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Post by ag87 on Feb 2, 2024 12:44:26 GMT -8
I found an interesting list in Ken Pom's site. He rates basketball programs from when he started compiling data in 1997. He gives more weight to recent years and more weight to "best seasons" as opposed to an average. He also says he gives 15% weight to conference affiliation. His example is if somehow the PAC invited Cal State Fullerton, Fullerton would have a better program. Anyway, the top-10 Duke Kentucky Kansas North Carolina Michigan State Gonzaga Arizona Villanova Ohio State Connecticut Now others - 11 - UCLA; 21 - Oregon; 33 - USC; 36 - Stanford; 57 - Utah; 58 - Washington; 65 - Colorado; 66 - Arizona State; 68 - San Diego State; 71 - St. Marys; 78 - Utah State; 79 - California; 84 - UNLV; 87 - New Mexico; 88 - Nevada; 89 - Washington State; 91 - Boise State; 100 - Colorado State; 104 - Oregon State, 106 - New Mexico State; 110 - Fresno State; 116 - San Francisco; 122 - Wyoming; 136 - Santa Clara; 140 - Pacific; 146 - UC Santa Barbara; 148 - Hawaii; 149 UC Irvine; 152 Grand Canyon; 153 San Diego; 159 Pepperdine; 163 Air Force; 167 Montana; 173 Weber State; 182 Long Beach; 187 Loyola Marymount; 192 Eastern Washington; 196 Portland; 198 Utah Valley; 212 Fullerton; 237 Portland State. It looks like 309 Sacramento State is the worst in the Pacific Time Zone. 297 Idaho State is the worst in Mountain Time. The lowest to have a title is 25 Syracuse. The lowest to have a Final Four is 124 Loyola Chicago. They are also the lowest to have a season-ending top 10 in his rankings. Oops, I'm wrong. Florida Atlantic is at 210 and they have a Final Four. FAU did go up 38 spots this year. At the bottom are 359, 360 and 361 - Maryland Eastern Shore, Arkansas Pine Bluff and Lindenwood. kenpom.com/programs.php |
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Post by fridaynightlights on Feb 3, 2024 3:23:35 GMT -8
Interesting. Here is a stat that says a lot about Oregon State men's basketball the past 3 plus decades. One winning season in conference in the past 33 seasons.
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Post by lebaneaver on Feb 3, 2024 17:12:01 GMT -8
It’s VERY evident that men’s basketball at OSU just IS NOT important, institutionally, or to any VITAL/OTHER important entity.
Can’t argue otherwise with a straight face.
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Post by rgeorge on Feb 3, 2024 17:34:46 GMT -8
It’s VERY evident that men’s basketball at OSU just IS NOT important, institutionally, or to any VITAL/OTHER important entity. Can’t argue otherwise with a straight face. Sort if chicken/egg thing. Plus one can't really compare eras. But, I'm guessing Ralph's program was severely under funded too. Winning begets importance. Importance/priority "may" beget winning?? In today's world the internet, portal, NIL makes recruiting, and keeping players far more difficult. But, is OSU in today's climate ever going to be elite on a regular basis? OSU will never be able to keep up with the Jones' so $ need to go where they make the most sense. That said, should OSU expect to be one of the top 68 teams more than 20% of the time? If so, is WT at his salary that guy after 10 years of evidence? And, if one thinks he is, do they think crowds/money ever flow back after seeing these 10 years? Sometimes a program needs to be reset to just get a fresh beginning. |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 3, 2024 18:00:13 GMT -8
It’s VERY evident that men’s basketball at OSU just IS NOT important, institutionally, or to any VITAL/OTHER important entity. Can’t argue otherwise with a straight face. Sort if chicken/egg thing. Plus one can't really compare eras. But, I'm guessing Ralph's program was severely under funded too. Winning begets importance. Importance/priority "may" beget winning?? In today's world the internet, portal, NIL makes recruiting, and keeping players far more difficult. But, is OSU in today's climate ever going to be elite on a regular basis? OSU will never be able to keep up with the Jones' so $ need to go where they make the most sense. That said, should OSU expect to be one of the top 68 teams more than 20% of the time? If so, is WT at his salary that guy after 10 years of evidence? And, if one thinks he is, do they think crowds/money ever flow back after seeing these 10 years? Sometimes a program needs to be reset to just get a fresh beginning. Ralph's era was a different era. In 1988 John Calipari was hired for a whopping 63,000 bucks a year. OSU had a big chunk if a season vacated for a judicial call on a player's eligibility, and another whole one for players selling their shoes. The money disparity, except for about 2 Pac 8 schools and several schools back east, really wasn't a huge issue until the very end of Ralph's tenure or after. Now it's pervasive. Why should OSU expect to get in the top 68 teams 20% of the time if they are in the bottom 2 teams in funding in their league 100% of the time??? It would seem to me if the NCAA is only taking 2-5 teams from the Pac into the tournament, your team should fund to that level at least some of the time. As it is, he's acachieved the tournament 20% of the time (including this year , assuming it doesn't happen) vs OSU'S previous 0.0% of the time for 23-24 years prior to his arrival. |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Feb 3, 2024 18:12:39 GMT -8
