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Post by grackle on Jul 2, 2018 7:40:09 GMT -8
Biggest 2018 PAC12 flameout? Boy howdy...that's easy. Drumroll.......why it's STANFORD of course!!
The Cardinal (along with that other mega-underachiever Florida) were the media's darling all year. D1baseball loved 'em, ESPN loved 'em, etc., etc. And mustering up all its usual glorious, aggressive ignorance, the NCAA selection committee even made 'em the #2 seed nationally. But why? Yes, Stan did officially win the PAC, but good grief they sure couldn't beat the better teams in our conference-- they were a combined 3 wins vs. 6 losses against UCLA, OSU and UW. They took the PAC title by womping up on bottom feeders like Utah and WSU.
Based on that in-league performance, no one should have been surprised when they flopped in their own regional against a good, but not superior Cal State Fullerton squad. So, with the undeniable talent they had, why wasn't the Cardinal more of a juggernaut? Also, we all know that the NCAA, ESPN, other media are biased toward the SEC. But, at least IMO, for some reason the Cardinal also receive similar favorable treatment from the media and the NCAA. But why?
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Post by kersting13 on Jul 2, 2018 7:52:29 GMT -8
Biggest 2018 PAC12 flameout? Boy howdy...that's easy. Drumroll.......why it's STANFORD of course!! The Cardinal (along with that other mega-underachiever Florida) were the media's darling all year. D1baseball loved 'em, ESPN loved 'em, etc., etc. And mustering up all its usual glorious, aggressive ignorance, the NCAA selection committee even made 'em the #2 seed nationally. But why? Yes, Stan did officially win the PAC, but good grief they sure couldn't beat the better teams in our conference-- they were a combined 3 wins vs. 6 losses against UCLA, OSU and UW. They took the PAC title by womping up on bottom feeders like Utah and WSU. Based on that in-league performance, no one should have been surprised when they flopped in their own regional against a good, but not superior Cal State Fullerton squad. So, with the undeniable talent they had, why wasn't the Cardinal more of a juggernaut? Also, we all know that the NCAA, ESPN, other media are biased toward the SEC. But, al least IMO, for some reason the Cardinal also receive similar favorable treatment from the media and the NCAA. But why? Stanford often has at least one REALLY tough OOC series that they usually win that boosts their RPI pretty well. That's all I got for you. If you want to know MY pick for the most perennially over-rated team in the nation - it's Florida State. They ALWAYS fold if they get to Omaha, but this year they flamed out early in their own regional. |
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Post by ochobeavo on Jul 2, 2018 8:15:08 GMT -8
Still amazes me that ASU has gone 23-32 each of the past two seasons.
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Post by grackle on Jul 2, 2018 8:21:48 GMT -8
Still amazes me that ASU has gone 23-32 each of the past two seasons. Still amazes me that the Trojans have become such a chronic non-factor in the PAC. Seems almost impossible with all their built-in advantages in SoCal. I'm also vaguely amazed that even with all of Unca Phil's millions of $$$, the $chmUcks still $tink. Maybe it's true ...$$$ can't happiness (not all the time, anyway). |
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Post by Werebeaver on Jul 2, 2018 8:25:03 GMT -8
Still amazes me that ASU has gone 23-32 each of the past two seasons. Still amazes me that the Trojans have become such a chronic non-factor in the PAC. Seems almost impossible with all their built-in advantages in SoCal. I'm also vaguely amazed that even with all of Unca Phil's millions of $$$, the $chmUcks still $tink. Maybe it's true ...$$$ can't happiness (not all the time, anyway). I can't believe they extended Jelly Roll Horton's contract for another season. |
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Post by bennyskid on Jul 2, 2018 8:29:59 GMT -8
Of course the media loves Stanford. It's the only Ivy League-quality school with serious athletic chops. (23 straight Directors Cups! 117 National Championships!) Stanford reps the Pac really well, overall. I'll forgive them an occasional face-plant.
It's the bottom half of the conference that costs our conference. Even the biggest SEC honks admit that the top of the Pac is a match for the top of the SEC. But the bottom half of the Pac stunk this (and most) years, while the bottom half of the SEC is still pretty good.
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Post by shelby on Jul 2, 2018 9:17:57 GMT -8
I am just impressed by Casey’s approach to all things baseball... when he get’s buy in, not even with number 1 athletes, but with guys that they hand pick to slot into a winning system.
I know they lose a lot from this year’s team, however, I am pretty sure that his guys will overachieve again.
You just do not see the same attention to detail that permeates Casey’s program and staff.
You see small ball, power ball and all variations in between - but Pat has his guys schooled for success based on their individual strengths and team dynamics. That means that every guy in the lineup, and on the bench is a positive contributor at any point during the season and during a game. The perfect example was beating the field in Corvallis and Omaha, and they did it in Omaha without Kwan, and with Madrigal and Heinrich and Fehmel having an uncharacteristic run of bad luck.
So fun to watch...
Go Beavers !
