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Post by nwhoopfan on May 2, 2022 10:00:58 GMT -8
Count me as one who is underwhelmed by the portal additions so far. Last year OSU struggled to score. They lost the # 2, 3, 4, 5 and 7 scorers from that team (yes that includes Jones, who obviously missed a big chunk of the season) and replaced them with...2 players who haven't shown themselves to be big offensive producers in Pac 12 play. Unless multiple freshmen are great right out of the gate next season, the team looks to be even worse offensively than last year.
Need more front court players. With the way injuries have piled up in recent seasons, 3 players is not enough.
Are they really only 4 returning players? That is just unbelievable.
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Post by wbosh15 on May 2, 2022 10:04:07 GMT -8
Basically what you are saying is there is a disconnect between who they really would like to get verses who they can actually land. Am I correct in what you are trying to convey here? I'm unfortunately beginning to think that. Of course no one know if it is by SR's choice or ??, but only grad transfers so far the last two seasons seems a bit weird?! Add, to that OSU has now lost 4 of their last 5 top recruits and not adding the equivalent in transfers is also a bit alarming. And... also a bit of commentary on the WBB board. If you read back, most all the postseason recruiting "hopes and dreams"/expectations of what the program needed to "fix" the roster seems to contrast with the recent actual signings. Again, no one knows what the roster will be like come September, but at this point it's a touch scary. I think we can simplifying things by really just looking at top talent level. To me you need a least 2 all-pac 12 level players for a top 4 finish, and 3 or more if you want to win a title. We had 1 last year, 1 have 1 currently. I don't see Beers or Gardiner playing at that level right away, so I understand the frustration. It's certainly an expectation change, but we are no longer a program thinking about a top 4 side and home games in the NCAA tournament, currently this is a bubble roster and just trying to qualify for the tournament. In that vain, I don't think Aaron's an all-pac difference maker, but I think she can help.
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nksuwu
Freshman
Longtime Beaver fan...especially WBB
Posts: 74
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Post by nksuwu on May 2, 2022 10:14:45 GMT -8
A little more background on Shalexxous Aaron: she comes from a basketball family (Dad played at Central Washington and professionally in Australia; mom played at Cal State San Bernadino; older brother Shaddean averaged 16 pts. at Mercer; older brother Shaqquan played at Rainer Beach, Louisville, and USC, then briefly in G League). She spent her first 3 years at Juanita HS in Kirkland, WA, before the family moved to Riverside, CA where she was a first team CIF-Southern Section selection. She had 2 ACL and a meniscus tear in HS. She played AAU ball with Aleah Goodman at Cal Stars coached by Kelly Sopak (other girls in that program over the years: Sabrina Ionescu, Evina Westbrook, Mallory McGuire, Minyon Moore, Cameron Brink, Aaronette Vonleh, to name a few).
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Post by wbosh15 on May 2, 2022 10:15:35 GMT -8
I totally disagree. 1 - Offensively, the 2 and 3 positions are totally interchangeable in modern space and pace basketball. In reality, for most teams the 2-4 positions are completely interchangeable. 2 - I think Hansford doesn't have the footspeed for the wing, and her best position is the 4, using her length and versatility there. 3 - I also think Yeany has the ability to be a small-ball 4, because of her strength. She'll give up a bit of size, but should be able to hold up. And... I'll totally disagree with this take... - the 1, 2, 3 are interchangable, some "4s" can swing out, but most not on a regular basis as most can not defend a G/W. - Hansford is slight and "stated" at 6'2"... she'd get eaten up by Pac12 PF/C types in the post. Can't imagine what a Ellie Mack type would do to her as a Frosh "4". She's a SG/W that can post up a SG/W. - Yeaney is quick, built but no way can handle playing the "4" unless the opponent is going small ball. OSU is in for a long season if either Yeaney or Hansford are playing the "4" with any regularity. The list above is one of 1, 2, 3's that have some versatility, but not at the "4" vs teams we hope to compete with at the top 3rd/half of the Pac12. I get your concern, but here is why I don't share it. How many teams really have that kind of size even in the pac-12. I can only think of 2 who have that type of size. The 2 best 4's in the conference are Jones from Stanford and Johnson from Utah, and Jones is Stanford's point guard, and Johnson to me is more of a wing. Oregon State has had a huge size advantage on everyone they've played for years and the results have been less that impressive. With the 3 point shot I think think playing small is WAY more valuable than playing big.
