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Post by gustafgg on Oct 17, 2022 15:18:32 GMT -8
Logic has Talia, Bendu, AJ, Timea and Jelena starting with Shelexxus and Reagan first off the bench. Spot roles for Martha, Adele, Lily and Nicole. The rotation will see Jelena and Reagan spell eachother at center (5), with Timea and Reagan playing some together also.
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Post by bvrbooster on Oct 17, 2022 16:19:25 GMT -8
I think AJ. If she doesn't start on a team with only 4 returning players, I'd guess we lose her to the portal. I think she's got a tremendous upside, and this year's team should be good, but probably not a contender. I would want to get as many minutes as possible for AJ, Talia, Raegan, and Timea. They're our foundation for the next few years. I'd also make sure Raegan got plenty of time at the post. This is Jelena's 4th year in the program; no telling what she'll do after this year.I totally agree that there is no way to know for certain what Jelena will decide to do at the end of the season. But, I'd say she probably has 2nd or 3rd thoughts about heading back to Europe. She very well might discover that another year in the U.S. - on full scholarship - is the best of her options.... GO BEAVS!! She actually has 2 more years of eligibility. I don't know where she stands academically or what her major is, but she could certainly get a masters degree. Whether she would pursue that at OSU or elsewhere might be the question. |
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Post by willtalk on Oct 17, 2022 16:40:40 GMT -8
I think AJ. If she doesn't start on a team with only 4 returning players, I'd guess we lose her to the portal. I think she's got a tremendous upside, and this year's team should be good, but probably not a contender. I would want to get as many minutes as possible for AJ, Talia, Raegan, and Timea. They're our foundation for the next few years. I'd also make sure Raegan got plenty of time at the post. This is Jelena's 4th year in the program; no telling what she'll do after this year.I totally agree that there is no way to know for certain what Jelena will decide to do at the end of the season. But, I'd say she probably has 2nd or 3rd thoughts about heading back to Europe. She very well might discover that another year in the U.S. - on full scholarship - is the best of her options.... GO BEAVS!! Jelena still has a lot of upside development left physically and experience/confidence wise. Unless she really explodes in those areas this season, she more than likely will need another season to show her ceiling and skill level. I have posted before that I thought one of her main issues was a lack of confidence due to not being allowed to play more minutes due to Scott needing to keep Brown and Taylor happy. Once she knew she would not be pulled out for the slightest error and was allowed to be in the game long enough to establish a rythm she became very productive. I am not trying to disrespect or knock the freshman posts, but they have yet to play against the level of players they will face in D1 college ball. We can not assume that if a player is rated highly in high school and picked for the McD AA team that they will be dominant college players right out of the gate. There are variable factors involved in how well a player will transition to the next level. Greta was an example of someone who did not fullfill peoples expectations for her that first year. I have watched and recorded far too many top level high school teams/players to not have learned that a players skill level does not always translate smoothly to the next level. This is especially true for post players being that the face weak competition at the high school level. This does not mean they are not good players, only that their usually is a transition perriod to factor in. Often there is too much relience on high school ratings and players being named to Mc D AA Teams. Too many of you just assume that a McDonalds AA inexperinced freshman will be automantically better than Jelena. Of course I admit I have always thought Jelena had a huge untapped upside that was beginning to manifest at the end of last season once she was given the opportunity. Operating based on pure logic, it would make sense that of the three post players two start and one would be the back up for both the starters. Based on their skill sets and Beers coming off of an injury, it makes sense ( skill level and potential not withstanding ) that she is more suited to begin as a back up to both the 4 and 5 positons. In that way all three might end up with simular time on the court. At this point in time it appears that Reagan is more likely to have more early success at this level. |
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Post by rmancarl on Oct 17, 2022 19:08:05 GMT -8
Let's see if my crazy ideas will spark any talk.
A few over/under thoughts:
Talia 31mpg...over
Talia 15ppg...over
Bendu 10ppg...over
Jelena 25mpg...over
Jelena 9Rpg...under
Timea 29mpg...over
Will any freshman average double figure scoring? No
Will the Beavs make the NCAA tourney? No
What I don't think will happen, but believe there is an outside shot at happening:
Jelena averaging a double double.
One of the freshmen averaging 10ppg+
AJ averaging 10ppg while using her length to be a lock down defender.
Shalexxus Aaron averaging hitting 3 3's per game.
Raegan averaging 10+ rebounds per game.
Either Lily or Adlee being the freshman surprise of the year.
Ok, shoot away...
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Post by beaveragain on Oct 17, 2022 20:15:11 GMT -8
Is the over and under stuff some sort of gambling reference? And regardless, I don't understand what you mean.
