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Post by RenoBeaver on Jul 29, 2021 11:39:35 GMT -8
Harsh realities for Pac 12 academia l, but let's be real, this isn't about academics anymore, nor has it been for a while as spelled out in the article. I'd argue Pac should seriously consider 2 other schools...OK St and UNLV. OSU for obvious reasons, and while UNLV doesn't add much sportwise at this point, long term Las Vegas could be the epicenter of the Pac 12 and potentially college sports. The facilities available to UNLV are on par with any university in the country, in a city approaching 2.5M and growing. Legitimizing UNLV could quite possibly create a monster in multiple sports. UCF was an afterthought not that long ago. 247sports.com/college/arizona/Article/four-schools-priority-pac-12-expansion-168413780/Amp/ |
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Post by beaver55to7 on Jul 29, 2021 16:43:59 GMT -8
Harsh realities for Pac 12 academia l, but let's be real, this isn't about academics anymore, nor has it been for a while as spelled out in the article. I'd argue Pac should seriously consider 2 other schools...OK St and UNLV. OSU for obvious reasons, and while UNLV doesn't add much sportwise at this point, long term Las Vegas could be the epicenter of the Pac 12 and potentially college sports. The facilities available to UNLV are on par with any university in the country, in a city approaching 2.5M and growing. Legitimizing UNLV could quite possibly create a monster in multiple sports. UCF was an afterthought not that long ago. 247sports.com/college/arizona/Article/four-schools-priority-pac-12-expansion-168413780/Amp/Unfortunately, the article says nothing about the most important, really only, reason for expansion. Can the new members bring in more revenue then they suck out? USC doesn’t need more members sucking off their revenue. If I were USC I would see those schools as more deadweight to carry. Our new commissioner has made it clear that taking care of USC is job one. Think of it as the old saying, what’s good for GM is good for America…What’s good for USC is good for the Pac-12. I don’t think those are schools you could sell to USC. |
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Post by bigfatbeaver on Jul 29, 2021 18:38:42 GMT -8
If I had to add 4
University of Houston - Tier 1 Research institution, brings Houston media market.
TCU or Baylor - Pick one, both bring a media market
Kansas - Basketball and their media market
UNLV - I would probably go with UNLV for the future.
Media Matters
Rank Designated Market Area (DMA) TV Homes % of US
2 Los Angeles 5,145,350 4.808
5 Dallas-Ft. Worth 2,563,320 2.395
6 San Francisco-Oak-San Jose 2,364,740 2.210
8 Houston 2,330,180 2.178
11 Phoenix (Prescott) 1,879,780 1.757
13 Seattle-Tacoma 1,764,680 1.649
17 Denver 1,532,320 1.432
20 Sacramnto-Stkton-Modesto 1,317,500 1.231
22 Portland, OR 1,112,500 1.040
30 Salt Lake City 952,470 0.890
32 Kansas City 896,850 0.838
39 Las Vegas 743,220 0.695
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Post by seastape on Jul 29, 2021 22:26:13 GMT -8
Harsh realities for Pac 12 academia l, but let's be real, this isn't about academics anymore, nor has it been for a while as spelled out in the article. I'd argue Pac should seriously consider 2 other schools...OK St and UNLV. OSU for obvious reasons, and while UNLV doesn't add much sportwise at this point, long term Las Vegas could be the epicenter of the Pac 12 and potentially college sports. The facilities available to UNLV are on par with any university in the country, in a city approaching 2.5M and growing. Legitimizing UNLV could quite possibly create a monster in multiple sports. UCF was an afterthought not that long ago. 247sports.com/college/arizona/Article/four-schools-priority-pac-12-expansion-168413780/Amp/Unfortunately, the article says nothing about the most important, really only, reason for expansion. Can the new members bring in more revenue then they suck out? USC doesn’t need more members sucking off their revenue. If I were USC I would see those schools as more deadweight to carry. Our new commissioner has made it clear that taking care of USC is job one. Think of it as the old saying, what’s good for GM is good for America…What’s good for USC is good for the Pac-12. I don’t think those are schools you could sell to USC. Like your post. I don't see any teams west of the Mississippi that would add a whole lot to the Pac 12 and I'd rather not see the conference expand their geographical footprint beyond the (relative) west. Here's to hoping the Pac 12 remains intact. |
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Post by beaver55to7 on Jul 30, 2021 5:48:47 GMT -8
Unfortunately, the article says nothing about the most important, really only, reason for expansion. Can the new members bring in more revenue then they suck out? USC doesn’t need more members sucking off their revenue. If I were USC I would see those schools as more deadweight to carry. Our new commissioner has made it clear that taking care of USC is job one. Think of it as the old saying, what’s good for GM is good for America…What’s good for USC is good for the Pac-12. I don’t think those are schools you could sell to USC. Like your post. I don't see any teams west of the Mississippi that would add a whole lot to the Pac 12 and I'd rather not see the conference expand their geographical footprint beyond the (relative) west. Here's to hoping the Pac 12 remains intact. It defies logic that the teams Texas and Oklahoma just ran away from are somehow a good fit for USC to run to. I don't think our new Commissioner is going to let those desperate teams pump sunshine up is wazoo and bring them along without it making sense for USC. So we agree, the most likely outcome of this is the Pac 12 remains intact and stable. |
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Post by beavs6 on Jul 30, 2021 7:00:24 GMT -8
Could a BIG-10(14) and a PAC-12 merger work? Have 2 13 Team divisions with a championship game.(for football)
That would help lock in the Mich/Ohio ST/USC's of the world. I just think standing put could be detrimental. A 26 Team BIG-10/PAC-12 and a 26 Team SEC/ACC type thing would at least keep some semblance of order.(maybe?)
