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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 21, 2020 10:49:38 GMT -8
Wayne's teams at OSU have finished in the bottom quarter twice. You act like it's all the time. You predict 10th at best next year, yet you are wrong about the past. Might as well give him the year and see how things shake out. When there is an earthquake at sea and a few minutes later the water at the shoreline dramatically recedes you don't wait to see if a tsunami is coming. By the way looking at the bench who is replacing tinkle, Kelley, and Thompson next year? I lived in an earthquake/tsunami area for 14 years. When a big earthquake occurs you walk inland. When a tsunami warning comes out, you make plans and take steps to get out of the way. You don't avoid the coastline all the time because a big earthquake might happen. Finishing 4th last year is not an earthquake. 15 and 11 with a minimum of 5 games left and a fair shot at the NIT is not an earthquake. Thompson isn't even gone, we may find out otherwise in a few weeks but for now it's speculation. If he's gone, Tinkle will still have more starters and more firepower returning next season than he had coming into year one of his tenure (where OSU was picked to finish dead last but finished 7th). Go ahead and live in fear.
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Post by hoopsman on Feb 21, 2020 11:11:00 GMT -8
I was at university of montana when Wayne Tinkle coached there. He was 1 year from getting fired then got hot for 3 years and won the big sky and made it to the tournament. Then got blitzed by other coaches. Totally out coached at that level. Syracuse hammered us by 48. It was embarrassing. If Osu was smart, fire Tinkle and hire the current grizzly coach. Travis Decuire. That guy is good. When Montana made it to the tourney 2 years. They gave Michagin a ton of trouble. He is going to be picked up by someone soon. He can coach and recruit. Just my opinion.
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Post by ag87 on Feb 21, 2020 11:14:00 GMT -8
This is going to go the same as it always has. We're a competitive team. The fans think we should be more than competitive so we'll fire the coach, the team will go through two years of ho-hum need to get his guys in, cupboard was bare, new system etc. Then after some level of success we will level off to where we have been for literally the past 40 years and it will be time to fire that guys too. So I don't really care anymore about coaching changes. Pick a guy who isn't a piece of s%#t and let's roll with him. At this point in OSU basketball it isn't accepting mediocrity it is accepting reality. A new coach brings in enthusiasm and energy. Robinson brought that in and then could not sustain it. Coach Tinkle brought that in also. Without expectations, we got to the tournament in year two. Now this is four more years and we have never been a bubble team? Whatever Tinkle brought with him ( I believe it was more than GPII) he has lost it. For his salary, I know we can do better. We can find someone in that energizes our program and keeps momentum on our side for more than two or three years.
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Post by baseba1111 on Feb 21, 2020 11:15:45 GMT -8
He'll be happy then. Of course depending on other teams, conference upsets, etc... OSU prob is in NIT from sites I've seen. Unless we tank and go 15-16 or the NC SOS is heavily weighted, I'm betting 17 Ws gets OSU in with 4-6th seed. Yippy... and to top it off we get to read about what a great accomplishment it is... first time since... 2 postseasons in 6... blah blah blah. Should OSU make the NIT as you say.. who was the last OSU coach before Tinkle to achieve an NCAA and NIT berth in a 5 season span?.. He's OSU's 6th? coach since 1990 and now many times did OSU make either one of those tournaments before he got here? Seems to me that is better than any OSU coach has done since Miller was here I know you'll probably say im accepting mediocrity... or that im giving him to much credit based on the bad past before him..Im sure you'll bring up the 20+ games below .500 in PAC 12 play or that the only reason OSU won 10 conference games last season was because the league was down.. or the only reason OSU made the NCAA in 2016 was all because of GPII... Doesn't he get any credit for his coaching at all?.. to read what the posters on here post you'd think his entire tenure to date has been a train wreck of nothing but 5-27 season's Any way thats my 2 cents.. First... my critiques are based on getting past "mediocrity". IMHO WT is not the guy to take OSU any further. He had to have an extremely special player that was already being recruited fall into his lap, and have two highly talented sons that were automatic recruits to land in ONE NCAA tourney. He then could not turn that success into any decent recruiting years... could not develop the talent recruited and frustrated 11 of the 20 into leaving (although one was academic, but was leaving anyone according to sources in the AD). Second... as for the past... when can wT supporters figure out using past failures to support the current regime is the weakest argument possible. What happened with other coaches has zero to do with the current state of the program. Teams, players, schedules, selection processes are all different. What I love is the cherry picking. NCAA tourney team may not have been selected any year after that... when was the last time since that the Pac12 got a 6th team? Hence, the twice in five years argument and past coaches is complete and utter nonsense. Third... please go ahead and point out WT's coaching and recruiting acumen. PLEASE. Come on... tell us all the bigs he has developed that exceeded their potential. The above average recruiting classes... next year's is a real doozy so far. How about the family atmosphere that makes young men feel welcome and want to stay and be developed by a teacher of the game. Ok, in-game coaching strategies and management that allows OSU to overcome half time deficits at an above mediocre rate (vs 60 games below .500 or so). Or just how all of the above rolls into being the 39th highest paid D1 coach in the nation. Come on... anyone. But NO. It's always the same fantasy comparisons to the past. So... my two cents... and it has been the same all along... OSU is at a point in support ($2.2 mil and climbing + staff) that they can and should expect more from their money. And, that IF OSU actually wants to be battling for the top 4-5 spots in the Pac12 conference, ON A REGULAR BASIS, Wt is not going to be that guy. I think (6) seasons of bottom tier recruiting (can't wait to hear the same excuses in year 7... as was year 4, year 5, year 6), lack of developing talent, in-game management has clearly shown that. You know the definition of insanity? Well, continued excusing of the above is just that. And, I'm sure an vaunted NIT berth will make several on here very pleased and assure all of us it is a sign of the future. Unfortunately, they'll be right!
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Post by baseba1111 on Feb 21, 2020 11:34:57 GMT -8
When there is an earthquake at sea and a few minutes later the water at the shoreline dramatically recedes you don't wait to see if a tsunami is coming. By the way looking at the bench who is replacing tinkle, Kelley, and Thompson next year? I lived in an earthquake/tsunami area for 14 years. When a big earthquake occurs you walk inland. When a tsunami warning comes out, you make plans and take steps to get out of the way. You don't avoid the coastline all the time because a big earthquake might happen. Finishing 4th last year is not an earthquake. 15 and 11 with a minimum of 5 games left and a fair shot at the NIT is not an earthquake. Thompson isn't even gone, we may find out otherwise in a few weeks but for now it's speculation. If he's gone, Tinkle will still have more starters and more firepower returning next season than he had coming into year one of his tenure (where OSU was picked to finish dead last but finished 7th). Go ahead and live in fear. That deserves the biggest acronym of all... but no, not even worth that. Quakes and WT!? Really? Guess it is better than the constant living in the past to promote the lack of a future. Oh but you really are... really hung up on CR players being worthless, yet keys to the depth that lead to Year 2 success But, you know who was here in year 1, right? So you're saying no ET, no KK, no Tres and next year has more firepower than the first GPII team?? So... apples to apples, as we already know what happened stats/injury wise with the '14-15 guys and do not with next years team... so let's just look at the rosters: GPII Isaiah Johnson (recruit)Victor Robbins LucasCheikh D'iaye ZackMalcolm SilvaLMW DastrupGomis HuntOlaf VernonJarmal HollinsDahlen SMMSanders Tucker Franklin (RS)
This is the roster you are going to plant your flag on? You must see several huge developments for this team to have a change at 7th. And, that is if all of those stay put. Any wager on that? Of course OSU can always fill their roster with the March thru August siness like last summer!?