In the past four years the ESPN top ten recruits have usually had one injured each year so they didn't do much, and a couple who just bombed out in college ball. The rest have had all conference type of seasons. So the chances are extremely high that at least one of Beers and Gardiner will have a really good season (yes, double digit scoring) and, depending on Beers return to health, reasonable chances that they both will.
To me there are two variables that will determine how the season goes.
1- Can Mit double her minutes. If you look at Mit's minutes from game to game last season you will see that she starts at single digits, goes up to around 20, and then crashes down to single digits again over and over. I think Rueck wanted to start her, she just wasn't in good enough shape to play 20 minutes consistently and so he'd have to rest her. Visually she seems to be in better shape, but does that translate into reality?
2- Despite Rueck's comment about Yeaney I can't find any evidence that she has ever played PG. If she can run the team and shoot a lot better than she did last season then the future looks very bright because the rest of her game is outstanding.
The last need is for one of Lily, Adlee or AJ being a decent 3. And out of the three of them I think it is reasonable that one will have decent success.
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Post by beaverstever on Oct 17, 2022 21:13:55 GMT -8
I totally agree that there is no way to know for certain what Jelena will decide to do at the end of the season. But, I'd say she probably has 2nd or 3rd thoughts about heading back to Europe. She very well might discover that another year in the U.S. - on full scholarship - is the best of her options.... GO BEAVS!! Jelena still has a lot of upside development left physically and experience/confidence wise. Unless she really explodes in those areas this season, she more than likely will need another season to show her ceiling and skill level. I have posted before that I thought one of her main issues was a lack of confidence due to not being allowed to play more minutes due to Scott needing to keep Brown and Taylor happy. Once she knew she would not be pulled out for the slightest error and was allowed to be in the game long enough to establish a rythm she became very productive. I am not trying to disrespect or knock the freshman posts, but they have yet to play against the level of players they will face in D1 college ball. We can not assume that if a player is rated highly in high school and picked for the McD AA team that they will be dominant college players right out of the gate. There are variable factors involved in how well a player will transition to the next level. Greta was an example of someone who did not fullfill peoples expectations for her that first year. I have watched and recorded far too many top level high school teams/players to not have learned that a players skill level does not always translate smoothly to the next level. This is especially true for post players being that the face weak competition at the high school level. This does not mean they are not good players, only that their usually is a transition perriod to factor in. Often there is too much relience on high school ratings and players being named to Mc D AA Teams. Too many of you just assume that a McDonalds AA inexperinced freshman will be automantically better than Jelena. Of course I admit I have always thought Jelena had a huge untapped upside that was beginning to manifest at the end of last season once she was given the opportunity. Operating based on pure logic, it would make sense that of the three post players two start and one would be the back up for both the starters. Based on their skill sets and Beers coming off of an injury, it makes sense ( skill level and potential not withstanding ) that she is more suited to begin as a back up to both the 4 and 5 positons. In that way all three might end up with simular time on the court. At this point in time it appears that Reagan is more likely to have more early success at this level. I’m confident Gardiner and Beers will have a fast ramp, simply because they’ve had a lot of opportunities already to play elite talent. Heck, Beers has been going against Lauren Betts every year since 7th grade. I just don’t think the speed and physicality will be something they haven’t yet experienced at the US and Intl levels. Some prospects struggle, but others arrive quickly - like Talia and Brink. And we will need them to. |
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Post by willtalk on Oct 18, 2022 1:00:57 GMT -8
Beaverstever-- There is a difference between stuggling and operating on the same level of efficiency at the next level. I never even implied that Beers would struggle. My point was that we should not try to compare a players effectivness at the high school level with that of someone playing at the D1 level. Athleticism usually arrives quicker. That is why Taylor was more productive her first year in the pac 12 than Kennedy. However, much also depends on their relative skill in respect to match ups. Although not in a postition to display it with Oregon St, Brown was a much better on ball defender than Jones who still needed to learn better technique not to be pushed out due to her higher center of gravity. It all depends on they type of player you are matched up against. A larger but shorter player can use size to their advantage against a taller lighter player that they would not be able to use as effectively against a larger player of simular or taller size. Its a matter of adapting and compensating to a larger variety of opponents than you have faced at the high scbool or even AAU level. Taller players generally develop slower.
I personally want to see things for myself rather than take others words for it. Well we will soon see how things work out. We should also not expect Beers to reach her actual level until well into the season, due to the fact she is working her way back from her injury. That is another reason for her to start slowly as the post off the bench. She may well come back quickly, but that should not be an expectations.
Two of the better post players in Oregons St history did not show much until they had at least a season of starting under their belts. Some of you want to deny Jelena that same opportunity to show what she can do for the sake of the shiny new toys. Those shiny new toys will not be kept in a box and will certainly have the opportunity to shine. The lack of post depth makes it a necessity for all to get plenty of minutes.