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Post by rgeorge on May 2, 2022 10:38:17 GMT -8
And... I'll totally disagree with this take... - the 1, 2, 3 are interchangable, some "4s" can swing out, but most not on a regular basis as most can not defend a G/W. - Hansford is slight and "stated" at 6'2"... she'd get eaten up by Pac12 PF/C types in the post. Can't imagine what a Ellie Mack type would do to her as a Frosh "4". She's a SG/W that can post up a SG/W. - Yeaney is quick, built but no way can handle playing the "4" unless the opponent is going small ball. OSU is in for a long season if either Yeaney or Hansford are playing the "4" with any regularity. The list above is one of 1, 2, 3's that have some versatility, but not at the "4" vs teams we hope to compete with at the top 3rd/half of the Pac12. I get your concern, but here is why I don't share it. How many teams really have that kind of size even in the pac-12. I can only think of 2 who have that type of size. The 2 best 4's in the conference are Jones from Stanford and Johnson from Utah, and Jones is Stanford's point guard, and Johnson to me is more of a wing. Oregon State has had a huge size advantage on everyone they've played for years and the results have been less that impressive. With the 3 point shot I think think playing small is WAY more valuable than playing big. True, but the size advantage is due to SR's preferred style of play. He is far more controlled/half court sets, with uptempo/fast break, full court pressure at the bare minimum. And, the "less than impressive" results have a lot to do with OSU's very static system and teams' ability to prep for OSU. So, if SR is in the midst of changing personnel to fit a "new" style of play I'd agree. Although that does not fit some of returning players at all. Right now I think SR is stuck between a rock and a hard place. He's a developer of a system... players need to be here and learn the system and his style over years. But, the portal and the love for the faster pace of play has left him/OSU in a place of transition. At the same time the Pac12 has come to know exactly what he does and unless OSU has superior talent his controlled sets have not been getting the same results. Unless SR lands 2-3 very good front court players to run his sets I don;t see how they can compete if the top 4-5 of the conference. I do not see many portal pieces that can sustain his style of play vs the upper tier of the Pac12. And, because of the past (losing 4 of his last 5 highly rated recruits) and the present portal situation how many of the current incoming Frosh will stick?? I know it is the same for all programs, but I do not give a rat's arse about them. I care about what SR plans/succeeds at to bring OSU WBB back into the top tier of the Pac12.
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Post by beaverstever on May 2, 2022 10:40:14 GMT -8
Yeaney ended by defending bigs often in UAs defensive schemes. Not that you want it by design, but she’s physically able to do it. Good posts can go over her, but she offers more options than her height would indicate.
On Hansford, I also think she will get eaten up by the physicality, but I thought the same on Sasha, who was effectively used by Ark as a big defender last year. So we may be surprised. But I agree that another Mack-type player would make me a lot more comfortable about next season.
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escott58
Sophomore
Posts: 1,146
Grad Year: 1983
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Post by escott58 on May 2, 2022 11:26:05 GMT -8
I'm definitely not going to do any hand-wringing over the new Beaver WBB team members. I like them already! Coach isn't going to get rid of them based on our recommendations.
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Post by blodgettbeaver on May 2, 2022 11:28:55 GMT -8
I've seen no poster state predictions on how things will play out. Other recruits or season. Myself, I've simply pointed out obvious facts that on this same board have been construed as "negatives" in the past. Another grad transfer that has never been a major contributor at the P5 level. That has been associated with 4 schools in less than a year. Has played in 57 total games, 29 being in one season ('18-19 I believe) and 16 last, since 2017. In very very limited action she has been a 6ppg type scorer, who slumped to a low 30% shooter in her most recent 16 games. Point being, this is in no way the type of recruit folks on this board expected/ wanted/ hoped for by this point in time. Nor does it fill a real need and would have been called "exciting" in the previous month. At this time OSU has one proven Pac12 starter, a couple "could bes", a ton of inexperienced frosh, and no experienced size with some athleticism. Edit... wanted to actually see the roster as it stands: Yeaney (Grad) Aaron (Grad) Mannon (RJr) Marotte (So) Mitrovic (RSo) TVO (So) Gardiner (Fr) Beers (Fr) Blacklock (Fr) Hansford (Fr) So who is not a proven PA12 starter between Yeaney and TVO?
