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Post by rgeorge on Jun 9, 2022 17:11:58 GMT -8
Any inside info on the signing bonus Mr. Turley is asking for? that slot is in the $700k range. Definitely nice money but if he’s confident he may bet on himself to be a 1st rounder at 21 years old. Remember, teams have a "pool" of money and can increase amounts as they see fit. Last year the #2 pick actually brought down $1.4 mil more than the #1 pick. Teams regularly go over their bonus pool allotment even though there are penalties. So, if a team has a player high on their board drop to them in a later round they can compensate then over the slot value. |
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Post by chinmusic on Jun 9, 2022 17:59:46 GMT -8
Last year's #2 pick signed for more than #1 because #1 agreed to sign for substantially less than slot money. Baltimore had the same idea this year until their rumored pick needed elbow surgery. It's good strategy, find a top-5 quality player you want, draft him #1 and pay him #5 slot money or less. You are assured of getting that player and you can pay him actual value or less.
Rutschman may acually be the last 1st round draft pick we see receive full slot bonus money for a while.
Clubs chip a little off where they can and then use the remainder to sign a player over slt We experienced that with two recruits, Ian Oxvenad, a LHP out of Mountlake Terrace (Seattle) in 2015 when the Cardinals drafted him in the 8th round, then paid him 4th round money. The other was OF Kevin Watson from Beaverton in 2017, who was an 18th round pick of the Arizona Diamondbacks that was signed for $400k+.
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Post by beaverphd on Jun 10, 2022 8:14:32 GMT -8
Oxnevad topped out at High A after 5 seasons with a career 4.00 ERA and is now out of baseball as far as I can tell. Watson Jr is still playing and currently in A ball after 5 seasons with a career BA of 0.233. Come to Oregon State and develop!
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Post by joecool on Jun 10, 2022 8:25:29 GMT -8
Oxnevad topped out at High A after 5 seasons with a career 4.00 ERA and is now out of baseball as far as I can tell. Watson Jr is still playing and currently in A ball after 5 seasons with a career BA of 0.233. Come to Oregon State and develop! None of us have any clue if that would have happened though, they gave it a shot, got some bonus money. And can still get an education, which they probably got money for also when they signed. |
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Post by beaverphd on Jun 10, 2022 10:18:12 GMT -8
Oxnevad topped out at High A after 5 seasons with a career 4.00 ERA and is now out of baseball as far as I can tell. Watson Jr is still playing and currently in A ball after 5 seasons with a career BA of 0.233. Come to Oregon State and develop! None of us have any clue if that would have happened though, they gave it a shot, got some bonus money. And can still get an education, which they probably got money for also when they signed. Of course we can't know what never happened, I'd say we have a pretty good record of developing guys though. See Rutschman, Larnach, Madrigal, Kwan, Heimlich, Hjerpe, Melton, Boyd, etc |
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Post by chinmusic on Jun 10, 2022 12:57:36 GMT -8
Drafting high school players carries a fair amount of risk. Drafting high school pitchers carries an extreme amount of risk.
College players are more mature and have a longer track record to evaluate. This year the early rounds will be dominated by college position players. There have been so many injuries to college pitchers this year, the trend is being reversed. Even Super-prospect prep pitcher, Dylan Lesko from Buford, Georgia is down with UCL surgery - an event that shook up the first round with a domino effect.
Cooper Hjerpe is now projected to be one of the ealy college hurlers to be tapped with the 1st pick in the Compensatory round (#31 overall) by Baseball America.
Go to college - develop - get your education underway and enjoy the best 3 years of your life. No brainer for me. Is that worth foregoing a $1 mil bonus? Absolutely. Make the lifetime decision - go to school.
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Post by qbeaver on Jun 10, 2022 13:43:58 GMT -8
If players even want to go to college. A neighbor of mine signed with the Giants because he didn't like school. Hope the kids osu has signed value an education and the college experience both as a player and student.
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Post by rgeorge on Jun 10, 2022 14:48:28 GMT -8
If players even want to go to college. A neighbor of mine signed with the Giants because he didn't like school. Hope the kids osu has signed value an education and the college experience both as a player and student. Yes! Taking high 6 figure+ $ is certainly a reasonable "lifetime decision" that has advantages over going college. And, like "students", student athletes don't always want to continue their education, not even 2 yr/CC academics. Many students choose, vocation, CC, trade schools. The large $ draftees are doing the same. Except they have a job/paycheck, extensive resources, and a big chunk of cash. As far as "development". Hmmmm... coaches, trainers, rehab specialists, Dr's, nutritionists, extensive mentoring, facilities. The professional system is all about development at the lower levels. Plus most lucrative contracts include paying for your schooling. Everyone's "life decisions" differ. Going to college isn't for everyone. Plus some families realize there are limited windows for most to achieve success, or risk injury. And, that the real chance to make the MLB is slim, whether a HS, CC, 3yr/4yr college player. So, big $ and getting started is an option that's very attractive... especially with the limited schollies and small NIL $ (so far... prob never as schools can't compete with signing bonus pools). Bottom line being drafted at a lucrative level is a dilemma for some, not others. Funny the same "go to college" argument wouldn't be made if kids out of HS was say... an engineering savant. Offered a mil signing bonus and a job with a top 30 Corp in that field to not take a scholly to OSU's prestigious Engineering school... do you tell your kid OSU is the better "life decision". *I wonder does going to college the same great choice if said recruit decides to then attend... Oregon?🍻 |
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Post by qbeaver on Jun 10, 2022 16:01:25 GMT -8
That is why it's important to recruit kids who have a genuine interest in going to college. If they blow up in high school and get offered money too good to turn down,so be it. Recruiting classes are only judged by who ends up on campus,not who you sign. Casey in general was pretty good at that.