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Post by atownbeaver on Jul 30, 2021 7:15:40 GMT -8
Harsh realities for Pac 12 academia l, but let's be real, this isn't about academics anymore, nor has it been for a while as spelled out in the article. I'd argue Pac should seriously consider 2 other schools...OK St and UNLV. OSU for obvious reasons, and while UNLV doesn't add much sportwise at this point, long term Las Vegas could be the epicenter of the Pac 12 and potentially college sports. The facilities available to UNLV are on par with any university in the country, in a city approaching 2.5M and growing. Legitimizing UNLV could quite possibly create a monster in multiple sports. UCF was an afterthought not that long ago. 247sports.com/college/arizona/Article/four-schools-priority-pac-12-expansion-168413780/Amp/Unfortunately, the article says nothing about the most important, really only, reason for expansion. Can the new members bring in more revenue then they suck out? USC doesn’t need more members sucking off their revenue. If I were USC I would see those schools as more deadweight to carry. Our new commissioner has made it clear that taking care of USC is job one. Think of it as the old saying, what’s good for GM is good for America…What’s good for USC is good for the Pac-12. I don’t think those are schools you could sell to USC. I agree that you bring up the fundamental issue. Any new team has to essentially bring in viewers/streamers/ticket buyers. Moreso than they would take in revenue sharing. While Vegas Is a large media market, are they are sports watching team? I dunno. I guess we will see with the Raiders and the Knights seem to be doing okay. I think UNLV can be intriguing, as they can be immediately competitive in every sport other than football, and probably not that far out from competing in football. The downside is the research side. While yes, they are a research university and a public land grant... they aren't exactly great at it, and command an endowment about half of OSU and WSU. Less so than other schools I floated in another thread: Utah State and Colorado St. UNLV's value is the Vegas TV market. I think if the Pac-12 really wants to be more than 12 (why??? is a good question) we are going after a Kansas/KSU pair or a pair of Texas schools like TCU, Baylor (ugh...) or Texas Tech. Because really, there is simply nobody left in the region that is a big enough school to join up. |
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Post by bennyskid on Jul 30, 2021 7:40:43 GMT -8
The bar for any incoming school has to be - Is the school on par with the current MEAN within the Pac? Anything less and the school gets more from the Pac than the Pac gets from the school.
Right now, that means pulling 50k fans or so in football, carrying a major TV media market, getting votes (at least) in the FB and BB polls routinely, getting into the post-season in at least half of your minor sports every year, and having at least one or two sports in which you have a national rep.
The only schools that checks off all of these boxes are Baylor and BYU - neither of whom will ever be asked. No one else checks off more than one or two of these boxes.
