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Post by chinmusic on Aug 24, 2022 6:36:58 GMT -8
What is Oregon thinking?
The Oregonian says the Duck's representatives held "preliminary" conversations with the B1G representatives in Chicago last week.
A Big-10 scribe said the meeting was "beyond the "exploratory" stage. Both Oregon and Washington had talked with the B1G shortly after USC and UCLA's surprising exit from the PAC-1.
Oregon talking with the Big-10 publicly? What kind of message does that send to PAC-12 member schools? 1. Oregon is seriously looking to leave the PAC-12? 2. This talk of unity by PAC-12 member schools is Hogwash ?
The B1G wants and is waiting on a Notre Dame decision. According to reports, Notre Dame has more interest in the SEC than the Big-10.
If Oregon and Washington bolt for greener $$$ pastures. 33% of the PAC is gone and arguably, the 4 strongest athletic programs in the conference.
PAC-12 Athletic Directors must now consider an "every man for himself" contingency strategy.
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Post by irimi on Aug 24, 2022 7:21:28 GMT -8
Maybe that’s what’s required. A full-on disintegration of the Pac 12 conference might be the only way to save it.
I can only guess that fans won’t exactly be thrilled watching their team play teams that have no significance to them. And the faithful fans that once traveled up and down I-5 to follow their teams are not going to be happy.
And the former Pac 12 teams will always be sorta second tier members of their new conference.
It’s all scheming and dirty. Someone needs to stand up and shame these universities.
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rafer
Sophomore
Posts: 1,626 
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Post by rafer on Aug 24, 2022 8:54:32 GMT -8
Maybe that’s what’s required. A full-on disintegration of the Pac 12 conference might be the only way to save it. I can only guess that fans won’t exactly be thrilled watching their team play teams that have no significance to them. And the faithful fans that once traveled up and down I-5 to follow their teams are not going to be happy. And the former Pac 12 teams will always be sorta second tier members of their new conference. It’s all scheming and dirty. Someone needs to stand up and shame these universities. You're forgetting that the slug eaters are totally owned by the richest man in college ownership circles. He wants HIS team and their 200 uniform combinations to be front and center on the national stage. He will PAY 100s of million$ and prostitute the school to stay on the national tv networks every weekend, I only hope the B1g and SEC don't want to deal with all the prima donnas s%#te is the U of Hole!! |
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Post by beaverstever on Aug 24, 2022 9:45:43 GMT -8
If you separate the athletic programs from the academic institutions (which to a significant degree has been happening for a while), and view the athletic programs as independent professional entities, its makes much more sense.
From that standpoint, what value does the NCAA bring? It's value is all in it's ability to bring standardization to the process of games, competition and how champions are determined. It only works if the major entities participate in it. If say, the SEC left the NCAA and created or joined a new organization, it immediately fractures the landscape.
In the early days of pro football, basketball and baseball, there were multiple organizations that jockeyed for dominance, until usually the dominant ones merged (NFC and AFC, AL/NL, ABA absorbed into NBA).
I think we are seeing the same thing play out with college sports that happened in the same early days of our pro leagues. The NCAA is increasingly seen as parasitic and toothless, while the conferences are increasingly operating like leagues looking to dominate the overall landscape (particularly the B1G and SEC). With changes like the NIL, college sports (FB,MBB) is more blatantly just professional sports, with some highly profitable and many others not all all.
Oregon State sports as a stand-alone entity would struggle to complete in a multi-tiered system like European soccer or a small-market MLB or NBA team, and has little leverage to force it's way into the top tier. uo has spent enough of Phil's money to at least make a case that it's franchise can compete with the top-tier, and deserves a seat at the table. I actually think they (and UW) don't have a choice - I see little reason to believe/trust that the Pac-12 has the leverage or the leadership to keep it's 'league' in the conversation as the power struggle shakes out; they sure have proven inept for quite a while.
So I ask myself, why do I even care about the Pac-12? Is it just to keep the traditions in place? Traditions are nice, but they are pretty artificial in this case, as the Pac-12 as been through multiple iterations. Is it because it's the best option for Oregon State sports to be competitive? If that's the reason, then we really can't be upset at the schools who want to leave for exactly that reason - leaving the Pac-12 is seen as their best option to become more competitive.