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Post by bvrbooster on May 2, 2022 11:34:21 GMT -8
So, do you guys think we'll win a single game next year? Score higher than 43 in any game? Think Gardiner will average 2.7 points and 1.3 rebounds, or not quite that high? Expect Aaron to be injured by the second quarter of the first game, or will she make it to the 3rd quarter? Will we give up 17 fast break buckets per game because we're so slow, or will it be 19? Is it a given that Beers will be rehabbing until after the next presidential election?
There are still hundreds of players looking for a home, but you make it sound like we're not going to get any of them. Imagine if, after Adlee became our first 2022 commit, all of you just assumed that would be it, nobody else was coming, and started railing about what a lousy job the staff had done, the end of the world was upon us, and so on.
That's what you sound like right now to me. Lighten up. The first game is 6 months from now - maybe we'll score 45 and win it.
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Post by rmancarl on May 2, 2022 12:06:26 GMT -8
Wow, lots of opinions here and that's a good thing. I always want to be an optimist when it comes to the Beavs, but sometimes we also need to step back and take the orange colored glasses off and take a look. To date, in my mind, a realistic look shows Arizona is able to pick up Lauren Fields (a guard that I wasn't that thrilled about, but everybody wanted) and USC was able to land Kayla Williams (the player I really wanted to see the Beavs land). Gonzaga, Cal, Utah, Baylor, have all landed players us fans thought we would like to see at Oregon State, while the Beavs have landed two players that most would consider average at best. You also look at Yeaney and Aaron, and in my mind, they would be considered low hanging fruit. Yeaney wanted to return home, and Aaron and the Beavs have flirted with each other back to her High School days, and she has been showing social medial interest for weeks. This does make you question the ability of SR, JH, and company to land experienced high quality players for next season.
Now, the good news, both Yeaney and Aaron show some promise. I stated this in another post, but I could see one, or both having a 'career' year at Oregon State. Did you know Yeaney averaged over 9ppg her freshman season and shot .400 from 3? That was her best all around stat year, but who is to say she can't do it again? That's more PPG than Aleah averaged her Junior season. Aaron has also showed she has the potential to be a double digit scorer if playing close to 30mpg. It's a lot of ask of someone who has had health issues, but in the Beaver system where she would be counted on to shoot the 3, I could see her having her best year yet as well.
More good news, the Beavs still have up to 5 scholarships available, so judging this off-season now is judging prematurely. Can we really criticize this portal season before it is over?
Taking off the orange colored glasses again, what should concern all of us as fans is that many of the top players have now found a home, there aren't that many quality 'bigs' still available, I'm not sure how much more low hanging fruit there is, and the Beavs have yet to find a PG.
Putting the glasses back on one more time, I think the Beavs have improved their backcourt with possible more additions to come. I'll take Sophomores Talia and AJ, along with Noelle, Adlee, Bendu, and Shalexxus, over freshman Talia and AJ, and Greta, Tea, and Emily. Some may debate that, but I think it's an improvement. We don't know yet who the starters will be, but again I'd go with Talia and Bendu over Talia and Greta, Tea or Emily.
Now, it's a waiting game to see if others are added.