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Post by spudbeaver on Jul 30, 2021 9:47:47 GMT -8
Unfortunately, the article says nothing about the most important, really only, reason for expansion. Can the new members bring in more revenue then they suck out? USC doesn’t need more members sucking off their revenue. If I were USC I would see those schools as more deadweight to carry. Our new commissioner has made it clear that taking care of USC is job one. Think of it as the old saying, what’s good for GM is good for America…What’s good for USC is good for the Pac-12. I don’t think those are schools you could sell to USC. I agree that you bring up the fundamental issue. Any new team has to essentially bring in viewers/streamers/ticket buyers. Moreso than they would take in revenue sharing. While Vegas Is a large media market, are they are sports watching team? I dunno. I guess we will see with the Raiders and the Knights seem to be doing okay. I think UNLV can be intriguing, as they can be immediately competitive in every sport other than football, and probably not that far out from competing in football. The downside is the research side. While yes, they are a research university and a public land grant... they aren't exactly great at it, and command an endowment about half of OSU and WSU. Less so than other schools I floated in another thread: Utah State and Colorado St. UNLV's value is the Vegas TV market. I think if the Pac-12 really wants to be more than 12 (why??? is a good question) we are going after a Kansas/KSU pair or a pair of Texas schools like TCU, Baylor (ugh...) or Texas Tech. Because really, there is simply nobody left in the region that is a big enough school to join up. I'd like to know how you think that UNLV is "probably not that far out from competing in football." Since 2000 their record: 2000 8 5 0 .615 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd John Robinson - - 2001 4 7 0 .364 3 4 0 .429 6th John Robinson - - 2002 5 7 0 .417 3 4 0 .429 T-5th John Robinson - - 2003 6 6 0 .500 2 5 0 .286 T-7th John Robinson - - 2004 2 9 0 .182 1 6 0 .143 8th John Robinson - - 2005 2 9 0 .182 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2006 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 T-8th Mike Sanford - - 2007 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2008 5 7 0 .417 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Mike Sanford - - 2009 5 7 0 .417 3 5 0 .375 6th Mike Sanford - - 2010 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2011 2 10 0 .167 1 6 0 .143 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2012 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 8th Bobby Hauck - - 2013 7 6 0 .538 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd (West) Bobby Hauck - - 2014 2 11 0 .154 1 7 0 .125 12th Bobby Hauck - - 2015 3 9 0 .250 2 6 0 .250 T-4th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2016 4 8 0 .333 3 5 0 .375 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2017 5 7 0 .417 4 4 0 .500 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2018 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2019 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - |
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Post by bucktoothvarmit on Jul 30, 2021 11:34:46 GMT -8
Could a BIG-10(14) and a PAC-12 merger work? Have 2 13 Team divisions with a championship game.(for football) That would help lock in the Mich/Ohio ST/USC's of the world. I just think standing put could be detrimental. A 26 Team BIG-10/PAC-12 and a 26 Team SEC/ACC type thing would at least keep some semblance of order.(maybe?) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This!^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ They could even call the championship game "The Rose Bowl" Go Beavs!! |
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Post by RenoBeaver on Jul 30, 2021 12:17:03 GMT -8
I agree that you bring up the fundamental issue. Any new team has to essentially bring in viewers/streamers/ticket buyers. Moreso than they would take in revenue sharing. While Vegas Is a large media market, are they are sports watching team? I dunno. I guess we will see with the Raiders and the Knights seem to be doing okay. I think UNLV can be intriguing, as they can be immediately competitive in every sport other than football, and probably not that far out from competing in football. The downside is the research side. While yes, they are a research university and a public land grant... they aren't exactly great at it, and command an endowment about half of OSU and WSU. Less so than other schools I floated in another thread: Utah State and Colorado St. UNLV's value is the Vegas TV market. I think if the Pac-12 really wants to be more than 12 (why??? is a good question) we are going after a Kansas/KSU pair or a pair of Texas schools like TCU, Baylor (ugh...) or Texas Tech. Because really, there is simply nobody left in the region that is a big enough school to join up. I'd like to know how you think that UNLV is "probably not that far out from competing in football." Since 2000 their record: 2000 8 5 0 .615 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd John Robinson - - 2001 4 7 0 .364 3 4 0 .429 6th John Robinson - - 2002 5 7 0 .417 3 4 0 .429 T-5th John Robinson - - 2003 6 6 0 .500 2 5 0 .286 T-7th John Robinson - - 2004 2 9 0 .182 1 6 0 .143 8th John Robinson - - 2005 2 9 0 .182 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2006 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 