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Post by irimi on Aug 24, 2022 11:41:49 GMT -8
If you separate the athletic programs from the academic institutions (which to a significant degree has been happening for a while), and view the athletic programs as independent professional entities, its makes much more sense. From that standpoint, what value does the NCAA bring? It's value is all in it's ability to bring standardization to the process of games, competition and how champions are determined. It only works if the major entities participate in it. If say, the SEC left the NCAA and created or joined a new organization, it immediately fractures the landscape. In the early days of pro football, basketball and baseball, there were multiple organizations that jockeyed for dominance, until usually the dominant ones merged (NFC and AFC, AL/NL, ABA absorbed into NBA). I think we are seeing the same thing play out with college sports that happened in the same early days of our pro leagues. The NCAA is increasingly seen as parasitic and toothless, while the conferences are increasingly operating like leagues looking to dominate the overall landscape (particularly the B1G and SEC). With changes like the NIL, college sports (FB,MBB) is more blatantly just professional sports, with some highly profitable and many others not all all. Oregon State sports as a stand-alone entity would struggle to complete in a multi-tiered system like European soccer or a small-market MLB or NBA team, and has little leverage to force it's way into the top tier. uo has spent enough of Phil's money to at least make a case that it's franchise can compete with the top-tier, and deserves a seat at the table. I actually think they (and UW) don't have a choice - I see little reason to believe/trust that the Pac-12 has the leverage or the leadership to keep it's 'league' in the conversation as the power struggle shakes out; they sure have proven inept for quite a while. So I ask myself, why do I even care about the Pac-12? Is it just to keep the traditions in place? Traditions are nice, but they are pretty artificial in this case, as the Pac-12 as been through multiple iterations. Is it because it's the best option for Oregon State sports to be competitive? If that's the reason, then we really can't be upset at the schools who want to leave for exactly that reason - leaving the Pac-12 is seen as their best option to become more competitive. Good points. Except that everything changes. Used to be the Pac was a powerhouse. |
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Post by fishwrapper on Aug 25, 2022 19:18:39 GMT -8
Yes, I know there are new hands on the helm, but...I fear that the PAC-12 will manage the reshuffling landscape of leagues no better than it managed launching a television network. (I would prefer to be wrong.)
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Post by chinmusic on Aug 25, 2022 21:29:31 GMT -8
It all starts with a commitment from the University Presidents.
And that issue dates back to the Oklahoma and Texas interest.
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rob85
Freshman
Posts: 304
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Post by rob85 on Aug 25, 2022 23:40:30 GMT -8
I expect there will be a formal separating of athletics, more specifically football and maybe mens basketball, at the larger sports obsessed institutions. If the former athletic departments become private ventures, they can be run for profit. Players no longer need to be students, lease the stadiums/arenas from the universities, retain rights to use the team names and mascots. They are then free of the NCAA and can make their own rules, and act as the developmental leagues for the NFL and NBA. Universities no longer have to run ADs, but get the benefit of income and name recognition. When athletics become private, I would think Title IX no longer applies, so non-revenue sports drop to a club level or disappear.
I would be surprised if this idea has not been privately floated at places like Alabama, Ohio State, Oklahoma, LSU, Georgia, Michigan, etc.
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Post by Werebeaver on Aug 26, 2022 5:33:42 GMT -8
Maybe that’s what’s required. A full-on disintegration of the Pac 12 conference might be the only way to save it. I can only guess that fans won’t exactly be thrilled watching their team play teams that have no significance to them. And the faithful fans that once traveled up and down I-5 to follow their teams are not going to be happy. And the former Pac 12 teams will always be sorta second tier members of their new conference. It’s all scheming and dirty. Someone needs to stand up and shame these universities. You're forgetting that the slug eaters are totally owned by the richest man in college ownership circles. He wants HIS team and their 200 uniform combinations to be front and center on the national stage. He will PAY 100s of million$ and prostitute the school to stay on the national tv networks every weekend, I only hope the B1g and SEC don't want to deal with all the prima donnas s%#te is the U of Hole!! The man you refer to is also in his mid-80’s. What happens to the athletic dept he supports after he checks out? |
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Post by william44 on Aug 26, 2022 13:48:06 GMT -8
A lot of interesting stuff that will play out. To think Phil Knight can be the lead with no official help from u of o is scary. I doubt it changes their market size. Their 2 percent that attended May be the only rational people there.