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Post by whocares on Jun 10, 2022 19:04:51 GMT -8
There are certain "benefits" to being a BMOC that shouldn't be underestimated.  |
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Post by ag87 on Jun 10, 2022 19:19:10 GMT -8
There are certain "benefits" to being a BMOC that shouldn't be underestimated. As a wild guess, being a bonus baby in Fayetteville (for instance) has the same benefits. |
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Post by rgeorge on Jun 10, 2022 19:22:13 GMT -8
There are certain "benefits" to being a BMOC that shouldn't be underestimated. As a wild guess, being a bonus baby in Fayetteville (for instance) has the same benefits. In those cases you have to "protect" that being a bonus baby, doesn't get you one!? |
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Post by chinmusic on Jun 10, 2022 21:39:38 GMT -8
Let's get back on track.
The Pro contract v OSU education is the issue. It is not the Pro contract v "allergic to school", Junior College, or Trade School individual we are discussing.
Oregon State only recruits athletes that are interested in attending a 4-year instution, are academically qualified and will gain admission to the University.
If you examine the player profiles/ bios, you will find many OSU recruits bring a 3.5 to 4.0 GPA from high school - Rutschman was there or close, and I believe Ober, Abel and Meckler had 4.0 GPA's, to name a few. These are not the "college isn't for everyone", or trade school prospects coming to OSU and that was the topic of conversation regarding Gavin Turley. OSU recruits have the Pro v College option and the bonus $$$ line and other reasoning will effect that decision.
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Post by rgeorge on Jun 10, 2022 22:29:42 GMT -8
"Is that worth foregoing a $1 mil bonus? Absolutely. Make the lifetime decision - go to school."
"The Pro contract v OSU education is the issue. It is not the Pro contract v "allergic to school", Junior College, or Trade School individual we are discussing."
Changing the targets/wording doesn't change the actual facts. There were several issues/comments in this thread... not just the OSU education vs a pro contract. "Lifetime decision... get an education" isn't for everyone... OSU or other. Kids that are good students go to schools of all kinds. Some even take the $$ in the draft. See the many examples that OSU recruited and didn't land. Plus, as stated, kids can have both... $$$ and OSU education.
I've had 3.5-4.0 kids go CC to get free education for two years then head off to a 4 yr. I've had drafted players go small school vs big... follow a girl friend... go CC because they wanted to play two sports... go to 4yr... go into the draft. All had 4yr offers. Some multiple.
OSU doesn't recruit "only" those interested in 4 yr schools. Because some end up not qualified, some are "hidden" at LB, some don't see an education anywhere better than $$$. But, in many cases those OSU recruits are the best players possible and are contacted at a very early stage of their academic and athletic development. Most have some idea of what they want, some have dreams of a certain program. Some of being drafted and school offers are Plan B. Some HS players even turn down a 4yr even though interested to go JC to be draft eligible sooner. Heck a kid could be drafted (improve their position even) three times before entering a 4 yr.
That's the point/situation with Turley and others named in this thread. They can most assuredly be interested in a 4 yr/OSU. For some their "lifetime decision" at that moment depends purely on the money. It is not about continuing their education unless the $$ aren't there.
Just as there are others where OSU is their dream school and no amount will change that.
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Post by chinmusic on Jun 13, 2022 14:25:27 GMT -8
To summarize:
This thread's original purpose was to focus on Gavin Turley, not every kid in America that has a variety of opportunities (professionally and educationally) and options presented to them.
That's another broader and more general in nature topic we can save for another time. Rather than morph the Turley pro-contract v OSU education thread into some sweeping conversation on the Pro v College topic, let's narrow the scope to Turley specifically.
I'm interested in a discussion of Turley's upcoming decision and the specific set of circumstances that will shape his decision.
Parental preference and advice, ditto older brother at UA, value placed on education and degree, desire to mature in college as opposed to hanging with single purpose (play, eat and sleep baseball) 19 year olds and "roughing it" in MiLB. Desire to play college and summer league baseball. What factors and considerations are in play for Gavin Turley?
OSU recruits athletes that are interested (if not intent) on playing college baseball at Oregon State, Those recruits are academically qualified, have solid transcripts, can do college level work and have a plan for their future. High character kids that are a good "fit" for the program. Filling group requirements for two years while deciding on a major is a bonafide plan in my book. Therefore, all the myriad of possibilities involving JuCo, Trade School, etc have no interest for me. My interest lies with specific prospects that have an OSU scholarship or preferred walk-on offer, b) OSU prospects and their draft status, rankings and probability of being drafted c) any expressed thinking they have on the college v Pro issue.
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