T-8th Mike Sanford - - 2007 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2008 5 7 0 .417 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Mike Sanford - - 2009 5 7 0 .417 3 5 0 .375 6th Mike Sanford - - 2010 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2011 2 10 0 .167 1 6 0 .143 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2012 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 8th Bobby Hauck - - 2013 7 6 0 .538 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd (West) Bobby Hauck - - 2014 2 11 0 .154 1 7 0 .125 12th Bobby Hauck - - 2015 3 9 0 .250 2 6 0 .250 T-4th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2016 4 8 0 .333 3 5 0 .375 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2017 5 7 0 .417 4 4 0 .500 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2018 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2019 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - If UNLV gets access to the Pac 12 or any major conference, they can show recruits they have the best football stadium, potentially the best basketball arena if they move to T mobile, in a city that is as glamorous as LA and willing to throw huge endorsements to kids. of course that's not important to some kids...but the ones that count who are using college sports merely as a vehicle to play pro sport... It has the potential to be a sleeping giant in this new landscape of college sports. |
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Post by spudbeaver on Jul 30, 2021 12:22:25 GMT -8
I'd like to know how you think that UNLV is "probably not that far out from competing in football." Since 2000 their record: 2000 8 5 0 .615 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd John Robinson - - 2001 4 7 0 .364 3 4 0 .429 6th John Robinson - - 2002 5 7 0 .417 3 4 0 .429 T-5th John Robinson - - 2003 6 6 0 .500 2 5 0 .286 T-7th John Robinson - - 2004 2 9 0 .182 1 6 0 .143 8th John Robinson - - 2005 2 9 0 .182 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2006 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 T-8th Mike Sanford - - 2007 2 10 0 .167 1 7 0 .125 9th Mike Sanford - - 2008 5 7 0 .417 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Mike Sanford - - 2009 5 7 0 .417 3 5 0 .375 6th Mike Sanford - - 2010 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2011 2 10 0 .167 1 6 0 .143 T-6th Bobby Hauck - - 2012 2 11 0 .154 2 6 0 .250 8th Bobby Hauck - - 2013 7 6 0 .538 4 3 0 .571 T-3rd (West) Bobby Hauck - - 2014 2 11 0 .154 1 7 0 .125 12th Bobby Hauck - - 2015 3 9 0 .250 2 6 0 .250 T-4th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2016 4 8 0 .333 3 5 0 .375 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2017 5 7 0 .417 4 4 0 .500 T-3rd (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2018 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - - 2019 4 8 0 .333 2 6 0 .250 5th (West) Tony Sanchez - If UNLV gets access to the Pac 12 or any major conference, they can show recruits they have the best football stadium, potentially the best basketball arena if they move to T mobile, in a city that is as glamorous as LA and willing to throw huge endorsements to kids. of course that's not important to some kids...but the ones that count who are using college sports merely as a vehicle to play pro sport... It has the potential to be a sleeping giant in this new landscape of college sports. Ah, the Ol' sleeping giant. Thought Arizona St had the trademark on that. But anyway, they could show recruits those things now. The money grabbers should have already figured out that you don't need a conference for endorsement deals. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Jul 30, 2021 12:34:27 GMT -8
I think UNLV could do just fine at this level, but personally I'd like it to be the neutral host for our league's Championships from here on out so I'd rather they not be in our league.
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Post by Judge Smails on Jul 30, 2021 12:47:14 GMT -8
If UNLV gets access to the Pac 12 or any major conference, they can show recruits they have the best football stadium, potentially the best basketball arena if they move to T mobile, in a city that is as glamorous as LA and willing to throw huge endorsements to kids. of course that's not important to some kids...but the ones that count who are using college sports merely as a vehicle to play pro sport... It has the potential to be a sleeping giant in this new landscape of college sports. Ah, the Ol' sleeping giant. Thought Arizona St had the trademark on that. But anyway, they could show recruits those things now. The money grabbers should have already figured out that you don't need a conference for endorsement deals. Now with NIL, UNLV is a couple of 5* wise guys away from making it big in football. |
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Post by killerbeavs on Jul 30, 2021 13:53:37 GMT -8
Could a BIG-10(14) and a PAC-12 merger work? Have 2 13 Team divisions with a championship game.(for football) That would help lock in the Mich/Ohio ST/USC's of the world. I just think standing put could be detrimental. A 26 Team BIG-10/PAC-12 and a 26 Team SEC/ACC type thing would at least keep some semblance of order.(maybe?) Take the Big 10 + Pac 12 and add 6 teams from the remnants of the Big 12 for four 10 team divisions. Or grab 8 more teams for 12 team divisions. Have a 4 or 8 team conference playoff, winner plays the combined SEC/ACC champs for the national title. |
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