to get out and run a little more (Marie was exceptional at running the court for a big), but they also had several players who were really good to great. This team is still trying to find its identity. Plus, it's not generally how Rueck's offense works. I do think the impact of Beers as an offensive threat around the basket should open things up for TVO (and others) on the perimeter but the shots just haven't dropped yet. I wouldn't expect anything close to another 41-point game in the Pac-12 schedule. That was against Nevada (a much weaker opponent) and was basically an anomaly for TVO anyway. She just isn't a volume scorer. She's had a 31-point game against USC last year and went for 32 against Eastern Washington this season. She scored 25 vs. Notre Dame last season (probably her best offensive performance to date) but also had games of 6 vs. Michigan, 0 at Villanova and 5 in one of the three losses to Stanford. If you look at her game-by-game stats, she really sits in that 10-18 point range pretty consistently. Nothing wrong with that. |
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Post by grayman on Jan 11, 2023 15:26:54 GMT -8
While looking through last season's stats for the above post I did find one game that was particularly interesting...TVO had 25 points in a win against New Mexico in the NIT. She had no assists and no turnovers.
But the Beavers had 20 assists for the game. Corosdale had six, Adams four and Codding four.
Not a usual occurrence but Corosdale had 69 assists with 50 turnovers and Adams 67 assists with 51 turnovers. Unfortunately, Adams was not a good scorer. No doubt Yeaney is an upgrade, but I think the Beavers are still without that true point guard who is both a polished passer who is great at distributing the ball and can score consistently.
They get one and I think TVO becomes a much more dangerous scoring threat.
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