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Post by hoopheritic on May 2, 2022 13:46:57 GMT -8
My worry is the Beavs now have 5 players whose natural position is 2 Guard. That can't be good for locker room chemistry. Yeaney (Grad) Aaron (Grad) Marotte (So) TVO (So) Blacklock (Fr) Hansford (Fr) Marotte and Yeaney have the most speed out of the group, by a lot. Are they going to be at the point? I totally disagree. 1 - Offensively, the 2 and 3 positions are totally interchangeable in modern space and pace basketball. In reality, for most teams the 2-4 positions are completely interchangeable. 2 - I think Hansford doesn't have the footspeed for the wing, and her best position is the 4, using her length and versatility there. 3 - I also think Yeany has the ability to be a small-ball 4, because of her strength. She'll give up a bit of size, but should be able to hold up. On the floor I essentially agree with you. But I'm referring to the locker room vibe when so many players are, more or less, competing for the same spot. But to your point, Marotte showed she could defend 1-4 and became our best perimeter defender in space. With some ball handling work she could develop into a PG option as a junior or late this year. Blacklock and Hansford look like they will be most comfortable shooting spot up corner 3s and both have enough length to be useful in a zone. I think Yeaney can defend small-ball 4s and is a clear slash threat. Intel on Aaron is thin. Talia needs to find another gear this off-season as it looks like SR is building a small fast squad whereas this last season he clearly slowed the game down to accommodate Talia.
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Post by jdogge on May 2, 2022 15:07:13 GMT -8
Geez, f%$#&Ng Louise people. Get a grip. The roster is not yet complete and we're hearing chicken little BS.
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Post by beaverstever on May 2, 2022 16:25:07 GMT -8
My worry is the Beavs now have 5 players whose natural position is 2 Guard. That can't be good for locker room chemistry. Yeaney (Grad) Aaron (Grad) Marotte (So) TVO (So) Blacklock (Fr) Hansford (Fr) Marotte and Yeaney have the most speed out of the group, by a lot. Are they going to be at the point? I totally disagree. 1 - Offensively, the 2 and 3 positions are totally interchangeable in modern space and pace basketball. In reality, for most teams the 2-4 positions are completely interchangeable. 2 - I think Hansford doesn't have the footspeed for the wing, and her best position is the 4, using her length and versatility there. 3 - I also think Yeany has the ability to be a small-ball 4, because of her strength. She'll give up a bit of size, but should be able to hold up. Hansford was projected as a D1 wing, so I suspect her footspeed is better than it appears. She doesn't look (or play) fast for sure, but sometimes that's deceptive. She certainly wasn't taught to play off players in HS. Here's a good segment of what I mean: (see the next ~30s from that point) Now that's not a D1 wing she's bodying up at the 3 pt line, but that's a much smaller player unable to get around her. On the other hand, imagine her posted up against Beers, Gardiner, Corosdale, Mack, etc. I haven't seen her in that situation, but she seems to be more of a finesse player. Maybe she'll become more physical, but it seems more likely that she's going to have to be able to close-out and keep up with wings to see the floor.
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Post by greybeav on May 2, 2022 17:07:29 GMT -8
Beaverstever, I like your taking time to point out her game. I see her as very smooth, deceptive in speed because she is fluid, but yeah, never challenged in HS to run hard. I have said over and over she was severely under-utilized in HS, she slashes to the basket but no one feeds her, so she stops trying. Her AAU games were very different, when those guards got her the ball when she cut, etc. She does look "soft" for contact, I'm hoping time with our coaches ,against other D1 players will speed up her game and prep her for contact better. She is rebound "hungry", and lastly has one of the smoothest 3 pt shots I have seen in awhile. Her % is fair, she shot near the HS line a lot versus Blacklock that commonly shot a foot or so back, prepping for the college line I am guessing. Although, in this set she is behind the line a lot: linkand back to the topic of Shalexxus...
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Post by grayman on May 2, 2022 17:07:59 GMT -8
I actually like how the roster is shaping up, considering the level of losses...team speed is better and Yeaney and Aaron bring plenty of experience. Obviously, there is room for a big or two and maybe a point guard, though I think Yeaney and/or Aaron can step in there as needed. It's not a perfect situation, but if the freshmen contribute and one or two establish themselves as potential top players, then there's no reason the Beavers can't be competitive and make the NCAA Tournament. It's also a big season for Rueck, IMO. But I think he's up to the challenge. If not, well, it will be an even more interesting offseason in 2023.
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