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Post by nabeav on Feb 21, 2020 11:47:00 GMT -8
Should OSU make the NIT as you say.. who was the last OSU coach before Tinkle to achieve an NCAA and NIT berth in a 5 season span?.. He's OSU's 6th? coach since 1990 and now many times did OSU make either one of those tournaments before he got here? Seems to me that is better than any OSU coach has done since Miller was here I know you'll probably say im accepting mediocrity... or that im giving him to much credit based on the bad past before him..Im sure you'll bring up the 20+ games below .500 in PAC 12 play or that the only reason OSU won 10 conference games last season was because the league was down.. or the only reason OSU made the NCAA in 2016 was all because of GPII... Doesn't he get any credit for his coaching at all?.. to read what the posters on here post you'd think his entire tenure to date has been a train wreck of nothing but 5-27 season's Any way thats my 2 cents.. First... my critiques are based on getting past "mediocrity". IMHO WT is not the guy to take OSU any further. He had to have an extremely special player that was already being recruited fall into his lap, and have two highly talented sons that were automatic recruits to land in ONE NCAA tourney. He then could not turn that success into any decent recruiting years... could not develop the talent recruited and frustrated 11 of the 20 into leaving (although one was academic, but was leaving anyone according to sources in the AD). Second... as for the past... when can wT supporters figure out using past failures to support the current regime is the weakest argument possible. What happened with other coaches has zero to do with the current state of the program. Teams, players, schedules, selection processes are all different. What I love is the cherry picking. NCAA tourney team may not have been selected any year after that... when was the last time since that the Pac12 got a 6th team? Hence, the twice in five years argument and past coaches is complete and utter nonsense. Third... please go ahead and point out WT's coaching and recruiting acumen. PLEASE. Come on... tell us all the bigs he has developed that exceeded their potential. The above average recruiting classes... next year's is a real doozy so far. How about the family atmosphere that makes young men feel welcome and want to stay and be developed by a teacher of the game. Ok, in-game coaching strategies and management that allows OSU to overcome half time deficits at an above mediocre rate (vs 60 games below .500 or so). Or just how all of the above rolls into being the 39th highest paid D1 coach in the nation. Come on... anyone. But NO. It's always the same fantasy comparisons to the past. So... my two cents... and it has been the same all along... OSU is at a point in support ($2.2 mil and climbing + staff) that they can and should expect more from their money. And, that IF OSU actually wants to be battling for the top 4-5 spots in the Pac12 conference, ON A REGULAR BASIS, Wt is not going to be that guy. I think (6) seasons of bottom tier recruiting (can't wait to hear the same excuses in year 7... as was year 4, year 5, year 6), lack of developing talent, in-game management has clearly shown that. You know the definition of insanity? Well, continued excusing of the above is just that. And, I'm sure an vaunted NIT berth will make several on here very pleased and assure all of us it is a sign of the future. Unfortunately, they'll be right! Even when I agree with you, I don't want to because you're so abrasive with your rebuttals. I tend to agree that most seasons under Wayne are going to be "on the bubble" at best. Of course I would like to be competing for conference titles and NCAA bids. But when you mention we aren't getting our money's worth, if we make a change, we owe Wayne $2M+ for the next three seasons. A new coach is going to cost us $1M at least, and that's if you get a guy operating at a lower level or completely unproven assistant. Now you're devoting even more resources to basketball, and at what point does the new guy have to win to justify that? One tournament berth? Two? Assuming Andy Enfield and Jerod Haase make more than Wayne Tinkle (I think these are both likely), Wayne is 8th in pay in the conference. We're a half game out of 8th in the conference, so I guess I would ask what you think getting our money's worth would be?
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 21, 2020 11:49:52 GMT -8
As mentioned by someone earlier, there's accepting mediocrity and there's accepting reality.
The reality is in the 24 seasons prior to Tinkle's arrival OSU had TWO winning seasons, three tied seasons and 19 losing seasons. Tinkle has had one losing season, one tied season, and is 1 win away from locking down his 4th winning season in total years - and that IS the current state of the program, not the poor program that some posters are claiming it is.
That alone should buy him some time to at least have one more losing season, or at least finish in the bottom quarter of the league a couple times in a row, before canning him.
I do get the "enthusiasm" generation argument, but I'll take the dullness of winning more games than losing over another year or 24 of abject failure any day. As for expectations due to how much OSU is paying, when you pay bottom 3-4 in the league salaries (I think he was hired on as the 2nd lowest paid coach, he's 4th lowest this year) you should expect bottom 3-4 in the league results.
Until OSU is ready to make some kind of overall change (beyond coaching change) to promote the basketball program, it's doubtful any new coach can do better.