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Post by hoopheritic on Oct 18, 2022 6:17:30 GMT -8
Let's see if my crazy ideas will spark any talk. A few over/under thoughts: Talia 31mpg...over Talia 15ppg...over Bendu 10ppg...over Jelena 25mpg...over Jelena 9Rpg...under Timea 29mpg...over Will any freshman average double figure scoring? No Will the Beavs make the NCAA tourney? No What I don't think will happen, but believe there is an outside shot at happening: Jelena averaging a double double. One of the freshmen averaging 10ppg+ AJ averaging 10ppg while using her length to be a lock down defender. Shalexxus Aaron averaging hitting 3 3's per game. Raegan averaging 10+ rebounds per game. Either Lily or Adlee being the freshman surprise of the year. Ok, shoot away... Reagan or Timea could average ~10 PPG if they can stay on the floor. Freshman bigs learning to play defense at this level without fouling is often a challenge. See Taylor Jones. It would be a bad sign if AJ is in a reduced role from last season. Not just for her but for the program; you have to develop your players especially top recruits. Her toolbox is deep so there are a lot of tools to sharpen...which one(s) got attention this summer? A healthy Bendu will start. I think she was the missing piece last season. Talia will get similar PPG as last year but on less shots. She will increase APG and hopefully steals. With Bendu, AJ, Timea on the floor she will have to play with pace. That speed package can get up and down. Lex will be a solid multi-spot sub off the bench. Adlee and Lily can shoot; but can they defend in space? Defense keeps you on the floor. If Adlee can learn some of Talia's bully ball skills she can be an asset. Martha will be the backup PG. Adlee is a third option when we have foul trouble, especially against bigger backcourts. This roster will have less available minutes for Noelle once conference play starts. |
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Post by hoopheritic on Oct 18, 2022 6:19:50 GMT -8
Jelena still has a lot of upside development left physically and experience/confidence wise. Unless she really explodes in those areas this season, she more than likely will need another season to show her ceiling and skill level. I have posted before that I thought one of her main issues was a lack of confidence due to not being allowed to play more minutes due to Scott needing to keep Brown and Taylor happy. Once she knew she would not be pulled out for the slightest error and was allowed to be in the game long enough to establish a rythm she became very productive. I am not trying to disrespect or knock the freshman posts, but they have yet to play against the level of players they will face in D1 college ball. We can not assume that if a player is rated highly in high school and picked for the McD AA team that they will be dominant college players right out of the gate. There are variable factors involved in how well a player will transition to the next level. Greta was an example of someone who did not fullfill peoples expectations for her that first year. I have watched and recorded far too many top level high school teams/players to not have learned that a players skill level does not always translate smoothly to the next level. This is especially true for post players being that the face weak competition at the high school level. This does not mean they are not good players, only that their usually is a transition perriod to factor in. Often there is too much relience on high school ratings and players being named to Mc D AA Teams. Too many of you just assume that a McDonalds AA inexperinced freshman will be automantically better than Jelena. Of course I admit I have always thought Jelena had a huge untapped upside that was beginning to manifest at the end of last season once she was given the opportunity. Operating based on pure logic, it would make sense that of the three post players two start and one would be the back up for both the starters. Based on their skill sets and Beers coming off of an injury, it makes sense ( skill level and potential not withstanding ) that she is more suited to begin as a back up to both the 4 and 5 positons. In that way all three might end up with simular time on the court. At this point in time it appears that Reagan is more likely to have more early success at this level. I’m confident Gardiner and Beers will have a fast ramp, simply because they’ve had a lot of opportunities already to play elite talent. Heck, Beers has been going against Lauren Betts every year since 7th grade. I just don’t think the speed and physicality will be something they haven’t yet experienced at the US and Intl levels. Some prospects struggle, but others arrive quickly - like Talia and Brink. And we will need them to. People forget how big Jelena is. There is a limit to how many minutes a player that big can go. 20 min is a lot. |
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Post by lotrader on Oct 18, 2022 7:47:01 GMT -8
Nice observations hoopheritic. I agree that Martha will end up as our backup PG. I watched a lot of her games this summer and she is a solid PG. Where Martha will struggle is defensively against a PG who can post her up. Re: Jelena: If Jelena has visions of playing professionally, Jelena is going to have to improve her stamina to endure >20 minutes on the floor. Jelena is very important this season to OSU WBB's success--need her on the floor > 20 minutes/game. |
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Post by wbosh15 on Oct 18, 2022 8:15:01 GMT -8
Looking at some photos of Shelexxis and Gardner side by side and Shelexxis is much taller than I expected. I could see her getting some time at the 4 this season.