Regarding us we have no arbiter and no clout. Neither does wsu . They do have a larger Statewide audience. I guess there is no State pride or loyalty . I am long past expecting that. Some say it will be the end of collegiate sports. Some say Mountain West. Some say Pac ——. It will take a miracle for us to end up better than now. Can hope until that is taken away.
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Post by seastape on Aug 26, 2022 18:53:46 GMT -8
I expect there will be a formal separating of athletics, more specifically football and maybe mens basketball, at the larger sports obsessed institutions. If the former athletic departments become private ventures, they can be run for profit. Players no longer need to be students, lease the stadiums/arenas from the universities, retain rights to use the team names and mascots. They are then free of the NCAA and can make their own rules, and act as the developmental leagues for the NFL and NBA. Universities no longer have to run ADs, ut get the benefit of income and name recognition. When athletics become private, I would think Title IX no longer applies, so non-revenue sports drop to a club level or disappear. I would be surprised if this idea has not been privately floated at places like Alabama, Ohio State, Oklahoma, LSU, Georgia, Michigan, etc. I wonder if that would kill even the biggest programs. The sole reason I watch every single Oregon State football and basketball game that I can is because the athletes are playing for the school I attended. For the unaffiliated Corvallis Beavers? Maybe a game or two over my collegiate career (if the tickets had been affordable) but nowhere near the amount I attended OSU Beaver games. And once I graduated? Forget it. I think a LOT of college sports fans feel the exact same way. No way do the minor league Ann Arbor Wolverines draw 100k. And no way do sports networks give a minor league football and basketball conference of sixteen teams a 7 year, 7 billion-dollar contract with escalator clauses. I get where your going with the idea of disassociating athletics and academics, but I think that would go nowhere. |
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Post by seastape on Aug 26, 2022 22:31:33 GMT -8
you're
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bill82
Sophomore
OSU's 10,157th Best Donor
Posts: 1,008
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Post by bill82 on Aug 27, 2022 4:57:36 GMT -8
I expect there will be a formal separating of athletics, more specifically football and maybe mens basketball, at the larger sports obsessed institutions. If the former athletic departments become private ventures, they can be run for profit. Players no longer need to be students, lease the stadiums/arenas from the universities, retain rights to use the team names and mascots. They are then free of the NCAA and can make their own rules, and act as the developmental leagues for the NFL and NBA. Universities no longer have to run ADs, ut get the benefit of income and name recognition. When athletics become private, I would think Title IX no longer applies, so non-revenue sports drop to a club level or disappear. I would be surprised if this idea has not been privately floated at places like Alabama, Ohio State, Oklahoma, LSU, Georgia, Michigan, etc. I wonder if that would kill even the biggest programs. The sole reason I watch every single Oregon State football and basketball game that I can is because the athletes are playing for the school I attended. For the unaffiliated Corvallis Beavers? Maybe a game or two over my collegiate career (if the tickets had been affordable) but nowhere near the amount I attended OSU Beaver games. And once I graduated? Forget it. I think a LOT of college sports fans feel the exact same way. No way do the minor league Ann Arbor Wolverines draw 100k. And no way do sports networks give a minor league football and basketball conference of sixteen teams a 7 year, 7 billion-dollar contract with escalator clauses. I get where your going with the idea of disassociating athletics and academics, but I think that would go nowhere. Maybe online gamblers will prop up broadcast revenues. If the NFL decides to expand take over Saturdays.... |
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Post by chinmusic on Sept 3, 2022 12:46:02 GMT -8
The terrible messaging for the beleaguered PAC-12 continues. Washington has again bellied up to the BIG-10 table to talk Turkey with America's most powerful conference.
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Post by flyfishinbeav on Sept 5, 2022 18:49:18 GMT -8
FTd!!!
And.....
Bone the dawgs!!!
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