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Post by baseba1111 on Feb 21, 2020 12:05:53 GMT -8
First... my critiques are based on getting past "mediocrity". IMHO WT is not the guy to take OSU any further. He had to have an extremely special player that was already being recruited fall into his lap, and have two highly talented sons that were automatic recruits to land in ONE NCAA tourney. He then could not turn that success into any decent recruiting years... could not develop the talent recruited and frustrated 11 of the 20 into leaving (although one was academic, but was leaving anyone according to sources in the AD). Second... as for the past... when can wT supporters figure out using past failures to support the current regime is the weakest argument possible. What happened with other coaches has zero to do with the current state of the program. Teams, players, schedules, selection processes are all different. What I love is the cherry picking. NCAA tourney team may not have been selected any year after that... when was the last time since that the Pac12 got a 6th team? Hence, the twice in five years argument and past coaches is complete and utter nonsense. Third... please go ahead and point out WT's coaching and recruiting acumen. PLEASE. Come on... tell us all the bigs he has developed that exceeded their potential. The above average recruiting classes... next year's is a real doozy so far. How about the family atmosphere that makes young men feel welcome and want to stay and be developed by a teacher of the game. Ok, in-game coaching strategies and management that allows OSU to overcome half time deficits at an above mediocre rate (vs 60 games below .500 or so). Or just how all of the above rolls into being the 39th highest paid D1 coach in the nation. Come on... anyone. But NO. It's always the same fantasy comparisons to the past. So... my two cents... and it has been the same all along... OSU is at a point in support ($2.2 mil and climbing + staff) that they can and should expect more from their money. And, that IF OSU actually wants to be battling for the top 4-5 spots in the Pac12 conference, ON A REGULAR BASIS, Wt is not going to be that guy. I think (6) seasons of bottom tier recruiting (can't wait to hear the same excuses in year 7... as was year 4, year 5, year 6), lack of developing talent, in-game management has clearly shown that. You know the definition of insanity? Well, continued excusing of the above is just that. And, I'm sure an vaunted NIT berth will make several on here very pleased and assure all of us it is a sign of the future. Unfortunately, they'll be right! Even when I agree with you, I don't want to because you're so abrasive with your rebuttals. I tend to agree that most seasons under Wayne are going to be "on the bubble" at best. Of course I would like to be competing for conference titles and NCAA bids. But when you mention we aren't getting our money's worth, if we make a change, we owe Wayne $2M+ for the next three seasons. A new coach is going to cost us $1M at least, and that's if you get a guy operating at a lower level or completely unproven assistant. Now you're devoting even more resources to basketball, and at what point does the new guy have to win to justify that? One tournament berth? Two? Assuming Andy Enfield and Jerod Haase make more than Wayne Tinkle (I think these are both likely), Wayne is 8th in pay in the conference. We're a half game out of 8th in the conference, so I guess I would ask what you think getting our money's worth would be? Abrasiveness is an emotional characteristic the reader provides. Black and white itself does not unless you see words above that are name calling or falsely accusing. Asking for a discussion to focus on actual observable traits rather than comparisons that are impossible to ascertain is direct. Of course reader bias also enters. Once the perception of the "author" is set then the reader will naturally place said emotions to the words. I myself do like several authors, but it doesn't keep me from the acceptance of new material that might conflict with my own beliefs, and sometimes even change how I view the world. But, to each their own!
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 21, 2020 12:13:17 GMT -8
I lived in an earthquake/tsunami area for 14 years. When a big earthquake occurs you walk inland. When a tsunami warning comes out, you make plans and take steps to get out of the way. You don't avoid the coastline all the time because a big earthquake might happen. Finishing 4th last year is not an earthquake. 15 and 11 with a minimum of 5 games left and a fair shot at the NIT is not an earthquake. Thompson isn't even gone, we may find out otherwise in a few weeks but for now it's speculation. If he's gone, Tinkle will still have more starters and more firepower returning next season than he had coming into year one of his tenure (where OSU was picked to finish dead last but finished 7th). Go ahead and live in fear. That deserves the biggest acronym of all... but no, not even worth that. Quakes and WT!? Really? Guess it is better than the constant living in the past to promote the lack of a future. Oh but you really are... really hung up on CR players being worthless, yet keys to the depth that lead to Year 2 success But, you know who was here in year 1, right? So you're saying no ET, no KK, no Tres and next year has more firepower than the first GPII team?? So... apples to apples, as we already know what happened stats/injury wise with the '14-15 guys and do not with next years team... so let's just look at the rosters: GPII Isaiah Johnson (recruit)Victor Robbins LucasCheikh D'iaye ZackMalcolm SilvaLMW DastrupGomis HuntOlaf VernonJarmal HollinsDahlen SMMSanders Tucker Franklin (RS)
This is the roster you are going to plant your flag on? You must see several huge developments for this team to have a change at 7th. And, that is if all of those stay put. Any wager on that? Of course OSU can always fill their roster with the March thru August siness like last summer!? Zach alone is currently scoring 8.1 points a game. Robinson's big scorers who Tinkle inherited- Malcolm, Victor and and Langston - combined for a total of 9 points a game the year before Tinkle was here. We have no proven idea how next year's team will fare next year.