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Post by greybeav on Oct 18, 2022 9:28:05 GMT -8
Looking at some photos of Shelexxis and Gardner side by side and Shelexxis is much taller than I expected. I could see her getting some time at the 4 this season. Got me thinking, you made me look. Sort by size, there are a lot of 6'1" plus / minus this year. osubeavers.com/sports/womens-basketball/roster?path=wbball |
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Post by rmancarl on Oct 18, 2022 10:29:03 GMT -8
SR has already mentioned that Shalexxus Aaron could play some four, so I would expect when the Beavs go small, or someone is needed to fill in at the 4 spot she may be the first to get a shot. Personally, the player I would consider at the 4 spot is AJ because of her overall athletic ability. She's probably the best jumper on the team, and likely has more speed than anyone. You would think that would her make up for the lack of size, and would help her defensively against the bigger, stronger, players.
I know AJ said she worked on her 3pt shooting this offseason, but I would love to hear that the coaches worked with her on rebounding and driving to the basket. Remember how Shasa would be around the top of the key, and then boom, one step and she was off to the basket. AJ's speed could really make her a challenge if she could put the ball on the floor and blow past people. Same thing for rebounding. She has great hops. I would like to see her working on her game around the basket....going up for loose balls, etc. We'll see. She has a great chance at developing. It normally takes time, but I'd love to see that Kobie leap happen with her this season.
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Post by willtalk on Oct 18, 2022 18:51:58 GMT -8
Is the over and under stuff some sort of gambling reference? And regardless, I don't understand what you mean. In the past four years the ESPN top ten recruits have usually had one injured each year so they didn't do much, and a couple who just bombed out in college ball. The rest have had all conference type of seasons. So the chances are extremely high that at least one of Beers and Gardiner will have a really good season (yes, double digit scoring) and, depending on Beers return to health, reasonable chances that they both will. To me there are two variables that will determine how the season goes. 1- Can Mit double her minutes. If you look at Mit's minutes from game to game last season you will see that she starts at single digits, goes up to around 20, and then crashes down to single digits again over and over. I think Rueck wanted to start her, she just wasn't in good enough shape to play 20 minutes consistently and so he'd have to rest her. Visually she seems to be in better shape, but does that translate into reality? 2- Despite Rueck's comment about Yeaney I can't find any evidence that she has ever played PG. If she can run the team and shoot a lot better than she did last season then the future looks very bright because the rest of her game is outstanding. The last need is for one of Lily, Adlee or AJ being a decent 3. And out of the three of them I think it is reasonable that one will have decent success. I do not believe the minutes Scott gave Mit were a result of her being in shape or out of shape. I tended to watch Oregon St's post players more than other postions. Jelena peaked my interest from the time I watched her pre college games on video, so I watched her carefully. From watching the games, Jelena's playing time was more dependent on what those ahead of her in the rotation did than what she did on the floor. Even beyond that Scott seemed to have a quick hook when it came to her. For example, one game she was in for perhaps a minute and a half, when she recieved the ball about 8ft out and made a strong move to the basket knocking a defender down in the process. She was called for an iffy O-fout purely because of how far the defender flew. Scott pulled here right out and never put her back in that game. One would think that her agressiveness should have been encouraged. Often he would pull her out for really no reason at all after a limited number of minutes. We have to remember that the team was loaded with vet players capable of playing the post. Look, I am not making an evaluation on Jelena's actual game fitness, just that the minutes Scott gave her, via the eyeball test, did not support that. I strongly suspect that Scott was worried about playing time for his highly ranked players more than he had ever been before. He did not want to upset them because it has become so easy to transfer out with no consequence. I have always supported Scott against his detractors on this site and elsewhere, but I will say that a reason Mit did not get more playing time was because it would interfer with the court time of Jones or Brown. It appear he might have been worried ( and it seems with good reason ) that they might transfer out if not kept happy because of too much time on the bench. Scott had never before had to deal with such highly ranked players on his team expecially now when it is easy to transfer. He must have felt that Jelena was less likely to leave the program. I saw a player who was not playing with confidence because she was always anticipating being pulled out of games. At the end of last season people assumed she took a quick leap forward, But it was not a leap of skill, but confidence knowing she was not going to be pulled out for the slightest of reasons. Plus team mates were actually looking to pass her the ball in the block. I suspect we might see that confidence push her to play at even a higher level this season. |
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Post by beaverstever on Oct 18, 2022 19:56:48 GMT -8
If you are correct with your theory, the he knew KB was gone before the season ended, because she was coming off the bench even with Jones long out injured.
I personally think it was a factor of her effectiveness vs. the opponent, primarily on the defensive end - her minutes varied a lot game to game.
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