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Post by beaverstever on Jul 2, 2018 10:20:36 GMT -8
I am just impressed by Casey’s approach to all things baseball... when he get’s buy in, not even with number 1 athletes, but with guys that they hand pick to slot into a winning system. I know they lose a lot from this year’s team, however, I am pretty sure that his guys will overachieve again. You just do not see the same attention to detail that permeates Casey’s program and staff. You see small ball, power ball and all variations in between - but Pat has his guys schooled for success based on their individual strengths and team dynamics. That means that every guy in the lineup, and on the bench is a positive contributor at any point during the season and during a game. The perfect example was beating the field in Corvallis and Omaha, and they did it in Omaha without Kwan, and with Madrigal and Heinrich and Fehmel having an uncharacteristic run of bad luck. So fun to watch... Go Beavers ! Agree with what you say, except the 'overachieve again' part. The talking heads at Omaha were pretty consistent in saying that only Florida matched up with OSU on a talent level, and the draft reflected that. Finishing in the top 4 the last two years was pretty much 'achieving', given the talent level. And I say that not meaning to take anything away from Casey's coaching, I'm just pointing out he's not winning with players playing over their heads. At this point, he's winning with serious MLB talent that wants to visit Omaha via Corvallis in route to the bigs. |
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Post by bennyskid on Jul 2, 2018 10:31:12 GMT -8
. . . but how much of that talent is really due to great player development? Nick was a known quantity coming in, but were all these guys such hot prospects. Has anyone done a recruiting analysis for baseball like we do for football and basketball every few hours?
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Post by Tigardbeav on Jul 2, 2018 11:09:30 GMT -8
Still amazes me that ASU has gone 23-32 each of the past two seasons. and hasn't fired Tracy Smith yet at some point the Conference needs ASU, USC & UA to be challenging chasing OS for more teams to get in the playoffs. Outsiders see them as pack fill and judge the conference as "down" |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2018 11:11:06 GMT -8
. . . but how much of that talent is really due to great player development? Nick was a known quantity coming in, but were all these guys such hot prospects. Has anyone done a recruiting analysis for baseball like we do for football and basketball every few hours? you mean the wildly inaccurate and self-fulfilling star allocation based on which schools have offered scholarships? That one? Better luck just taking Pat Casey's word for it. If he invites you to corvallis it's because you are pretty good. |
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Post by messi on Jul 2, 2018 11:12:45 GMT -8
Still amazes me that the Trojans have become such a chronic non-factor in the PAC. Seems almost impossible with all their built-in advantages in SoCal. I'm also vaguely amazed that even with all of Unca Phil's millions of $$$, the $chmUcks still $tink. Maybe it's true ...$$$ can't happiness (not all the time, anyway). I can't believe they extended Jelly Roll Horton's contract for another season. I'm betting that Horton is waiting for the SC job to open up, and will bail immediately. |
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Post by kersting13 on Jul 2, 2018 11:35:21 GMT -8
I can't believe they extended Jelly Roll Horton's contract for another season. I'm betting that Horton is waiting for the SC job to open up, and will bail immediately. The question will be whether George will have lost all of his cachet before that happens? |
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Post by shelby on Jul 2, 2018 12:37:29 GMT -8
I am just impressed by Casey’s approach to all things baseball... when he get’s buy in, not even with number 1 athletes, but with guys that they hand pick to slot into a winning system. I know they lose a lot from this year’s team, however, I am pretty sure that his guys will overachieve again. You just do not see the same attention to detail that permeates Casey’s program and staff. You see small ball, power ball and all variations in between - but Pat has his guys schooled for success based on their individual strengths and team dynamics. That means that every guy in the lineup, and on the bench is a positive contributor at any point during the season and during a game. The perfect example was beating the field in Corvallis and Omaha, and they did it in Omaha without Kwan, and with Madrigal and Heinrich and Fehmel having an uncharacteristic run of bad luck. So fun to watch... Go Beavers ! Agree with what you say, except the 'overachieve again' part. The talking heads at Omaha were pretty consistent in saying that only Florida matched up with OSU on a talent level, and the draft reflected that. Finishing in the top 4 the last two years was pretty much 'achieving', given the talent level. And I say that not meaning to take anything away from Casey's coaching, I'm just pointing out he's not winning with players playing over their heads. At this point, he's winning with serious MLB talent that wants to visit Omaha via Corvallis in route to the bigs. Maybe not clear , what I was referring to was incoming Class next year. Yes, they all look good to great on paper, but many of them struggle early in the season and it is Casey, Bailey and Yeskie that are ' turning them on' both physically and mentally. i look at a guy like Gretler and see how much he contributed, same with Jack Anderson and Zack Taylor and the like. These guys not only contributed, they did so when it was crunch time. |
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Post by rainmanrich on Jul 2, 2018 12:48:09 GMT -8
. . . but how much of that talent is really due to great player development? Nick was a known quantity coming in, but were all these guys such hot prospects. Has anyone done a recruiting analysis for baseball like we do for football and basketball every few hours? To give us some perspective on that consider the following recruiting class rankings (from Perfect Game: link ) CLASS RANK SOME PLAYERS IN CLASS2015 26 Madrigal, Grenier, Larnach, Kwan, Femel...2016 19 Eisert, Gambrell, Rutch...2017 44 Abel, Claunch, Foster....
Based on the strength of the recruiting class it doesn't appear the Beavs should have done more than get a chance to play in the post season. Instead they became one of the most dominate teams of the last two decades. Of course there are many factors but my take from this data indicates a very strong correlation between "great player development" and the success of Oregon State Baseball.
FWIW - TSDR recruiting class ranks were (2015-2017): 14,21, and 56. They are similar to OSU, but the results were drastically different. You can draw your own conclusions.
P.S. If you go to the Perfect Game link, check out some of the teams in the top-10 for 2015-2017. You may recognize some of them. I didn't do one, but an analysis of the top 10 for each year might indicate a strong correlation between recruiting and success, more so than great player development and success. |
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