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Post by baseba1111 on Feb 21, 2020 12:21:40 GMT -8
That deserves the biggest acronym of all... but no, not even worth that. Quakes and WT!? Really? Guess it is better than the constant living in the past to promote the lack of a future. Oh but you really are... really hung up on CR players being worthless, yet keys to the depth that lead to Year 2 success But, you know who was here in year 1, right? So you're saying no ET, no KK, no Tres and next year has more firepower than the first GPII team?? So... apples to apples, as we already know what happened stats/injury wise with the '14-15 guys and do not with next years team... so let's just look at the rosters: GPII Isaiah Johnson (recruit)Victor Robbins LucasCheikh D'iaye ZackMalcolm SilvaLMW DastrupGomis HuntOlaf VernonJarmal HollinsDahlen SMMSanders Tucker Franklin (RS)
This is the roster you are going to plant your flag on? You must see several huge developments for this team to have a change at 7th. And, that is if all of those stay put. Any wager on that? Of course OSU can always fill their roster with the March thru August siness like last summer!? Zach alone is currently scoring 8.1 points a game. Robinson's big scorers who Tinkle inherited- Malcolm, Victor and and Langston - combined for a total of 9 points a game the year before Tinkle was here. We have no proven idea how next year's team will fare next year. And GPII did more than the rest of that lineup combined... in all phases of the game.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 21, 2020 12:26:04 GMT -8
Zach alone is currently scoring 8.1 points a game. Robinson's big scorers who Tinkle inherited- Malcolm, Victor and and Langston - combined for a total of 9 points a game the year before Tinkle was here. We have no proven idea how next year's team will fare next year. And GPII did more than the rest of that lineup combined... in all phases of the game. GP2 was a great player, but he never played a minute under Robinson and he and 3 Tinkle recruited freshmen dominated the stats of the NCAA tournament bound team in year 2.
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Post by baseba1111 on Feb 21, 2020 12:36:33 GMT -8
That deserves the biggest acronym of all... but no, not even worth that. Quakes and WT!? Really? Guess it is better than the constant living in the past to promote the lack of a future. Oh but you really are... really hung up on CR players being worthless, yet keys to the depth that lead to Year 2 success But, you know who was here in year 1, right? So you're saying no ET, no KK, no Tres and next year has more firepower than the first GPII team?? So... apples to apples, as we already know what happened stats/injury wise with the '14-15 guys and do not with next years team... so let's just look at the rosters: GPII Isaiah Johnson (recruit)Victor Robbins LucasCheikh D'iaye ZackMalcolm SilvaLMW DastrupGomis HuntOlaf VernonJarmal HollinsDahlen SMMSanders Tucker Franklin (RS)
This is the roster you are going to plant your flag on? You must see several huge developments for this team to have a change at 7th. And, that is if all of those stay put. Any wager on that? Of course OSU can always fill their roster with the March thru August siness like last summer!? Zach alone is currently scoring 8.1 points a game. Robinson's big scorers who Tinkle inherited- Malcolm, Victor and and Langston - combined for a total of 9 points a game the year before Tinkle was here. We have no proven idea how next year's team will fare next year. Wait... your statement was WT's first roster... included GPII... was not as good/less firepower as what WT has returning next year! That's completely and utterly false unless you think someone on that list will match GPII's production? Your premise being... I guess... let's wait and see what WT does with this roster because it is better than '14-15 roster that finished higher than predicted??? And, you do know predictions are just that, and mean nothing as no one knew how good GPII would be and an actual finish depends on the state of the league as a whole and injuries to other teams etc. Your initial point is false. I'm pretty confident 99% of the folks who know hoops take Year 1 roster over Year 7 roster. And, the revisionist history of predictions and finishes don't really matter in today's Pac12. I hope WT hires you during his next job search.
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Post by Werebeaver on Feb 21, 2020 12:59:39 GMT -8
Wonder if some of you managed salespeople if you would say something like "well salesman you didn't get the sale but you tried hard and that's what really counts" You wouldn't be a sales manager for long. Thats what got Wells Fargo in deep sh!t.