Sort if chicken/egg thing. Plus one can't really compare eras. But, I'm guessing Ralph's program was severely under funded too. Winning begets importance. Importance/priority "may" beget winning?? In today's world the internet, portal, NIL makes recruiting, and keeping players far more difficult. But, is OSU in today's climate ever going to be elite on a regular basis? OSU will never be able to keep up with the Jones' so $ need to go where they make the most sense. That said, should OSU expect to be one of the top 68 teams more than 20% of the time? If so, is WT at his salary that guy after 10 years of evidence? And, if one thinks he is, do they think crowds/money ever flow back after seeing these 10 years? Sometimes a program needs to be reset to just get a fresh beginning. Ralph's era was a different era. In 1988 John Calipari was hired for a whopping 63,000 bucks a year. OSU had a big chunk if a season vacated for a judicial call on a player's eligibility, and another whole one for players selling their shoes. The money disparity, except for about 2 Pac 8 schools and several schools back east really wasn't a huge issue until the very end of Ralph's tenure or after. Now it's pervasive. Why should OSU expect to get in the top 68 teams 20% of the time if they are in the bottom 2 teams in funding in their league 100% of the time??? It would seem to me if the NCAA is only taking 2-5 teams from the Pac into the tournament, your team should fund to that level at least some of the time. As it is, he's acachieved the tournament 20% of the time (including this year , assuming it doesn't happen) vs OSU'S previous 0.0% of the time for 23-24 years prior to his arrival. 20% is stupid overachieving for Oregon State's support of basketball. Anyone expecting more than 20% over the last decade is delusional. The support has just not been there. The highs have been great, well above any reasonable expectation. That said, I am curious how things look next year. Almost all of the discussions are looking backward rather than looking forward to the West Coast Conference. No one is talking about it, but it seems like it will be the reality come July. |
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zzufrevaeb
Sophomore
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hi
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Post by zzufrevaeb on Feb 3, 2024 18:13:42 GMT -8
WCC is licking their chops for an automatic win or two from OSU and most likely WSU.
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Post by rgeorge on Feb 3, 2024 18:18:26 GMT -8
Delusion is thinking OSU can't do better. It is amazing that the mbb "deniers" are the only ones crying "it can't be done". Every other fan base would want better, demand better.
As the set of rankings show OSU mbb ranks below many with ADs in a lower "tax bracket".
You wonder if these folks tell their kids that they're is nothing but mediocrity unless you have money?!
🙄
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zzufrevaeb
Sophomore
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hi
Posts: 1,500
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Post by zzufrevaeb on Feb 3, 2024 18:28:03 GMT -8
Quality coaching, determination, hustle, and teamwork can carry teams quite far in the season. OSU suffers from a lack of half of those, you choose which one's you see fit.
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Post by rgeorge on Feb 3, 2024 18:30:44 GMT -8
Quality coaching, determination, hustle, and teamwork can carry teams quite far in the season. OSU suffers from a lack of half of those, you choose which one's you see fit. Funny some seem to think OSU has been screwed out of at least one, maybe two berths depending on their Covid extrapolated views. That'd be 30% or 40% in the Top 68. But, more than 20% is delusional? 🤣 |
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Post by wilkyisdashiznit on Feb 3, 2024 18:46:17 GMT -8
Quality coaching, determination, hustle, and teamwork can carry teams quite far in the season. OSU suffers from a lack of half of those, you choose which one's you see fit. Funny some seem to think OSU has been screwed out of at least one, maybe two berths depending on their Covid extrapolated views. That'd be 30% or 40% in the Top 68. But, more than 20% is delusional? 🤣 Reading comprehension? To expect more than 20% is delusional. To actually hit 30% or 40%? Those numbers with current funding in the Pac-12? That is hitting well above your weight. |
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Post by rgeorge on Feb 3, 2024 18:49:05 GMT -8
Funny some seem to think OSU has been screwed out of at least one, maybe two berths depending on their Covid extrapolated views. That'd be 30% or 40% in the Top 68. But, more than 20% is delusional? 🤣 Reading comprehension? To expect more than 20% is delusional. To actually hit 30% or 40%? Those numbers with current funding in the Pac-12? That is hitting well above your weight. Mental acuity? |
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Post by drunkandstoopidbeav on Feb 3, 2024 23:50:09 GMT -8
Delusion is thinking OSU can't do better. It is amazing that the mbb "deniers" are the only ones crying "it can't be done". Every other fan base would want better, demand better. As the set of rankings show OSU mbb ranks below many with ADs in a lower "tax bracket". You wonder if these folks tell their kids that they're is nothing but mediocrity unless you have money?! 🙄 I would be telling my kid there is a huge difference between what you can achieve in your junior and senior years than in your freshman and sophomore years.... the future is ahead of you as you improve. Some deluded individuals think kids peak at 18/19/20 years of age. |
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Post by spudbeaver on Feb 4, 2024 10:05:47 GMT -8
WCC is licking their chops for an automatic win or two from OSU and most likely WSU. We suck, but don’t lump the Cougars in with us. They’re on the opposite end of the standings from us! |
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zzufrevaeb
Sophomore
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hi
Posts: 1,500
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Post by zzufrevaeb on Feb 4, 2024 10:44:32 GMT -8
WCC is licking their chops for an automatic win or two from OSU and most likely WSU. We suck, but don’t lump the Cougars in with us. They’re on the opposite end of the standings from us! Gonzaga, St Mary's, and even Santa Clara are licking their chops. |
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