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 21, 2020 13:44:10 GMT -8
Zach alone is currently scoring 8.1 points a game. Robinson's big scorers who Tinkle inherited- Malcolm, Victor and and Langston - combined for a total of 9 points a game the year before Tinkle was here. We have no proven idea how next year's team will fare next year. Wait... your statement was WT's first roster... included GPII... was not as good/less firepower as what WT has returning next year! That's completely and utterly false unless you think someone on that list will match GPII's production? Your premise being... I guess... let's wait and see what WT does with this roster because it is better than '14-15 roster that finished higher than predicted??? And, you do know predictions are just that, and mean nothing as no one knew how good GPII would be and an actual finish depends on the state of the league as a whole and injuries to other teams etc. Your initial point is false. I'm pretty confident 99% of the folks who know hoops take Year 1 roster over Year 7 roster. And, the revisionist history of predictions and finishes don't really matter in today's Pac12. I hope WT hires you during his next job search. My point is we don't know what we have for year 7 yet. I'm not keen on what I know right now, but next season is next season, and what's left now is far more experienced than what we had then. BTW, you left Ethan off the list of players for next year. Is it a lock that he's gone? Has he been planning to transfer? Do you have inside information or is this just some rumor from here that your are perpetuating?
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Post by tnarg33 on Feb 21, 2020 14:00:54 GMT -8
Should OSU make the NIT as you say.. who was the last OSU coach before Tinkle to achieve an NCAA and NIT berth in a 5 season span?.. He's OSU's 6th? coach since 1990 and now many times did OSU make either one of those tournaments before he got here? Seems to me that is better than any OSU coach has done since Miller was here I know you'll probably say im accepting mediocrity... or that im giving him to much credit based on the bad past before him..Im sure you'll bring up the 20+ games below .500 in PAC 12 play or that the only reason OSU won 10 conference games last season was because the league was down.. or the only reason OSU made the NCAA in 2016 was all because of GPII... Doesn't he get any credit for his coaching at all?.. to read what the posters on here post you'd think his entire tenure to date has been a train wreck of nothing but 5-27 season's Any way thats my 2 cents.. First... my critiques are based on getting past "mediocrity". IMHO WT is not the guy to take OSU any further. He had to have an extremely special player that was already being recruited fall into his lap, and have two highly talented sons that were automatic recruits to land in ONE NCAA tourney. He then could not turn that success into any decent recruiting years... could not develop the talent recruited and frustrated 11 of the 20 into leaving (although one was academic, but was leaving anyone according to sources in the AD). Second... as for the past... when can wT supporters figure out using past failures to support the current regime is the weakest argument possible. What happened with other coaches has zero to do with the current state of the program. Teams, players, schedules, selection processes are all different. What I love is the cherry picking. NCAA tourney team may not have been selected any year after that... when was the last time since that the Pac12 got a 6th team? Hence, the twice in five years argument and past coaches is complete and utter nonsense. Third... please go ahead and point out WT's coaching and recruiting acumen. PLEASE. Come on... tell us all the bigs he has developed that exceeded their potential. The above average recruiting classes... next year's is a real doozy so far. How about the family atmosphere that makes young men feel welcome and want to stay and be developed by a teacher of the game. Ok, in-game coaching strategies and management that allows OSU to overcome half time deficits at an above mediocre rate (vs 60 games below .500 or so). Or just how all of the above rolls into being the 39th highest paid D1 coach in the nation. Come on... anyone. But NO. It's always the same fantasy comparisons to the past. So... my two cents... and it has been the same all along... OSU is at a point in support ($2.2 mil and climbing + staff) that they can and should expect more from their money. And, that IF OSU actually wants to be battling for the top 4-5 spots in the Pac12 conference, ON A REGULAR BASIS, Wt is not going to be that guy. I think (6) seasons of bottom tier recruiting (can't wait to hear the same excuses in year 7... as was year 4, year 5, year 6), lack of developing talent, in-game management has clearly shown that. You know the definition of insanity? Well, continued excusing of the above is just that. And, I'm sure an vaunted NIT berth will make several on here very pleased and assure all of us it is a sign of the future. Unfortunately, they'll be right! But just to be clear, you're not saying he should be fired correct?
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